WI: 1917 Kaiser Wilhelm Executed, Germany breaks into 4 Kingdoms

I'm currently working on a timeline beginning in 1917 going until World War II.

Our point of divergence is March of 1917.

After 3 years of the most brutal conflict in the history of man, the German people decided they had enough. Seeing that things were not going their way and that a positive end to the war was not probable, the leaders of some of the historical kingdoms that made up the German Empire met and signed the Treaty of Mannheim. In doing so, they not only withdrew from the war ceding all German-held territories to their original owners, but also named Kaiser Wilhelm a war criminal and sentenced him to death. Furthermore, the German Empire would be divided into four Kingdoms: Prussia, Saxony, Bavaria, and Hannover. The people of Prussia elected their president Prince Maximilian of Baden to become their new King replacing the House of Hohenzollern with the House of Baden as the dominant house in Prussia. King Frederick Augustus III and King Ludwig III retain their titles as King of Saxony and Bavaria respectively, and Crown Prince Ernest Augustus is elevated to King Ernest Augustus II of Hannover.

With Germany no longer taking part in the war, the other central powers fell quickly, and the war was over by the end of the summer of 1917, before the Americans would have gotten involved. Since the German Empire went defunct relatively peacefully, and since the Kingdom of Hannover gave the long contested territory of Holstein to Denmark as a show of good faith, the Allied Powers went easier on the Germans and didn’t fully dismantle their military, though the Kingdom of Prussia always felt slighted by the agreements as their kingdom was smaller than that they historically held. Things stayed relatively in the region peaceful for the 1920s.

In December of 1921, the Anglo-Irish Treaty essentially gave the Irish people their independence, however, it would prove to be short-lived as the British reneged on their side of the bargain taking over Dublin in March of 1922 and keeping Ireland occupied indefinitely. A popular uprising took place in June of that year, but was put down violently. This led to a long resentment of the British culminating in several scuffles over the next few decades.

In Italy, Benito Mussolini came to power as prime minister in 1922. He ruled constitutionally until 1925, when he named himself Il Duce, or leader of Italy.

Things in post-war Prussia went rather poorly with the an incompetent government and hyperinflation which led to food shortages, civil unrest, and riots. The National Socialist German Worker’s Party (Nazi Party) promised to rebuild a strong central government, eliminate the monarchy which was viewed as weak, and to create a global empire for the Germanic people. When King Maximilian died in 1929, the government delayed any succession to the throne indefinitely.

A populist movement known as Nova Romana began led by Mussolini’s son-in-law Count Galeazzo Ciano. Nova Romana’s goal was to restore the glorious Roman Empire. In 1930, they managed to oust Mussolini from power and imprisoned him.

Although the economy was stronger in Saxony than in Prussia, everything changed drastically when King Friedrich Augustus III passed away in 1932. His oldest son Prince George had renounced his claim to the throne to become a Catholic priest, so Prince Friedrich Christian ascended to the throne as King Christan III.

In fall of 1932, in the Prussian parliamentary elections, the Nazi party won a majority of seats, and quickly set in motion a plan to overthrow the crown altogether.

In 1933, Saxon King Christian III saw what was happening in Prussia, and excited at the concept of a global Germanic empire, joined Saxony with Prussia in March 1933 as part of what would become the Third Reich. The Prussian Nazi party under their leader Adolf Hitler successfully passed legislation dissolving the monarchy and exiling the royal family. Later in the year, the Germans (as they will be called from now on) revoked the citizenship of all Jews, and all political enemies of the Nazi party. Rather than round them up, they were deported and many were taken in by Italy.

In 1935, Ciano had Mussolini publicly executed, and then named himself emperor of the New Roman Republic under the name Caesar Gallius Cianus.

In early 1938, Rome signed an agreement with Russia, Ireland, Scotland, and Third Reich forming New World Alliance. They secretly devised a plan to take over most of Europe and carve it up among themselves. Ireland and Scotland would take over Great Britain with the help of the German Luftwaffe, German Navy, and Roman Navy, Russia would take most of Eastern Europe and Scandinavia, Germany would take back all of the lands once controlled by the German people, and the Romans would try to reassemble the Roman Empire. This was a fairly loose alliance and there was a great deal of mistrust between the leaders of the nations.

