WI Canada adopted a 'New Deal'?

Important to note that Stevens' platform in 35 was pacifistic. I dont think his government would be any more prepared than King's for WW2.

His big make work project was going to be the Trans Canada Hwy.
 
I'm finding the political "how" fascinating, but TBH, I'm more interested in the effects. (Yes, that may mean I'd sacrifice realism. Sue me.:openedeyewink: )

I've long wondered whether, with the right POD, we could have ended up with an '80s/early '90s version of Canada where the PCs are the party of the center-left and the Liberals the party of the center-right, and whether they'd have kept their names. I know there are plenty of right-leaning parties with "liberal" in their name, but I can't think of any left-leaning party calling itself "conservative" off the top of my head.
 
his likely TTL replacement is Duff Cooper
I can't see the (UK) Tories going for Duff Cooper as Party leader, the man was a notorious womaniser. Very talented, yes, managed never to get publicly outed OTL yes, but he was a bit of a risk by the 1930s when the news media were getting slightly more intrusive than in Lloyd George's day. They wouldn't have followed him about back then but if he were named as a co-respondent or denounced by a jealous rival? Lord Halifax, Kingsley Wood, Sir Samuel Hoare, Walter Elliott and Philip Cuncliffe-Lister (Lord Swinton) were all able men and less risky choices.
 
I've long wondered whether, with the right POD, we could have ended up with an '80s/early '90s version of Canada where the PCs are the party of the center-left and the Liberals the party of the center-right, and whether they'd have kept their names. I know there are plenty of right-leaning parties with "liberal" in their name, but I can't think of any left-leaning party calling itself "conservative" off the top of my head.
Major James Coldwell, the leader of the CCF was given several offers to join the Liberal Party, including one offer by William Lyon Mackenzie King that would have made Coldwell the successor of King as Prime Minister. Perhaps Coldwell would have been more amenable to a permanent party fusion with a party that is actively interventionist in the economy such as Steven's Conservatives rather than one that had to be dragged kicking and screaming to economic intervention (and even then didn't do much of it) like King's Liberals.

If Stevens changed the name of the party to the Progressive Conservatives, but didn't like any of his possible successors in the PC Old Guard (which seems likely from what I know of Stevens), maybe he could get Coldwell on board and change the name, again, to the Progressive Commonwealth Party. That way they can keep the PC moniker.
 
I can't see the (UK) Tories going for Duff Cooper as Party leader, the man was a notorious womaniser. Very talented, yes, managed never to get publicly outed OTL yes, but he was a bit of a risk by the 1930s when the news media were getting slightly more intrusive than in Lloyd George's day. They wouldn't have followed him about back then but if he were named as a co-respondent or denounced by a jealous rival? Lord Halifax, Kingsley Wood, Sir Samuel Hoare, Walter Elliott and Philip Cuncliffe-Lister (Lord Swinton) were all able men and less risky choices.
Okay, good to know. The most notable part in my suggestion for getting in H.H. Stevens in office is, of course, a lack of Neville Chamberlain, rather than Cooper in particular, so those all seem to be good alternatives.
 
Okay, good to know. The most notable part in my suggestion for getting in H.H. Stevens in office is, of course, a lack of Neville Chamberlain, rather than Cooper in particular, so those all seem to be good alternatives.

IIRC Bennett came down with a pretty severe case of pneumonia in 1934. If it's a bit more severe, or if he takes a nasty fall or is hit by a cab, Stevens was seen as his natural successor before he resigned from the party. If Stevens takes over as leader and calls a spring election in 1935 to gain a mandate for his Reconstruction plan I think he wins.

Though I think a RCN shipbuilding program is out of the question for Stevens, a big part of his OTL platform was the exploitation of the resources in Canada's north. Given the role rural airstrips played in this phenomenon in OTL, I could see his make work project expanded to include airfields as Europe gets closer to war. Getting a jump start on the BCATP might prevent Canada from volunteering to intern British Enemy Aliens in 1940 and imprisoning thousands of innocent Jewish refugees under suspicion of being German agents. Though this would be beneficial, it would also complicate later efforts to open Canada to Jewish immigration after the war.
 
