WI/AHC: Kiev unites the Russian principalities instead of Moscow.

What if Kiev instead of Moscow forms closer ties with the Mongols and manages to become responsible for collecting the taxes of the other Russian principalities and then manages to unite/conquer the other principalities? What effects does this have on Russian and Slavic identity? Would Russia become as autocratic as it did IOTL?

I think the surrounding countryside being much more fertile than Moscow's might have some interesting effects. With bountiful harvests being in the same place as the population that need them, the peasants won't need to be taxed as heavily, leading to a less autocratic culture.
 
Kiev would be impossible after a Mongol Invasion POD. First it was starting to decline before the Mongol Invasion, losing out to Vladimir,Novgorod Nizhny Novgorod and Tver, Moscow which would be supported by Ivan the Rich would come later on. Second it got sacked which only furthered it's decline. 3rd The main tax collecting principality with power over others was Vladimir which I believe was appointed by the Khan of the Golden Horde.

The autocratic culture of Russia I believe really came full swing with Ivan the Terrible and Oprichniki and his efforts for good or ill consolidate power into the hands of anyone loyal to him. Muscovy could still have resulted a less autocratic Russia.
 
If you've got no mongol invasion, Kiev is probably more likely than Muscovy. Kievian Rus was a thing, for a while at least. It included much of European Russia if I'm not mistaken.
 
If you've got no mongol invasion, Kiev is probably more likely than Muscovy. Kievian Rus was a thing, for a while at least. It included much of European Russia if I'm not mistaken.
Unfortunately Kievan Rus was already on the decline before the Mongols.
 
If you want an alternative to the Grand Duchy of Moscow your best bet is the Novgorod Republic and not Kiev.

Novgorod is rather unlikely, I don't belive it can play the mongol system to it's advantage or at all. If we are going with a POD after the mongol invasions. You would have a to a prince of Vladimir, somehow become prince of Novgorod and consolidate his and his descendant's hold over both. You would have a person sitting on both vast Russian trade with the rest of Europe, and being able to collect tribute from other Rus principalities. The real kicker is hoping the that family can continuously have the favor of the Great Khans to keep being the position of Vladimir, and have continued support from the boyars of Novgorod.
 
Novgorod is rather unlikely, I don't belive it can play the mongol system to it's advantage or at all.
No need for a Mongol POD. Just have Novgorod successfully defeat Moscovy in the battles in 14th-15th century. Maybe have the attempted Novgorod-Polish alliance in late 15th century be a success?
But is its further decline inevitable?

Which is more likely - the revival of Kiev under a strong dynasty, or the development of Muscovy from scratch?
You clearly don't know how things worked in Kievan Rus. The decline was due to decentralized nature of the state and the territory being divided into ever smaller bits by an ever growing number of princes. Indeed, Moscow becoming centre of Eastern Slavdom thanks to deals with Mongols is far more likely than a "strong dynasty" popping out of nowhere in Kiev.

(Note: I am no Kievan Rus scholar and it's been a few years since I read on the subject. As far as I know the above statements are true but feel free to prove me wrong)
 
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But is its further decline inevitable?

Which is more likely - the revival of Kiev under a strong dynasty, or the development of Muscovy from scratch?

Well Kiev had the problem of being contested between both Lithuania and the Golden Horde, so a revival of Kiev under another branch of the Rurikids would be difficult. Lithuania as contender to unify the Rus states seems far fetched, they have to deal with religious problems and there are also principalities who weren't to keen of Lithuania anyway. Muscovy was not only developed from scratch by Ivan Kalita who had resources, but it also had the advantage of not being in a center of conflict, so it could develop in relative safety.
 
Didn't Ivan the Terrible decimate Novgorod because it was too much a rival to his Moscow power-base?
No Ivan the Terrible sacked Novgorod because he was a brutal,paranoid control freak. Novgorod was rendered powerless when Ivan the Great, Ivan the Terrible's grandfather invaded Novgorod and took away it's veche bell, this meant that Novgorod could no longer call assembly.
 
No Ivan the Terrible sacked Novgorod because he was a brutal,paranoid control freak. Novgorod was rendered powerless when Ivan the Great, Ivan the Terrible's grandfather invaded Novgorod and took away it's veche bell, this meant that Novgorod could no longer call assembly.
Yep, I realized the error (mixing up the Ivans). See my edit for clarification.
 
No need for a Mongol POD. Just have Novgorod successfully defeat Moscovy in the battles in 14th-15th century. Maybe have the attempted Novgorod-Polish alliance in late 15th century be a success?

If you mean a No Mongol Invasion POD, then a Novgorod Polish alliance may not even exist then. If your saying after everything else in OTL still happens, by then Muscovy was the primer Russian power, and had gradually started to whittle down the once might Lithuania. Poland would have to prioritize with Ottoman Empire as another up and coming major threat.
 
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