On September 1, 1939, Russian tanks rolled into Poland in a new operational doctrine known as “Molniyenosnaya voyna” (lightning war). Meanwhile, Irish and Scottish troops with German air and naval support surprised the British by sweeping through Great Britain. In Europe, the German troops rolled through Denmark, Hannover, and the low countries (Netherlands, Belgium, and Luxembourg) on their way to France. The Romans fought their way through Corsica and Southern France with the goal of meeting up with the Germans in Paris. They also fought their way through Northern Africa expanding to Morocco in the west and the Nile in the east.

By November of 1939, the Scotch-Irish had driven through the entire island of Great Britain and surrounded London as the Germans and Romans bombed it. The Germans had a really hard time slugging their way through Bavaria even though the Bavarians had outdated military equipment. The battle for Bavaria lasted from November of 1939 through February of 1940 when the Germans finally seized Bavaria completing the forceful reunification of Germany. The Germans and Romans met in Paris in December of 1939 completing the takeover of Western Europe.

In January of 1940, under the cover of a brutal winter storm, the British pulled off an amazing escape known as Operation Dynamo, evacuating the remainder of the military and government from Great Britain through the Mediterranean and Suez canal into India where they would rule in exile. This couldn't have happened any later as the Romans would seize Gibraltar and Suez only weeks later effectively closing the Mediterranean.

In March of 1940, the Romans did the unthinkable and turned on the Scotch-Irish and seized Great Britain for themselves forcing them back to Ireland. The Germans did and said nothing about this betrayal so as to not risk offending the Romans, but the Russians condemned the act and dissolved their alliance with Germany and Rome.

...and that's all I have so far. At this point I have ideas of where I would like this to go, but I'd like some input on what I have thus far. I'll take your feedback and then expand from here.
 
Let's take this step by step.

I'm currently working on a timeline beginning in 1917 going until World War II.

Our point of divergence is March of 1917.

After 3 years of the most brutal conflict in the history of man, the German people decided they had enough. Seeing that things were not going their way and that a positive end to the war was not probable, the leaders of some of the historical kingdoms that made up the German Empire met and signed the Treaty of Mannheim. In doing so, they not only withdrew from the war ceding all German-held territories to their original owners, but also named Kaiser Wilhelm a war criminal and sentenced him to death. Furthermore, the German Empire would be divided into four Kingdoms: Prussia, Saxony, Bavaria, and Hannover. The people of Prussia elected their president Prince Maximilian of Baden to become their new King replacing the House of Hohenzollern with the House of Baden as the dominant house in Prussia. King Frederick Augustus III and King Ludwig III retain their titles as King of Saxony and Bavaria respectively, and Crown Prince Ernest Augustus is elevated to King Ernest Augustus II of Hannover.

First, the German military in World War I was Prussian. It may have incorporated units from the other kingdoms, mostly Saxons and Bavarians, but those forces depended on Prussia - not Germany as a whole - for leadership and logistical support. There is no way that the General Staff would have accepted the overthrow of not only the German Emperor but also the King of Prussia by the other German kings, regardless of how the war was going.

With Germany no longer taking part in the war, the other central powers fell quickly, and the war was over by the end of the summer of 1917, before the Americans would have gotten involved. Since the German Empire went defunct relatively peacefully, and since the Kingdom of Hannover gave the long contested territory of Holstein to Denmark as a show of good faith, the Allied Powers went easier on the Germans and didn’t fully dismantle their military, though the Kingdom of Prussia always felt slighted by the agreements as their kingdom was smaller than that they historically held. Things stayed relatively in the region peaceful for the 1920s.

In December of 1921, the Anglo-Irish Treaty essentially gave the Irish people their independence, however, it would prove to be short-lived as the British reneged on their side of the bargain taking over Dublin in March of 1922 and keeping Ireland occupied indefinitely. A popular uprising took place in June of that year, but was put down violently. This led to a long resentment of the British culminating in several scuffles over the next few decades.

In Italy, Benito Mussolini came to power as prime minister in 1922. He ruled constitutionally until 1925, when he named himself Il Duce, or leader of Italy.

The British going back on their "treaty" seems unlikely, especially after the long and costly war they had just fought in Europe. Ireland had been giving the English trouble for three centuries, and they'd probably just want to be done with it at this point. Mussolini pops up as OTL.

