WI: A Catholic Russia

I was recently watching a history program about Russia and while watching it I suddenly started to ponder "What if the Russ had become Catholics?"

So I decided to pose the question to the you the good people of AH.com and see what you had to say.
 
This would depend upon when this conversion took place. If Vladimir I of Kiev chose Catholicism over Orthodoxy, this would mean Byzantium would have a potentially dangerous rival to the North, rather than an religiously sympathetic one. A catholic Russia would be more likely to adopt the Latin script, rather that the more Orthodox oriented Cyrillic.

A Catholic Russia would put that country in the West's orbit from that moment forward. Though it would be a rather backward member of that club, it would still follow Western religious and intellectual trends, even if it lagged by a century or two. Russia would probably influence the West to at least some degree, as I imagine that Russian devotional art, especially iconography would become more acceptable in the West.

Religiously, I imagine that a Catholic Russia would be profoundly conservative, and highly resistant to "liberalizing" trends like the Protestant reformation. This would be due, in no small part to the immense distance separating Russia from the cultural centers of the West (Rome, Paris, Northern Italy). Also this could lead to a very different ideal of Russia, as it would be unlikely as the Tsars would see themselves as the heirs to the "Second Rome" after 1453.

The departures from OTL history are almost unlimited, and mostly, I think, would be positive in that it could lead to a more Western oriented Russia, one far less prone to conflict with the West.
 
This would depend upon when this conversion took place. If Vladimir I of Kiev chose Catholicism over Orthodoxy, this would mean Byzantium would have a potentially dangerous rival to the North, rather than an religiously sympathetic one. A catholic Russia would be more likely to adopt the Latin script, rather that the more Orthodox oriented Cyrillic.
Part of the problem is that Byzantium and Orthodoxy was THE major power nearby. Converting to Catholicism would have been ... unlikely. Rome was too far away and too weak for Kiev to want to go with them. If they wanted a powerful religion/alliance that was far enough away to be less threatening (entirely possible), they would surely have gone with Islam, as that makes for an even richer (if more distant) trading partner.

I can't imagine a PoD that would seriously have the Rus go Catholic.


And, once they're Orthodox, it's VERY unlikely that they'll go Catholic. The best possibility would be going Uniate (likely in exchange for some HUGE military aid from the West).
 

Wolfpaw

Banned
Russian devotional art, especially iconography would become more acceptable in the West.
Iconography wouldn't develop, nor would Russian devotional art as we know it. Russian iconography was pioneered and developed by imported Byzantine craftsmen who taught it to Russians.
Also this could lead to a very different ideal of Russia, as it would be unlikely as the Tsars would see themselves as the heirs to the "Second Rome" after 1453.
The "Third Rome" idea didn't effect things as much as most people think it did. It was just a sort of arcane legitimization for Muscovy's dominance and their various wars against the Ottomans and other Turkic peoples.
The departures from OTL history are almost unlimited, and mostly, I think, would be positive in that it could lead to a more Western oriented Russia, one far less prone to conflict with the West.
Westernization and Catholicism may very well retard Russia's growth. One of the reasons Muscovy and the Tsardom succeeded was because it left its tribal peoples alone both culturally and religiously and all it demanded was a rather affordable tribute every year.

The Russian Orthodox Church has a much weaker evangelical tradition than the Catholic Church. In fact, the Tsars and nobles got angry when Orthodox priests tried to convert non-believers because then they wouldn't have to pay tribute. When Catherine decided to forcibly convert trans-Ural nomads
and tribes (which had its roots in the Western European belief in "spreading civilization") there were countless and immensely bloody revolts that sometimes bordered on outright ethnocide.

If Russia obeyed Rome's calls to convert the unbelievers like the Spanish and Portuguese did to the peoples of Africa and India and the Philippines and the New World, it would completely retard Russian colonization of Siberia because you would immediately alienate local inhabitants by aggressive proselytizing.
 
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Zioneer

Banned
Well, I've got a rump Rus state that has converted to Catholicism in my Khazar TL. Of course, this was to acquire the mighty, also recently converted Norse soldiers of Sweyn Forkbeard as allies.

The Rus will basically become Slavic Vikings in my TL, so they'll likely choose similar cultural trends as the Scandinavians.
 
well, maybe when Luther starts, Russia converts to Protestantism ( maybe to antagonize Poland-Lithuania ) and allies with Sweden and/or England? ...

What about an industrial rev ?

Sigh too many butterflies ...
 
It isn't as unlikely as people here are suggesting.

The early conversions in the north were most likely Latin Rite, the first example of a Christian text from Russia was about a Catholic mass and Vladimir the Great's predecessor and brother likely converted to Catholicism.

I must ask- did Muallaf of Kiev and The Steppe Lion inspire all these topics?
 
It isn't as unlikely as people here are suggesting.

The early conversions in the north were most likely Latin Rite, the first example of a Christian text from Russia was about a Catholic mass and Vladimir the Great's predecessor and brother likely converted to Catholicism.

I must ask- did Muallaf of Kiev and The Steppe Lion inspire all these topics?

I have yet to read The Steppe Lion and while I enjoy the Muallaf of Kiev I was inspired while Watching "Russia land of the Tsars" on History International.
 
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