WI - British Western Hispaniola

The French either focus on Jamaica or somewhere else. The Spanish may militarise and populate their share of Hispaniola due to a hostile neighbour nearby. Which makes a loss of British Haiti more likelier than a loss of Jamaica. But that is not bound to happen.
 

Deleted member 67076

It'd be different from Haiti because the lack of trade restrictions with British North America. Depending on when this happens then this will probably undercut much of the economic development of the US south focusing on cotton and indigo as Western Hispaniola and the rest of the British Caribbean can provide absolutely massive levels of output to the metropole and New England's textile/rum plants. Could also see some shipbuilding industries form up in the region.

But honestly, I'm not sure if it'll get as much investment as the French put in. There's more competition from other sectors rather than being basically the only major colony in the Western Hemisphere.


The French either focus on Jamaica or somewhere else. The Spanish may militarise and populate their share of Hispaniola due to a hostile neighbour nearby.
The Spanish are totally going to militarize in response:

An English Haiti is pointing a gun at New Spain and New Granada in a way Jamaica could only dream of. You've a number of excellent harbors in the region, its easily defensible (and easy to retreat back to) and its situated nicely in the middle of the Caribbean, allowing it to serve as an excellent launching point and trading station in a way that no other Caribbean colony could be.

Frankly I'd expect it to be a major naval base and pirate enclave for decades to come with piracy and supporting the navy being just as much important to Britain as sugar and coffee would be. I'd also expect a massive increase in smuggling with Spanish Santo Domingo in comparison to OTL, which combined with increased raids is going to force the Spanish crown to act in response to that. Wouldn't surprise me if the English attempt to raid or straight up invade Veracruz at one point.

Furthermore I'd expect the colonial balance of power to shift more south, with the Brits focusing more on Louisiana and their southern colonies as both areas would reinforce each other very well, with Saint Dominic providing defense and, say, Louisiana and the Carolinas providing raw materials and later slaves, (given that they were OTL net exporters of slaves due to natural population growth). Perhaps it might spur some proto-industry down south to supply Princeport's armada. New England in turn may or may not end up neglected, as men and money are diverted south. Which might prompt rebellion, or not. Its hard for me to say.

Dunno, the US equivalent might actually be more Brazil than America as we know it and might be incredibly lopsided, with the population and industry geared in the South. I doubt St Dominic would rebel with her northern sisters. Leaving in a rebellion doesn't really benefit St Dominic; they'd depend too much on the Royal Navy, alongside the European market and there's not much they can earn in trade with other colonies in the area.

However, this increased pressure on Spain is going to have a number of impacts, and thus the Spanish crown might be forced to do its Bourbon esque reforms earlier in the face of British pressure on their trading ports and smuggling. That means more trading ports, and perhaps Colonial wide free trade in order to divert smuggling.


Suppressing rebellions is not going to be easier than the French had it. Slaves will still likely had overwhelming numerical advantage (probably even more so, as English colonies always had less free men of color than comparison to the Romance Speaking ones). As well there is the same geographic pressures that made monitoring and stopping slave rebellions insanely difficult (Mountainous jungle and semiarid terrain combined with disease and lack of infrastructure in the borderlands). High population density (which is inevitable in St Dominic) only adds to slave advantages in wartime, given the ease of organization, coordination and logistics for slave armies in comparison to planning a slave rebellion in say, Brazil.

The one advantage the English had over the French I suppose is that they tended to not be picky about where they're slaves came from, and forcibly integrated the various ethnic groups of their slaves (instead of keeping them separate like the Portuguese) which tended to erode their native cultures. Of course that could backfire by creating a Pan African sentiment amongst slaves.

As for taking the entire Island, I'm eh on that. Conquering the eastern side is a lot harder than people give credit too given the mountain ranges and semi arid regions making marching an army insanely difficult even today, especially if you're doing it from a power base in the west since you have to go through the Cordillera Central and/or Sierra de Neiba. Even a naval invasion of Santo Domingo and Puerto Plata is tricky, and should those be taken then you have to deal with the northern population centers deep inland. To say nothing that the Sword of Damocles a hundred miles west of Santo Domingo prompting Spain to send more settlers immediately.
 
Am content with the British making do with British Western Hispaniola / St Dominic as opposed to the British attempting to take the whole Island, perhaps the French would focus more on the Guianas (potentially taking Amapa) and fight against the Dutch (in the absence of the British) with each trying to dominate that part of South America (until the French later lose the Guyanas to the Dutch possibly via a pyrrhic victory in a French Guiana analogue to the Haitian Revolution).

It would be interesting seeing how things unfold later on should its neighbor the Dominican Republic under President Baez successfully convince the US to annex his nation, combined with no Teller Amendment and the British selling many of its West Indie territories in the aftermath of WW1 to the US.
 
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Deleted member 67076

It would be interesting seeing how things unfold later on should its neighbor the Dominican Republic under President Baez successfully convince the US to annex his nation, combined with no Teller Amendment and the British selling many of its West Indie territories in the aftermath of WW1 to the US.
There won't be a Baez with a British hold on western Hispaniola. He'd be butterflied away. The conditions that led to an annexationist party would also be removed in response to Spanish militarization and economic reform.
 