Things in post-war Prussia went rather poorly with the an incompetent government and hyperinflation which led to food shortages, civil unrest, and riots. The National Socialist German Worker’s Party (Nazi Party) promised to rebuild a strong central government, eliminate the monarchy which was viewed as weak, and to create a global empire for the Germanic people. When King Maximilian died in 1929, the government delayed any succession to the throne indefinitely.

Although the economy was stronger in Saxony than in Prussia, everything changed drastically when King Friedrich Augustus III passed away in 1932. His oldest son Prince George had renounced his claim to the throne to become a Catholic priest, so Prince Friedrich Christian ascended to the throne as King Christan III.

In fall of 1932, in the Prussian parliamentary elections, the Nazi party won a majority of seats, and quickly set in motion a plan to overthrow the crown altogether.

In 1933, Saxon King Christian III saw what was happening in Prussia, and excited at the concept of a global Germanic empire, joined Saxony with Prussia in March 1933 as part of what would become the Third Reich. The Prussian Nazi party under their leader Adolf Hitler successfully passed legislation dissolving the monarchy and exiling the royal family. Later in the year, the Germans (as they will be called from now on) revoked the citizenship of all Jews, and all political enemies of the Nazi party. Rather than round them up, they were deported and many were taken in by Italy.

Why do the Nazis start in Prussia instead of Bavaria? Anton Drexler, who founded the NSDAP, was from Munich. Hitler was born in Austria and fought in the OTL Bavarian army in World War I. Rohm was from Munich and served in the Bavarian army. Eckart was from the Upper Palatinate, Hess fought in a Bavarian artillery regiment, and Streicher was from Augsburg. Goring and Himmler were also, of course, from Bavaria. I just can't see an NSDAP with Hitler as its leader originating in Prussia. Anyways, Prussia had always been the heart of German power because it was the most heavily industrialized. Saxony being more economically stable than Prussia is unlikely.

Furthermore, even if the Nazis did take power in the Prussian legislature, it wouldn't have been a sovereign body like the English parliament and definitely would not have had the power to dissolve and exile the monarchy.




A populist movement known as Nova Romana began led by Mussolini’s son-in-law Count Galeazzo Ciano. Nova Romana’s goal was to restore the glorious Roman Empire. In 1930, they managed to oust Mussolini from power and imprisoned him.

In 1935, Ciano had Mussolini publicly executed, and then named himself emperor of the New Roman Republic under the name Caesar Gallius Cianus.

How is "Nova Romana" any different from what Mussolini was trying to do? Even if it was different, how would they have gained enough support in the heavily industrialized Po Valley, where the people saw themselves as Italians firstly and citizens of the medieval-era city-state regions secondly, to overthrow Mussolini? There were no Roman revanchists around in the 20th century, because they were all gone by the 7th century. The best the Italians could hope for was to raise Italy to the position of power in the Mediterranean that Rome had once held, not to become Romans themselves.





In early 1938, Rome signed an agreement with Russia, Ireland, Scotland, and Third Reich forming New World Alliance. They secretly devised a plan to take over most of Europe and carve it up among themselves. Ireland and Scotland would take over Great Britain with the help of the German Luftwaffe, German Navy, and Roman Navy, Russia would take most of Eastern Europe and Scandinavia, Germany would take back all of the lands once controlled by the German people, and the Romans would try to reassemble the Roman Empire. This was a fairly loose alliance and there was a great deal of mistrust between the leaders of the nations.

First of all, where is the Soviet Union? A March 1917 POD is not early enough to prevent the Russian Civil War and definitely not early enough to maintain the Romanov dynasty in the Russian Empire. If this was the Russian Empire, why would they ally themselves with their mortal enemy, the Germans, especially after the ruling party in Germany overthrew their own monarchy through legislative fiat? Next, how are Ireland and Scotland suddenly independent nations hostile to England. Aren't the British still having trouble occupying Ireland decades after the signing of the Anglo-Irish Treaty? Even if the Scots did start a war with England and Wales (which alone should be enough to send this whole thing straight to ASB), there's no way they could successfully invade England. The population of Ireland and Scotland combined was less than ten million. England's population at the time would've been about 40 million, and there's no way that Germany could challenge English naval superiority in the North Sea. Also, what do the Russians want with Scandinavia unless they're trying to break out into the Atlantic?