I'm finding the political "how" fascinating, but TBH, I'm more interested in the effects. (Yes, that may mean I'd sacrifice realism. Sue me.:openedeyewink: )
I think a Tory-lead "New Deal" would largely deal with public works, since welfare was still seen as shameful and a disincentive to work (er, moreso than now), and even a more radical leader will need to deal with his less-radical colleagues. If the government is just funding a whole lot of construction, they can spin it as an "employment strategy" or something. Stuff like the (OTL) Youth Training Act would also fit into this mindset nicely. Outright welfare programs would probably be avoided as much as possible, or implemented or spun in such a way that makes them less objectionable… maybe instead of a managed, means-tested welfare program they just do cash payments to the needy, like an early form of UBI (there's precedent— the conservative Social Credit in Alberta proposed much the same thing).

For Stevens in particular, the Depression turned him against big business and their corrupt practices, so I think he'd lead a crusade there (good optics, too). foresterab's suggestion of taking on the pulp cartels seems reasonable to me.
 
http://digitool.library.mcgill.ca/webclient/StreamGate?folder_id=0&dvs=1556721823050~631

Professor Mark Kuhlberg at Laurentian University has done the most research on the topic including documenting the international aspect of the cartels

The thesis above refers to several different price fixing and marketing schemes including several exposed through federal anti-trust investigations in the 1950s

Why does this mater? Rapid growth of Canadian pulp production post ww1 to the point it was Canada’s second most valuable export after grain up to the 1950s. Oil then started to take over with autos coming third. This is also the era pulp products begin to shift into different specialization

Interesting times
Foresterab
 
I've long wondered whether, with the right POD, we could have ended up with an '80s/early '90s version of Canada where the PCs are the party of the center-left and the Liberals the party of the center-right, and whether they'd have kept their names. I know there are plenty of right-leaning parties with "liberal" in their name, but I can't think of any left-leaning party calling itself "conservative" off the top of my head.

Major James Coldwell, the leader of the CCF was given several offers to join the Liberal Party, including one offer by William Lyon Mackenzie King that would have made Coldwell the successor of King as Prime Minister. Perhaps Coldwell would have been more amenable to a permanent party fusion with a party that is actively interventionist in the economy such as Steven's Conservatives rather than one that had to be dragged kicking and screaming to economic intervention (and even then didn't do much of it) like King's Liberals.

If Stevens changed the name of the party to the Progressive Conservatives, but didn't like any of his possible successors in the PC Old Guard (which seems likely from what I know of Stevens), maybe he could get Coldwell on board and change the name, again, to the Progressive Commonwealth Party. That way they can keep the PC moniker.

Not to too my horn (well, maybe a little) but a while ago I did a list on this rough concept that you may get a kick out of: part 1 and part 2.
 
I think a Tory-lead "New Deal" would largely deal with public works, since welfare was still seen as shameful and a disincentive to work (er, moreso than now), and even a more radical leader will need to deal with his less-radical colleagues. If the government is just funding a whole lot of construction, they can spin it as an "employment strategy" or something. Stuff like the (OTL) Youth Training Act would also fit into this mindset nicely. Outright welfare programs would probably be avoided as much as possible, or implemented or spun in such a way that makes them less objectionable… maybe instead of a managed, means-tested welfare program they just do cash payments to the needy, like an early form of UBI (there's precedent— the conservative Social Credit in Alberta proposed much the same thing).
I'd agree with all of that, &, more to the point, I imagined a broad works program. Something like crop or drought insurance would have to be brought in, too, given Prairie weather (which I'd forgotten about til just now:oops: ).
For Stevens in particular, the Depression turned him against big business and their corrupt practices, so I think he'd lead a crusade there (good optics, too). foresterab's suggestion of taking on the pulp cartels seems reasonable to me.
That suggests he'd also go after the movie industry. Which makes me wonder if that doesn't contribute to the need for, & party/Parliament support for, a film (& theatre?) subsidy program, to make up for job losses. Same kind of thing applies to the pulp/paper companies: does it provoke support for book & magazine publishers, including (especially!) comics?

