Well, it's not a continent in the sense "a contiguous mass of land" as it is only composed of Islands, including Australia (which is an island, a HUGE island). However, it is considered equivalent to the other continents. Ask someone about the five continents and he will tell you : "Europe, America, Africa, Asia and Oceania". Also, that's why there are 5 rings on the Olympic Flag: one for each continent.Rainbow Sparkle said:
Why so few SA TL's?
- Thread starter Rainbow Sparkle
- Start date
For the same reason there are so few African timelines, most members come from Europe and North America. So they are most concerned with European and American history. Not to mention South American history is usually ignored in other continents, so its very unknown to a lot of people.
BlondieBC
Banned
North America, South America, Asia, Africa, Europe. I think this will be the most common answer.
RainbowSparkle, I see you joined last December, don't know just when. DValdron seems to have dropped off the face of AH these past few months, but at that time, he was still posting to Axis of Andes. When I nominated it for a Turtledove I created confusion because technically the POD is just before 1900, so the moderators moved it there, although every interesting deviation from OTL happens well into the 20th century and the action is mainly set in the WWII era.
It's entirely South American and it's gripping. Maybe if you go over there and read it, you'll be so impressed you can provoke DValdron into posting there.
DValdron, in addition to Green Antarctica (which is based on a Geographic--more climatological--POD to be sure and hence is in ASB) which centers on a place that put these other underused locations to shame for sheer out-there-ness, has also had a thread going based in Polynesia (again, with massive geologic POD to raise up "Lemuria," ie the OTL sunken continent just a bit submerged in the region of New Zealand). And much more recently he and DirtyCommie have launched Lands of Ice and Mice which is set in the frakkin' Arctic, without any sort of geological or climatic mitigation whatsoever. The alt-Inuit, known to Europeans of the timeline as "Thule," have agriculture and civilization based on plants and domesticated animals known to our timeline as candidates for cultivars.
So like I say, check out AoA, if you like it look at these other DValdron threads, and remind him he's got some fans out here! He's someone unafraid to take Alt History far from the familiar stamping grounds of Europe and North America.
It's entirely South American and it's gripping. Maybe if you go over there and read it, you'll be so impressed you can provoke DValdron into posting there.
DValdron, in addition to Green Antarctica (which is based on a Geographic--more climatological--POD to be sure and hence is in ASB) which centers on a place that put these other underused locations to shame for sheer out-there-ness, has also had a thread going based in Polynesia (again, with massive geologic POD to raise up "Lemuria," ie the OTL sunken continent just a bit submerged in the region of New Zealand). And much more recently he and DirtyCommie have launched Lands of Ice and Mice which is set in the frakkin' Arctic, without any sort of geological or climatic mitigation whatsoever. The alt-Inuit, known to Europeans of the timeline as "Thule," have agriculture and civilization based on plants and domesticated animals known to our timeline as candidates for cultivars.
So like I say, check out AoA, if you like it look at these other DValdron threads, and remind him he's got some fans out here! He's someone unafraid to take Alt History far from the familiar stamping grounds of Europe and North America.
Only in the USA, most of the world only has five inhabited continents. American exceptionalisim at its best
BlondieBC
Banned
Only in the USA, most of the world only has five inhabited continents. American exceptionalisim at its best
If we are eliminating continents, the first one should be Europe, which is a medium size peninsula of the EuroAsia landmass. At least North and South America have been separated by an ocean within the last 10 million years.
I'm presuming that the old Viceroyalty is restored about 1850 and that policy/circumstances make Argentina very attractive for immigrants and those with technical skills. This allows her to move north and eventually west in wars over the next century. By the dawn of WWII the UK is desperate for an ally who can supply food, materials, and manpower. Argentina quietly negotiates for disputed land as part of its alliance which the UK happily gives, either outright or in the form of 99-year "leases" (almost everything mentioned north of the equator). They subsequently recieve a lot of technological assistance as Britain moves many of her top scientists out of harm's way and collaborates with Argentina as she will later do with America. By the 1970s the US and USSR are well established with their space race and Brazil / ARgentina begin a game of oneupsmanship, resulting in a Brazilian flag on the moon in 1998. Argentina follows in 2000 with China in 2001 and the US again in 2002, the race for Mars is set...
