WI Arthur Tudor Has A Posthumous Daughter

Arthur Tudor was Catherine of Aragon's first wife and Henry VII's eldest son. What if he had posthumous daughter, let's call her Elizabeth? Would Elizabeth become Queen or would her uncle be chosen over her? Wht if?
 
Probably not. Males were always first on succession order and Arthur hasn't been king. But if even Henry VIII not be able get still son, things might be different. But Arthur's child might have good changes get throne of England if child would be male and Henry VIII has only daughters and his son would still dies without descedants.
 
Probably not. Males were always first on succession order and Arthur hasn't been king. But if even Henry VIII not be able get still son, things might be different. But Arthur's child might have good changes get throne of England if child would be male and Henry VIII has only daughters and his son would still dies without descedants.

If Arthur's child is male, he comes before his uncle - Richard II (the Black Prince's son, and thus Edward III's grandson) instead of John of Gaunt as John II, remember?

Pretty sure what passes for succession law hasn't changed in that regard.
 
If Arthur's child is male, he comes before his uncle - Richard II (the Black Prince's son, and thus Edward III's grandson) instead of John of Gaunt as John II, remember?

Pretty sure what passes for succession law hasn't changed in that regard.

Correct. son of the deceased Prince of Wales would be the heir over his uncle.
 
Would a daughterbe heir over heruncle?

In my opinion, no: at the time the only previous queen had been Matilda, and that had caused an 18 year civil war. Henry VII, who is at this time looking to secure his dynasty on the throne, would most likely legislate that Henry, Duke of York, is his heir, and pass something similar to Henry VIII's Act Respecting the Oath to the Succession.

This daughter proves that Arthur and Catherine of Aragon did, in fact, consummate their marriage, and so there is no possibility for her to marry Henry, Duke of York. One possible alternative is Eleanor Habsburg, daughter of Philip, Duke of Burgundy, with whom it appears Henry VII had conducted tentative negotiations for a marriage between the Duke of York and Eleanor. Eleanor bore two children in her marriage in our timeline, a short-lived son and a daughter.
 
In my opinion, no: at the time the only previous queen had been Matilda, and that had caused an 18 year civil war. Henry VII, who is at this time looking to secure his dynasty on the throne, would most likely legislate that Henry, Duke of York, is his heir, and pass something similar to Henry VIII's Act Respecting the Oath to the Succession.

This daughter proves that Arthur and Catherine of Aragon did, in fact, consummate their marriage, and so there is no possibility for her to marry Henry, Duke of York. One possible alternative is Eleanor Habsburg, daughter of Philip, Duke of Burgundy, with whom it appears Henry VII had conducted tentative negotiations for a marriage between the Duke of York and Eleanor. Eleanor bore two children in her marriage in our timeline, a short-lived son and a daughter.

Pretty much this. If the daughter was older, and married with a few children, then the situation would be different. However, a underage heiress vs an of age male heir, I think we know who the choice is.
 
If Catherine had a child by Arthur then she is not marrying Henry as the Pope can't give a dispensation on the grounds of non-consumation of the marriage to Arthur to allow her to wed Henry!

So assuming the child is a daughter then you will have a situation on Henry's succession. I do not believe that a posthumous daughter of Arthur would be allowed to prevent Henry's accession so there are a lot of political butterflies from this including the later claim to the English throne from said daughter (assuming she doesn't meet with a "Princes in the Tower" accident).
 
So assuming the child is a daughter then you will have a situation on Henry's succession. I do not believe that a posthumous daughter of Arthur would be allowed to prevent Henry's accession so there are a lot of political butterflies from this including the later claim to the English throne from said daughter (assuming she doesn't meet with a "Princes in the Tower" accident).

