WI Edmund of Rutland survived?

In OTL, Edmund of Rutland was with his father at the Battle of Wakefield, and like Richard of York, was slain in - or shortly after - said battle.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edmund,_Earl_of_Rutland

What if Edmund had been with his brother Edward, Earl of March (later Edward IV), and so avoided his fate? This might be employing too big a butterfly net, but if Edward later takes the throne as in OTL, how would a surviving Edmund affect things?

Is much known about his personality? I know he was only seventeen at the time he died, but is he likely to act like Clarence, or Gloucester*? If butterflies don't affect the lifestyle of Edward too much, and he dies on schedule, what then? TTL, you have Edmund, Richard and the Woodevilles as three potential focal points in the kingdom. Is is useful to speculate on what might happen, or is Edmund too much of a blank page to come to any real answers?

Any and all answers would be appreciated.


*By this, I mean loyal to his brother the king, as opposed to what happened after.
 
I am a few pages into planning this as a TL, with a POD of Edmund escaping from the battle of Wakefield and meeting up with his brother. This doesnt butterfly away Edward being crowned and I had Towton occur in a very similar manner as OTL due to Edmund being left in London as the heir (although the Earl of Northumberland survived the battle giving the Lancastrians a foothold in the north to launch an earlier counterstrike against the Yorkist regime) . After Edward's victories the butterflies really begin with Edmund being granted certain grants which were given to Warwick IOTL and ultimately this will see no Woodville marriage and a bloodier 1460's. Also Lord Hastings will be slightly less important as I have assumed a healthy relationship between Edmund and Edward which negates some of Hastings influence.

Back to the OP, this changes alot as without his position as heir, Clarence's potential involvement in Warwicks potential schemes in the late 1460's takes a different shape.

Again depending on butterflies and whether Edmund marries, having a potentially trusted brother of the king unwed in the 1480s would open possibilites of marriages to the heiress of either Burgundy or Brittany (although this could well just be my desire to see Edward IV hit back at Louis XI :p )
 
I'm not sure what would happen with this POD, there is so little known about Edmund other than he does at Wakefield. Edward would be very interested to marry Edmund to Burgundy or Brittany if he could but this is dependent on whether Edmund married an English girl. Its a very interesting idea.
 
I am a few pages into planning this as a TL, with a POD of Edmund escaping from the battle of Wakefield and meeting up with his brother. This doesnt butterfly away Edward being crowned and I had Towton occur in a very similar manner as OTL due to Edmund being left in London as the heir (although the Earl of Northumberland survived the battle giving the Lancastrians a foothold in the north to launch an earlier counterstrike against the Yorkist regime) . After Edward's victories the butterflies really begin with Edmund being granted certain grants which were given to Warwick IOTL and ultimately this will see no Woodville marriage and a bloodier 1460's. Also Lord Hastings will be slightly less important as I have assumed a healthy relationship between Edmund and Edward which negates some of Hastings influence.

Back to the OP, this changes alot as without his position as heir, Clarence's potential involvement in Warwicks potential schemes in the late 1460's takes a different shape.

Again depending on butterflies and whether Edmund marries, having a potentially trusted brother of the king unwed in the 1480s would open possibilites of marriages to the heiress of either Burgundy or Brittany (although this could well just be my desire to see Edward IV hit back at Louis XI :p )

Cool. I had some very vague ideas about turning it into a TL, but would need to do an awful lot of research first. I don't really know enough about the primary movers and shakers (Warwick, Rivers, Hastings et al.) to see how things would change. My vague ideas about Edmund and Richard being co-regents for their beloved royal nephew Edward (and thus keeping each other honest) are probably so easy to destroy in the butterflies that they remain such. I like the idea of Edward sending one of his brothers out to Brittany. As long as Edmund isn't another Clarence, things should be okay...
 
I'm not sure what would happen with this POD, there is so little known about Edmund other than he does at Wakefield.

I totally agree, although for some reason I always thought of Edmund as being more pious (like his mother) and rather more straightlaced (like his father) than his brother Edward but IIRC the two were brought up together and I assume they would be on fairly good terms. Warwick would be an interesting wildcard in this scenario, although his daughters marriages to Clarence and Gloucester maybe easier to achieve if George isnt next in line?
 
From what I understand while Richard Duke of York was still alive and in the early stages of his disagreement with the House of Lancaster, Edward and Edmund were sent to Ludlow castle while their younger siblings (including George and Richard) stayed with their mother. I believe there's even a charming letter written by the boys to their father and complain about the strictness of their school master or something to the effect.
It's very speculative, but the suggestion is that the boys were close being separated from the rest of their family so early on. I wonder if Edward the preferred the older widows as a way of dealing with the pain of losing his father and brother and suddenly becoming the head of York. I also wonder if Edmund was close enough to be able to stop Edward from marrying Elizabeth Woodville if he knew of it.

If Edmund lives, George is never the heir to the throne. I wonder if that would keep him from acting out?
 
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What little we know of Edmund doesn't exactly promise very much on influencing his brother, but he died so young that it's impossible to claim that with certainty.

And George might still resent being seen as the irresponsible younger sibling, which seems to be how Edward saw him OTL (and frankly, how he was OTL).
 
I agree about George still causing trouble for Edward, but I think the dynamic would be different if he isn't the heir to the throne. I doubt if Warwick would be as keen to marry his daughter to him in hopes of George and Isabella being crowned King and Queen with Warwick's support. George can still cause trouble but he's less of a threat when he's never heir to the throne.
 
I doubt if Warwick would be as keen to marry his daughter to him in hopes of George and Isabella being crowned King and Queen with Warwick's support.

I still think Warwick would be interested in the match. A royal marriage for his heiress would still be a more prestigous match than almost any other he could manage for Isabel. Edward IV may even be more supportive ITTL as it removes the need to give George vast amounts of royal land, as he will inherit half of Warwicks land so Edward would only need to suppliment this and due to Edmund's presence obviously it lacks the threat it otherwise could have.
 
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