WI:Anglo-Russian Alliance

So back in the 1500's, when Ivan the Terrible was building up Russia as a stronger nation, Russia and England had a lot of trade going between eachother. Ivan wanted to form an alliance with England, but Queen Elizabeth did not quite trust him.

So lets say she does take the offer and Britain with Russia form an alliance. What would happen I'm hoping for the alliance to be as long as possible since it would be a very powerful alliance later on.
 
What's needed is an immediate threat to both their interests. They had a lot of common ground - a profitable trade, hatred and suspicion of a big Catholic power - but Russia's enemy was the PLC and England's enemy was the Spanish imperial system.

Hapsburg Poland, maybe?

Remember, though, that neither England nor Russia is fated to get as strongas it did OTL. Both got pretty damn lucky in building up their empires.
 
Russia needs help getting access to the Baltic. Britain needs Russian goods. It seems sensible - until one sees that Britain can't really help Russia in anything much in the 1500s, and Russia lacks any projection because it has no sea access.
 
Russia needs help getting access to the Baltic. Britain needs Russian goods. It seems sensible - until one sees that Britain can't really help Russia in anything much in the 1500s, and Russia lacks any projection because it has no sea access.

Actually it does, Novgorod was incorporated into Russia so Novgorod ports are now Russia and Novgorod had major trade in Baltic, Russia did have sea access....:)
 
Actually it does, Novgorod was incorporated into Russia so Novgorod ports are now Russia and Novgorod had major trade in Baltic, Russia did have sea access....:)

Still doesn't work. They have to route through the Oresund (so past a couple of major navies) or through the White Sea (I don't have to say why this won't work, right?)
 
How does it prevent them from having an sea access in Europe?
The OTL situation was not different.

Yes, and it means that neither can help the other--the English aren't strong enough, and the Russians don't have enough naval capability. That's the whole point of what RGB was saying--Russia effectively lacks sea access, so they can't help the English with anything, while the English don't have the power yet to help the Russians with anything. So an alliance makes no sense. Trade? Yes. Transfers of knowledge? Yes. Alliance? No.
 
Actually it does, Novgorod was incorporated into Russia so Novgorod ports are now Russia and Novgorod had major trade in Baltic, Russia did have sea access....:)

Only through the White Sea. The Hanse, Livonian Order and the PLC maintained a mostly-continuous blocade of Russian traffic through most of the period, with Sweden and Denmark joining in on occasion.

When Boris Godunov sent an ambassador to Austria they had to sail around Norway and then travel through Hannover. Same for merchants, which is why Russia traded with the East but rarely with Europe.

The Dutch and English did trade with Russia, however.
 
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A united Scandinavia might provide a common opponent (to the Netherlands as well), as it would be a constant threat to Russia and none of the North Sea states would be keen on the Baltic access supplies being monopolised by one power.

A Anglo-Dutch alliance bankrolling Russia assaults in the East perhaps?
 
Indeed, in this period Dutch and English trade was handled through Arkhangelsk. Russia didn't have access to the Baltic until the time of Peter the Great.
 
Interesting, i dont have much knowledge, but my first guess would be that it gets canceled under the next Tsar's reign. He refused an alliance and canceled trade relations with England (or something like that) irl. But thats not very fun is it? So lets say he doesnt cancel it.

Times of Trouble will be interesting. English mercs may make up a new faction in the conflict, along side the Polish and Swedish forces, German mercs and Russians (do they count as one faction or not?). Or maybe England 'finds' their own 'Dmitri' and try to take over Russia. At that point the war will descend into self parody (if it hadent already in rl :rolleyes:).
 
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