Given Canada does sue film companies to prevent block booking, does that influence the U.S. to do the same?

Given Stevens as PM leads to Cooper as PM, wouldn't he realize war in '38 leaves Britain very unprepared? (If the French don't point out it leaves them in a pretty nice fix.)
 
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Important to note that Stevens' platform in 35 was pacifistic. I dont think his government would be any more prepared than King's for WW2.
Yeah, but that was him as head of his own party. Party heads normally didn't have dictatorial power, and he could face a backbencher revolt if he isn't showing sufficient solidarity with the empire. This is after all still the Tory Party, red or not.
 
Given the idea of a national sales tax... What were the likely effects of new taxes? Like:
  1. Gasoline tax, 1-2 cents. First of its kind in Canada.
  2. Capital gains tax (first of its kind in Canada, IIRC), 90% (This would reduce overproduction, which was a big problem then.)
  3. Inheitance tax (first of its kind in Canada, IIRC), 90% on estates over C$200,000 (1931 dollars)
  4. Stock trading tax (Hitting short-term trades hardest, to reduce market volatility)
On other matters, what does finding Leduc oil & Kindersly potash do to (for) Canada's economy? How much does it stimulate exports?

How much does that help Britain's war effort?
 
falls on the too little too late file.
he promised the moon to get elected the first time and did.......nothing worthwhile........so on the eave of another election he promises two moons........fool me once.......
So he doesn't get even a first chance, say. What does that mean for Canada's economy in the '30s? Into WW2? Now?

Could Canada actually have dominated the short/medium-haul airliner business with the C.102, beating the 727/737 to market by about 8yr?:eek::eek: (Does that mean shooting all the nitwits in charge at TCA?:rolleyes: )
 
So he doesn't get even a first chance, say. What does that mean for Canada's economy in the '30s? Into WW2? Now?
Depends what we get instead.

If we take Guthrie beating Bennet in the 1927 Tory leadership race as the POD a Canadian New Deal is on the table. Just having King win in 1930 won't change much, other than perhaps leaving him rather than Bennet with the baggage of completely failing to fix the economy (actually, him winning in 1930 followed by Bennet winning in 1935 would be an interesting timeline, though perhaps one which wouldn't meet this thread's purpose).
 
So he doesn't get even a first chance, say. What does that mean for Canada's economy in the '30s? Into WW2? Now?

Could Canada actually have dominated the short/medium-haul airliner business with the C.102, beating the 727/737 to market by about 8yr?:eek::eek: (Does that mean shooting all the nitwits in charge at TCA?:rolleyes: )
you might have to dispose of the nitwits at transport canada who didn t want to be the first to certify a commercial jet
 
you might have to dispose of the nitwits at transport canada who didn t want to be the first to certify a commercial jet
Maybe. That would seem to be taken care of by different government in power at the time. (With any luck, no C. D Howe screwing things up with orders for CF-100s that won't arrive before the KW ends.:rolleyes: )

Either way, you've got to deal with TCA's refusing to buy the C.102 because it didn't have the AJ.65 (Avon) jets they specified, despite the fact AJ.65s weren't certified for civil use yet...:confounded::rolleyes:
Depends what we get instead.
Posit Stevens, then. (Traces of handwavium I'll overlook, so long as it's not blatant.:openedeyewink: )

Would he try an FDR-style public works plan? If so, would he go as far as I've suggested?

Maybe more important (certainly more interesting to me:openedeyewink: ), who would go that far? (I can't feature a CCF or equivalent gov't in '30-'33...)
 
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