On September 1, 1939, Russian tanks rolled into Poland in a new operational doctrine known as “Molniyenosnaya voyna” (lightning war). Meanwhile, Irish and Scottish troops with German air and naval support surprised the British by sweeping through Great Britain. In Europe, the German troops rolled through Denmark, Hannover, and the low countries (Netherlands, Belgium, and Luxembourg) on their way to France. The Romans fought their way through Corsica and Southern France with the goal of meeting up with the Germans in Paris. They also fought their way through Northern Africa expanding to Morocco in the west and the Nile in the east.

By November of 1939, the Scotch-Irish had driven through the entire island of Great Britain and surrounded London as the Germans and Romans bombed it. The Germans had a really hard time slugging their way through Bavaria even though the Bavarians had outdated military equipment. The battle for Bavaria lasted from November of 1939 through February of 1940 when the Germans finally seized Bavaria completing the forceful reunification of Germany. The Germans and Romans met in Paris in December of 1939 completing the takeover of Western Europe.

The English would easily be able to stop any Scottish invasion before it got close to Liverpool or Manchester, to say nothing of "sweeping through Great Britain." In Europe, how are the Prusso-Saxon forces able to repeat OTL Nazi Germany's military feats in six months with only the eastern half of Germany as their starting position? There is no conceivable way this could happen, especially without Bavaria.

In January of 1940, under the cover of a brutal winter storm, the British pulled off an amazing escape known as Operation Dynamo, evacuating the remainder of the military and government from Great Britain through the Mediterranean and Suez canal into India where they would rule in exile. This couldn't have happened any later as the Romans would seize Gibraltar and Suez only weeks later effectively closing the Mediterranean.

Nope, nope, nope, nope, nope, and nope. Isn't going to happen. No British government could ever abandon Britain and still retain even a shred of legitimacy. Even if they did attempt it, how did they get through the Suez when the Romans had taken Cairo a month before? How did they get through the Mediterranean when the Romans had the naval superiority necessary to mount a successful campaign in North Africa. I don't know if this gets across the monumental stupidity of a plot point like this, but I hope it does.

In March of 1940, the Romans did the unthinkable and turned on the Scotch-Irish and seized Great Britain for themselves forcing them back to Ireland. The Germans did and said nothing about this betrayal so as to not risk offending the Romans, but the Russians condemned the act and dissolved their alliance with Germany and Rome.

How are the Italians invading England - successfully, I might add - when they don't even control northern France? The Germans had those bases and they still lost the Battle of Britain. Even if they were able to do it, why would the "Romans" invade England when they still didn't have control of more traditionally "Roman" territories like Iberia, Greece, or Anatolia?

...and that's all I have so far. At this point I have ideas of where I would like this to go, but I'd like some input on what I have thus far. I'll take your feedback and then expand from here.

I don't like to criticize people's work too harshly, and I don't have to worry about that here because this "timeline" cannot be criticized too harshly. What I see here is somebody who knows what happened but hasn't put the time and effort into understanding why history happened that way. That, more than any sort of creativity or writing ability, is the key to good alternate history. Instead of studying singular events, you need to look at trends. Rome didn't fall because it lost a discrete series of battles over a few hundred years, and it wouldn't be around today if it had won just one of those battles. It fell because of an extremely complex web of foreign pressures, economic degeneracy, and social ills that stretched deep into the nation's roots and foundation. Investigate the roots of political movements, study how and why wars are fought - from both strategic and political points of view - and try to come to grips with the relationships between the political, social, and economic facets of a nation. My immediate suggestion would be to find good alternate histories and then compare them to accounts of how those events actually happened. Once you understand how cause-and-effect works in a historical context, you'll be able to see how a slight change in a cause could lead to a massively different effect.
 
JCRG...

...NJS is right about doing research. Start reading histories of the various European states and the British Isles and Scandinavia. Russia and the North African states as well, if you can. I freely admit it was two years and a lot of skulking on sidelines before I started my first major TL. AH.com critics are very harsh, but made me grow as a writer.


Don't give up - research everything and then look for the 'what ifs' of history and go for it! But not Operation Sealion, because it was heavily discussed and wargamed by German and British senior officers in around 1974.

Good luck, lad!
 
Also, I'd guess you'd have to be more clear about the initial peace treaty. No matter how, if France is not decisively defeated it will want its pound of flesh to end the war - Alsace-Moselle.
 
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