Corrected, thanks. I think the other brothers were already taken - either by women or the church.....
WI:Anne Boleyn dies 1532.
- Thread starter Wildcard F. Kennedy
- Start date
There is also Infante Ferdinand born 1507, but he died in 1534 and married in 1530. Infante Alfonso became a churchman in 1523, but infante Henry is avaliable, if his holy order is revoked. Infante Duarte b 1515 is also a option for Mary.
John is offering from the top of the list down, like the others. I considered Duarte, but Luis seems a more likely option to me. His age means he's got some sense (maybe bad, but some). By the time the marriage contract is finalizes, it's going to be 1534. Anyone already married/betrothed is off, as I've stated before I'm in favor of minimal butterflies.
That being said, I seriously considered having Ippolito II d'Este leave Holy Orders in another TL, having fallen in love with Mary Tudor while here as part of annulment hearing in 1529 (my Anne marries Percy TL), but his income came mostly from his ecclesiastical holdings......It would have been so cool to have Henry VIII related by marriage to a controversial Pope.
That being said, I seriously considered having Ippolito II d'Este leave Holy Orders in another TL, having fallen in love with Mary Tudor while here as part of annulment hearing in 1529 (my Anne marries Percy TL), but his income came mostly from his ecclesiastical holdings......It would have been so cool to have Henry VIII related by marriage to a controversial Pope.
Still possible to do so. Ippolito's sister, Eleonora was still unwed (I can't remember if she took vows later of not), so Henry marries Eleonora (he wants a French princess - perhaps, and François can't/wont give him one (Madeleine is sickly, Marguerite he turned down OTL in 1537 cause she was too young, in '32, she'd be younger still), but a French proxy is always possible, I guess. Just not sure how to get Eleonora and Henry into the same circles.
That's still possible, if Ippolito did come to England with the Papal legatine....while not wanting to give up his own $$$, he could nominate his sister for the King.
Who wants to argue for/against their favorite candidates for Mary's hand? (Henry will be later.) You can even give the pros/cons on people I've dismissed (James in Scotland, but the Earl of Lincoln is 10 at this point, I doubt Henry would consider him - he is sickly). I'm looking for viewpoints.
I primarily vote for James V of Scotland, because that will unite the islands, but otherwise I support a Mary and Luis match. That can prevent the iberian union later. Lol, look at me, arguing for one union and against one other.
My vote for Mary and Hans (I know he may/may not be dead, but I've got a softspot for the guy). He's Habsburg-adjacent like Beja, and in 1532/1533 Christian's gonna be casting around for support to reclaim the Danish throne. What better way to do that than through marriage of his only son with the English king's only daughter. If something happens to Henry, Christian will think that she can bring English troops (sort of the way Felipe II did OTL) to bear to help reinstate him. Karl V would support the idea, because he was fond of him, the French would agree because Hans is a landless prince who thanks to Denmark's electoral succession might not even succeed as king - although he'll still claim the Danish, Swedish and Norwegian thrones for himself and his kids. And the fun part is, Hans can marry Mary, honeymoon baby (possibly twins, since his mother and maternal great-grandmother both had that luck with their kids, as did his nephew), and Hans can be killed soon afterwards in a military adventure of some sort. Mary goes into lifelong mourning - think Widow of Windsor come early - for her late husband, devotes herself to her kid(s). Her dad remarries, but has no kids - just a string of miscarriages/neonatal deaths - and when he dies, Mary and Hans' son succeeds him.
Jonas, it's already 1533 in the TL, Hans died in 1532 - before the queries for a husband began. She's not marrying a dead guy. Sorry.
Wish someone had told Bella Swan/Elena Gilbert and co that
Next favourite is Lincoln. And after that, in no particular order - Beja, the dauphin, Sigismund II of Poland (who threw his hat in the ring too IIRC), and basically any body besides the Scots' king. Hell, even the pope's offer to countenance a marriage between Mary and Fitzroy would be better than that.
