WI: A Larger British Waffen SS unit?

German efforts to create the British Free Corps were farcical. During the time of its existence fewer than 60 British and Commonwealth POWs and internees volunteered or were coerced into joining. It's greatest strength was just 27 soldiers. and it never saw action as such

Recruitment only got underway during 1943 when the tide of the ward had turned against Germany.

What if the Germans had chosen to recruit or a British SS unit earlier in the war perhaps at the same time as the creation of the Wiking Division in 1941? British fortunes were still very much on the back foot at that time of the war. Perhaps Germany could also lay the crusade against bolshevism card more strongly

I'm not suggsting that recruitment would be substantial but might earlier recruitment lead to a somewhat larger unit perhaps company strength perhaps even with one or two British officers*?

If the unit saw action on the Eastern Front would this materially affect anglo-soviet relations?

The BFC members received relatively lenient treatment after the way (none wee executed and the last BFC member was released from prison in the 50s). Would members of a larger unit that fought against an ally receive rather harsher treatment after the war?

* A small number of British offices did work for German radio (Walter udy and Railton Freeman spring to mind but only one officer, Douglas Berneville-Claye, appears to have put on waffen-ss uniform - he was not prosecuted ater the war due to lack of evidence)

NB I am asking out of interest not out of an actual desire to see more British soldiers fight for teh Reich)
 
TV doc

There was a TV documentary about this a while back. The British guys who did it seemed to do it just to play the Germans and get out of prison. I don't think they were serious. I doubt if any of them were idealistically inclined towards the enemy cause. Still a pretty stupid thing to get involved in though.

To answer the question I don't think there's any way they could find enough malcontents to fill the ranks of SS-GB. Maybe a handful of disgruntled Boers might come on board but unlikely I think.

If we were a conquered country that might be different but even then the recruits would probably be seen as fringe BUF loonies, stooges, opportunists or mere collaborators.
 
There was a TV documentary about this a while back. The British guys who did it seemed to do it just to play the Germans and get out of prison. I don't think they were serious. I doubt if any of them were idealistically inclined towards the enemy cause. Still a pretty stupid thing to get involved in though.

To answer the question I don't think there's any way they could find enough malcontents to fill the ranks of SS-GB. Maybe a handful of disgruntled Boers might come on board but unlikely I think.

If we were a conquered country that might be different but even then the recruits would probably be seen as fringe BUF loonies, stooges, opportunists or mere collaborators.
Maybe they would have had better luck with Irish?
 
Maybe they would have had better luck with Irish?

Problem being Irish recruits into the British Army were overwhelmingly Ulster Protestants or volunteers from the south seeking the life of a soldier/decent pay - many of them had familial connections to the Army and the unionist cause, all in all few Anglophobe Irish to pick from.

Add to this if the Abwehr went to Dublin to recruit, the only thing comparable to a fascist movement was the ACA which was pro-British. Then you're left with the option of the unrepentant IRA, who are both few in number circa 1940 and far better suited (if they were suited to anything, which I question given their track record) to staying put blowing up Special Branch urinals.
 
Maybe they would have had better luck with Irish?

They Germans tried to recruit Irishmen from among the POW population. About 150 Irish prisoners were take to a camp called Friesack. A handful offered their services (at least four had done so to disrupt german efforts. Two Irishmen James Brady (a pseudonym - nobody seems to know his real name), Franck Stringer who both served in the SS, and John Codd.

The four who went to disrupt things, including a guy called Red Cushing, ended up in Sachsenhausen. Cushing claims they were billeted with Yakov Stalin!
 
There was a TV documentary about this a while back. The British guys who did it seemed to do it just to play the Germans and get out of prison. I don't think they were serious. I doubt if any of them were idealistically inclined towards the enemy cause. Still a pretty stupid thing to get involved in though.

To answer the question I don't think there's any way they could find enough malcontents to fill the ranks of SS-GB. Maybe a handful of disgruntled Boers might come on board but unlikely I think.

If we were a conquered country that might be different but even then the recruits would probably be seen as fringe BUF loonies, stooges, opportunists or mere collaborators.


They wee a bit more of a mixed bag by all accounts. There were a number will decidedly pro-German sentiments, some seeking adventure and then there were those who were pressed into joining as a result of some sort of crime while a POW. Only one member an Australian whose name escapes me was coletely exonerated as his intentions and actions were to disrupt the unit.

A number of pows with pro german sentiments will have realised the sheer folly of joining the losing side in 1943. If recruitment had started in 1941 the perhaps some of them might have been inclined to get on board with the apparent winners. It might have led to a larger unit and one which saw service on the Eastern Front.
 
Or, perhaps better for increasing numbers, maybe if things were going a lot worse for the Germans, leaving a lot of stuff rather shambolic and the POWs realised that agreing to sign up would put them in a prime escape position. :p
 
Was there any attempt at recruitment on the Channel Islands?

There weren't any Channel Islanders in the BFC IIRC. The Irish SS men Brady and Stringer were both imprisoned in Jerseyat the time of the occupation as was Eddie Chapman(but he was no traitor)
 
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