I don't think she will be murdered on Uncle Henry's orders; as far as I can tell, Henry was relatively fond of all his family, and his niece is not a serious challenge to his authority as king on her own, given that he is a man and she is not. The question of her marriage depends somewhat on his own ability to produce an heir - until then she is heiress presumptive, but after which she slips down the line of succession toward insignificance. So as and when Henry has a child of his own, she might be allowed to marry an English noble (as she is only the daughter of a deceased prince, she is not a great catch for any European rulers).
 
I don't think she will be murdered on Uncle Henry's orders; as far as I can tell, Henry was relatively fond of all his family, and his niece is not a serious challenge to his authority as king on her own, given that he is a man and she is not. The question of her marriage depends somewhat on his own ability to produce an heir - until then she is heiress presumptive, but after which she slips down the line of succession toward insignificance. So as and when Henry has a child of his own, she might be allowed to marry an English noble (as she is only the daughter of a deceased prince, she is not a great catch for any European rulers).

But would she be allowed to marry? Any sons of hers could conceivably challenge any ruling of Henry VII's succession later on if Henry VIII's male heirs turn out to be politically inconvenient. Even if Henry VIII has her husband refuse any claim.
 
But would she be allowed to marry? Any sons of hers could conceivably challenge any ruling of Henry VII's succession later on if Henry VIII's male heirs turn out to be politically inconvenient. Even if Henry VIII has her husband refuse any claim.

Henry VIII's sisters married too and it didn't caused problems. Well, after Elizabeth I to throne came one of descedant of Henry VII's daughter but it is different story. Arthur's daughter's descedants would have quiet difficult claim throne. This would need very bad succession crisis or other serious internal problems. You might have kill all Henry VIII's descedants or make them absolutely unable to reign. And there would be other claimants too.
 
The Catholic Monarchs would probably make great effort to ensure their granddaughter's rights were safeguarded. Most likely a dispensation is procured to allow her to marry her uncle, the Duke of York-cum-Prince of Wales.

If not, Catherine could still marry Henry: having children with a sibling wasn't an insurmountable obstacle, as the marital careers of her sisters prove.

Still, I think most likely Catherine's dowry passes to her young daughter (who is betrothed to her uncle) and Catherine returns home to her father to be married off elsewhere.
 
If Catherine had a child by Arthur then she is not marrying Henry as the Pope can't give a dispensation on the grounds of non-consumation of the marriage to Arthur to allow her to wed Henry!

Why would the pope need to get involved in the first place. Catherine is a widow, Henry's single. Was there some kind of church law that said you can't marry your bothers wife?
 
Quite frankly I don't see Catherine of Aragon marrying Henry VIII, as the consummation of her marriage with Arthur is easily proven by the presence of a child, and she had to be quite explicit that she and Arthur had never consummated their marriage in order to be able to marry Henry in OTL. She either stays in England as mother to the princess, or goes back to Spain before being married off again.
 
It stil perferctly possible the original dispensations for Henry and Catherine to marry covered all eventualities (ie dispensed the impediment) whether the marriage was consummated or not.
I doubt the Pope is going to turn down Isabella & Ferdinand and Henry VII.

The Spanish were keen to suggest it hadn't been (based on Catherine's view) and the English were keen to suggest it had been (to preserve the reputation of Prince Arthur).

A lot will now depend on what Henry VII does - a female heiress presumptive (in strict terms she has the strongest claim) gives him a real problem in terms of leaving stability after his death.

Either way he will almost certainly have to go to Parliament and get some kind of Act passed either naming his granddaughter or his younger son the Duke of York as heir rather than leaving an unholy mess.

I suspect he will go with Henry as his heir despite Spanish objections - and will push the match with Catherine to shut Ferdinand up (the fact that Isabella is dying might help in these circumstances since Ferdinand was not overly keen on being succeeded by a woman in Aragon either).

The issue becomes if Henry and Catherine have as many difficulties in delivering an heir as they did in OTL - if it is - then by the 1520s the question at the English Court will which of the girls should succeed - the King's niece (daughter of his elder brother) or his own daughter. I suspect the pressure on him to abandon Catherine will be even stronger.
 
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