I'm curious, why Lincoln? He's right at ten years old and sickly (OTL died in 1534), Mary is already 17 and while not a big girl, she's healthy. She'd have to wait four years (at least) to wed.
And don't get me started on glittering vampires. Chelsea Quinn Yarbro's Saint Germain series is the best thought out and historically researched series on a vampire, if you're into that. He doesn't glitter in the sunshine - but he has found a way to walk in it.
And don't get me started on glittering vampires. Chelsea Quinn Yarbro's Saint Germain series is the best thought out and historically researched series on a vampire, if you're into that. He doesn't glitter in the sunshine - but he has found a way to walk in it.
I vote for Beja if she can't have James.
I also swear to God, stop talking about glittering vampires or I'll holy water bomb all your asses asap
I also swear to God, stop talking about glittering vampires or I'll holy water bomb all your asses asap
Tell Jonas, he brought it up. I was just providing a more realistic, better written series than that crap.
Lincoln OTL didn't live to his 14th birthday and I also agree with the "War of the Roses" analogy if she waited for him (and I butterflied his death).
My questions are:
1. Will Henry risk wedding Mary outside of England? (James, Sigismund II, Dauphin) He intermittently thought about making Fitzroy heir, but he also had to know that the nobles wouldn't support his bastard taking the throne with a legitimate heiress available. Mary herself will refuse to wed Fitzroy, and she's old enough to do so and defend her position. (I'm sure there will be no shortage of people pointing out the Biblical prohibitions and how does Henry countenance violating the Bible after the fuss he made over wedding Arthur's widow?)
2. I thought about wedding her to the Dauphin and still have him die in 1536 - if she has a daughter, would Francis let her take the girl to England (Salic Law) to allow no disputes over Henri?
My questions are:
1. Will Henry risk wedding Mary outside of England? (James, Sigismund II, Dauphin) He intermittently thought about making Fitzroy heir, but he also had to know that the nobles wouldn't support his bastard taking the throne with a legitimate heiress available. Mary herself will refuse to wed Fitzroy, and she's old enough to do so and defend her position. (I'm sure there will be no shortage of people pointing out the Biblical prohibitions and how does Henry countenance violating the Bible after the fuss he made over wedding Arthur's widow?)
2. I thought about wedding her to the Dauphin and still have him die in 1536 - if she has a daughter, would Francis let her take the girl to England (Salic Law) to allow no disputes over Henri?
That's probably the biggest part of his appeal (along with being far enough back in the Portuguese succession), but I was floating other ideas.....he's still very much a contender at this point.
Sigismund by this time is already King of Poland-he was crowned vivente rege at age 10. Also Sigismund was propably sterile, likely as result of some venereal disease, so it could be possibly butterflied away-now Sigismund is only 12 and he lost his virginity IOTL aged 15 with Italian lady-in-waiting of his mother. But still-Polish marriage for Mary is too "exotic" IMHO.
Partially because I like the idea of a Brandon-Tudor England, but, let's face it, Henry's not gonna let Mary marry abroad until he has a son. A surviving Lincoln is also "better" than Mary or James V because he is both male and English. So, if Henry kicks with no legitimate male heir, there's gonna be some wondering about who should be king - James V (a foreigner), Mary (a woman) or Lincoln? Links, sickly or not, can serve as a dangerous lightning rod for anyone inside England who takes issue with James or Mary succeeding (sort of like how Elizabeth was coupled with anything to do with dethroning Mary/establishing Protestantism, etc during her half-sister's reign, whether she knew about it or not). Simplest way of removing him from the picture if he survives - marry him to Mary (then there's only Scots Jamie to worry about). Or, at least keep up the premise that Mary's going to marry him while Henry's wife is preggers and he waits for a son to arrive; then once a prince of Wales is born, boom, Mary marries Beja/the dauphin/Sigismund/whoever