WI: East Asians are considered "white"

The early Portuguese supposedly considered the Chinese to be as 'white as Germans.' As the concept of a European and white race developed in the Early Modern era, East Asians were relegated to 'yellow,' even though, objectively, most East Asians' skin color would not be out of place in central or southern Europe.

What if Europeans considered East Asians to have 'white' skin color, rather than 'yellow'? Would there be more of a focus on the epicanthic fold?
 
The early Portuguese supposedly considered the Chinese to be as 'white as Germans.' As the concept of a European and white race developed in the Early Modern era, East Asians were relegated to 'yellow,' even though, objectively, most East Asians' skin color would not be out of place in central or southern Europe.

What if Europeans considered East Asians to have 'white' skin color, rather than 'yellow'? Would there be more of a focus on the epicanthic fold?

May be theoretically possible, but it would almost certainly require a far reaching POD. Assuming this has the goal of more egalitarian attitudes towards the people of this area, it really would be much easier just to find ways to make the idea of "whiteness" less important in the West post 1800 or so.
 
Not the way Scientific Racism works. They considered the Celts, Irish or Welsh especially, but anyone who spoke a Celtic tongue and followed Celtic culture to be ape-like and dark in appearance. Mediterranean Europeans weren't considered to be true whites, rather mongrelized due to their proximity to North Africa/Middle East/Iran. Same for East and South Europeans due to the Mongol/Moor invasions and. The Sami were subject to a lot experiments for looking different. Now the Japanese,Europeans and Taiwanese were considered Honorary Whites by South Africans and the Nazis considered Chinese and Japanese Honorary Aryans. In America, certain groups of Poor Whites were singled out as degenerate,deficient,worthless parasites by the Eugenicists who broke up families and forcibly sterilized women and girls some of whom were unaware of what had happened. So even if East Asians were considered white, they would still be considered an 'inferior white' since they weren't of Northwest European heritage.
 
The best way to get there while maintaining the basic idea of race in its OTL form will be to have China and Japan remain politically cohesive and become technologically advanced. Until the late 18th century, China was mainly held up as an example of virtuous and wise government (to the extent european intellectuals cared about it at all). That changed around the time the definition of 'race' consolidated. If the Chinese still had a positive repoutation, the definers of racism might well have chosen to class them as 'white' (though presumably in much the same way Russians, Poles and Hungarians were thought of as white - not quite the same thing, but close enough)

Racism was never rigorous in the scientific sense, its definitions shifted with political expediency and public perception. The status of East asians is in many ways the easiest to move because it was the position everyone was least invested in (the primary purpose was always to define the hierarchy between Europeans and their colonial subjects and slaves. The Chinese are neither)
 
Well actually iin the second half of the XIXth century they weren't considered inferior as a race by some Europeans.
Mouhot's travel journey in Cambodia in 1866 is fairly explicit about this.
A race that built Angkor Wat and the like cannot be inferior by essence.
However he says that they let themselves go basically, becoming lazy.

But that's a major nuance. If educated properly, there's nothing holding them back from being the equals of white epeople
 
Japanese were not considered Asian except during World War two they were considered as well as certain others in post war years honorary whites
 
The best way to get there while maintaining the basic idea of race in its OTL form will be to have China and Japan remain politically cohesive and become technologically advanced. Until the late 18th century, China was mainly held up as an example of virtuous and wise government (to the extent european intellectuals cared about it at all). That changed around the time the definition of 'race' consolidated. If the Chinese still had a positive repoutation, the definers of racism might well have chosen to class them as 'white' (though presumably in much the same way Russians, Poles and Hungarians were thought of as white - not quite the same thing, but close enough)

Racism was never rigorous in the scientific sense, its definitions shifted with political expediency and public perception. The status of East asians is in many ways the easiest to move because it was the position everyone was least invested in (the primary purpose was always to define the hierarchy between Europeans and their colonial subjects and slaves. The Chinese are neither)
Yep.During the Apartheid period in South Africa,East Asians were given the status of Honorary Whites due to diplomatic ties with various East Asian countries.
 
The early Portuguese supposedly considered the Chinese to be as 'white as Germans.' As the concept of a European and white race developed in the Early Modern era, East Asians were relegated to 'yellow,' even though, objectively, most East Asians' skin color would not be out of place in central or southern Europe.

What if Europeans considered East Asians to have 'white' skin color, rather than 'yellow'? Would there be more of a focus on the epicanthic fold?


Basically OTL in Japan, where the Japanese were considered to be basically European in status and social structure. If China stays more cohesive, then China and Japan could be conditionally white like Russia was.
 
You're largely projecting modern classifications back centuries.

Back then the predominant splits were Christian/Islamic/other, skin colour wasn't terribly important early on. The Portuguese dealt (initially) with the Anglolan 'Kongo' on terms approximating equality, iirc; and the Spanish were far more worried about 'purity of blood' and Spanishness (i.e. Castillianity) than skin colour. Indios got treated like dirt in the colonies, sure, but Criollos (pure blooded Spanish born in the colonies) were very definitely second class citizens compared to the Peninsulares.

Besides, Japanese and northern Chinese are whiter in actual skin colour than most of the Portuguese or Spanish (especially ones who'd been exposed to the tropical sun for that long voyage).
Thirdly, if the Spanish/Portuguese considered 'white' to be a virtue, then Brits and Scandinavians would be superior, which they certainly wouldn't admit to.
 

tenthring

Banned
Asian people have Asian customs, cultures, and habits. People are going to notice these things and its going to set them apart. I'm not entirely sure how you think this could not happen. It happens today when we consider anything resembling racism the worst sin ever.

If you mean that people have a generally high opinion of Asians that's already been the case for a long time. Model Minority and all that.

Asians themselves are basically the same. They certainly don't see white people as being the same as them, but they have respect for them. The informal racial hierarchy most Asians have is about the same as the informal racial hierarchy most white people have.

PH_2015-09-28_immigration-through-2065-42.png
 
When I was going to school in the 1950's Chinese and Syrians were both considered white. Not only did they go to the white schools, a Chinese boy was elected president
of the class. The main divide was between black and non-black. I don't know how people from India would fit in.
 
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