There won't be a Baez with a British hold on western Hispaniola. He'd be butterflied away. The conditions that led to an annexationist party would also be removed in response to Spanish militarization and economic reform.

Perhaps. If a British West Hispaniola potentially butterflies away President Baez, what would be the best scenario to lay the groundwork for an eventual US Hispaniola beyond a Dominican Republic composed of all of the island or another group besides the French and British ruling West Hispaniola (perhaps the Dutch or another group)?
 

Deleted member 67076

Perhaps. If a British West Hispaniola potentially butterflies away President Baez, what would be the best scenario to lay the groundwork for an eventual US Hispaniola beyond a Dominican Republic composed of all of the island or another group besides the French and British ruling West Hispaniola (perhaps the Dutch or another group)?
Youre not getting an American Hispaniola in more or less any circumstances where the British have Haiti.

No way in hell the Brits would allow anyone access to a naval base in Samana. And also as Ive mentioned above, the Spanish reforms put in place after the seizing of the western third of the island would make an annexationist faction be butterflied away.
 
Depending on when this happens then this will probably undercut much of the economic development of the US south

I, um, think even with an English Hispaniola (which will not be called Saint Dominic, Haytee, or what have you) the South will be OK. The reason for that is the particular method of colonization which was brought over, which was based on the model used in Barbados. The Barbados model tends to exhaust nutrients in the soil very fast in order to make a quick buck on cash crops, so in order for the plantations to be profitable this requires a constant infusion of new lands. An English Hispaniola would be no different from the rest of the Deep South on this score.
 
Youre not getting an American Hispaniola in more or less any circumstances where the British have Haiti.

No way in hell the Brits would allow anyone access to a naval base in Samana. And also as Ive mentioned above, the Spanish reforms put in place after the seizing of the western third of the island would make an annexationist faction be butterflied away.

You have already mentioned the issues of a British West Hispaniola.

So to go in a different direction. What would be the impact of a completely Spanish Hispaniola that followed along similar lines to what eventually became OTL Dominican Republic or a Dutch West Hispaniola (which Spain later formally cedes to the Dutch as it did to the French in OTL) that is considered less of a threat compared to if it were under the British?
 

Deleted member 67076

You have already mentioned the issues of a British West Hispaniola.
Sure, but that doesnt mean they wouldnt court the eastern side and use influence to deny any American annexation attempts. Tbh I think a US as we know it would be butterflied away due to the change in economics in the Caribbean.

So to go in a different direction. What would be the impact of a completely Spanish Hispaniola that followed along similar lines to what eventually became OTL Dominican Republic or a Dutch West Hispaniola (which Spain later formally cedes to the Dutch as it did to the French in OTL) that is considered less of a threat compared to if it were under the British?
Youre changing a lot. The Devastations of 1606 being averted dramatically alters the situation on every level.

A completely Spanish Hispaniola is one with an economy that resembles more Argentina than anything else in the Caribbean. Ranching supplemented with ginger and tobacco farms and extensive smuggling that becomes the breadbasket of the rest of the Caribbean. Even less slavery than OTL in Santo Domingo. Prob will spur greater settlement and rationalization later on and during the 1700s it can become a regional shipping and light industry hub. Also a fairly Protestant country from the influence of English and Dutch pirates.

Im not sure how to get a Dutch Haiti. Or to force the Spanish to cede the entire island.
 
Essentially the idea would be the US either acquires ATL Cuba and Dominican Republic prior to or in the aftermath of the ATL 1898 Spanish-American War, followed later by British West Hispaniola / St Dominic being sold to the US (along with other West Indie territories) in the aftermath of WW1 to pay off war debt.

For a Spanish Hispaniola or a Dutch Haiti, the question would be how to recreate a similar scenario to what happened in OTL French ruled / Post-French Haiti yet make both a more attractive prospect to be annexed to the US compared to OTL.
 

Deleted member 67076

For a Spanish Hispaniola or a Dutch Haiti, the question would be how to recreate a similar scenario to what happened in OTL French ruled / Post-French Haiti yet make both a more attractive prospect to be annexed to the US compared to OTL.
You can't.

A whole Spanish Hispaniola simply won't have the slave numbers or demographics for a slave revolt ala Haiti. Or the plantation economy for that matter. An entirely Spanish Hispaniola probably butterflies away the United States as we know it. It would also prevent the cause for an annexationist party to develop in the first place, which was based off a fear of reinvasion and a sense of doubt that the new country could not survive without external aid. Here, these factors are averted.

Long story short a continuing Spanish Hispaniola looks more like a mix of colonial Argentina and Pennsylvania than anything else in the Caribbean.

Dutch Haiti requires something like a strong Dutch West India company, but theyd be more inclined to continue with holding Northern Brazil or the smaller sugar colonies as that would be more profitable in the long run. Historically, the French Buccaneers who began to control Saint Domingue invested so heavily in slavery because it was the only major territory France had in the New World; the Dutch would have other sources of wealth and would be averse to investing the money needed to build an entire plantation industry from scratch. And probably would settle it less than the French, meaning a slave revolt like Saint Domingue probably would happen earlier, albeit without a Revolution itd likely be crushed or snatched by a rival.
 
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