Their is no Oceanian continent, their is an Australian Continent, which is comprised of mainland Australia (which yes, is a continental landmass), Tasmania, New Guinea, the Aur Islands and the Raja Ampat Islands.
Yeah, I was about to say, Oceania isn't a continent, unless Australia got roped into the group and they decided to consider it part of the group.
Only in the USA, most of the world only has five inhabited continents. American exceptionalisim at its best
That wouldn't make any sense. Its North America, which means, all the Caribbean, Central America, America and Canada. How is that American exceptionalism?
Because only Americans (and Canadians?) actually refer to a North and South America.
maverick had been very knowledgeable about southern South American history and wrote a few very good Argentine-centered TLs. Pity he got banned for abuse of mod powers... He also did a few nice Japanese TLs, IIRC.
I've been toying with the idea of a TL with a Latin American setting, but I'm kind of affraid I wouldn't be completely up to the job, being as far removed from SA as I am. Even good research can't counter-balance some mistakes or a badly depicted atmosphere.
And Europeans. (Though we always consider Central America and the Caribbean as wholly separate regions on their own.)
I've been toying with the idea of a TL with a Latin American setting, but I'm kind of affraid I wouldn't be completely up to the job, being as far removed from SA as I am. Even good research can't counter-balance some mistakes or a badly depicted atmosphere.
And Europeans.
(Though we always consider Central America and the Caribbean as wholly separate regions on their own.)
wolf_brother
Banned
Don't you know nothing ever happens in South America, or for that matter Africa, Southeast Asia, or Australia, aside from being colonized by the great powers (and the author's personal favorites) of the TL?
I would guess that in Brazil they also refer to North and South America.
The Sandman
Banned
I'd say part of the problem is that the really fascinatingly different stuff would involve the pre-Columbian civilizations. Unfortunately, there's no good way to get around the civilization-wrecking epidemics that will happen shortly after European contact, and unless you've also somehow managed to make pre-Columbian technology vastly more advanced then you'll be hard-pressed to avoid Europeans taking advantage of and eventually conquering the shattered local polities.
It's rather disheartening to look into doing a TL and realize that ASB intervention is about the only way to avoid a "rocks fall everyone dies" scenario.
It's rather disheartening to look into doing a TL and realize that ASB intervention is about the only way to avoid a "rocks fall everyone dies" scenario.
I don't understand why people are saying North and South America are the same. If anything the five rings in the Olympics should be NA, SA, Eurasia, Australia, and Africa, because there isn't a good reason to divide Europe from Asia.
A few reasons (most of which have been already said):
1) There aren't many Southamericans here.
2) It takes time and commitment to write a TL, specially one in anonther language. Maverick was great doing so, unfortunately he's no longer here.
3) There are many interesting PODs, the thing is, I don't know if most of you'd find them interesting, since it wouldn't change that much worldwide. For example, last month I was reading a book about the colonization of Northwestern Argentina in the second past of the XVI century, I period I knew almost anything (I knew about the colonization of the eastern part of Argentina, whose first settlers came directly from Spain and I had a vague idea that the Northwest was colonized by settlers comming from Perú, but I didn't knew much more). When I read it, I came across very interesting PODs that could have delayed the colonization of the region for quite a long while, maybe even for a century or more. But then what? Surrounded by Spanish settlers in Eastern Argentina, Bolivia and in Chile, I don't see what could the natives do that would change anything else worldwide.
And that happens to many ideas I come across. There will always be readirers interested in TLs where American history goes slighlty different, but how many would be interesting in reading about a slightly different colonizatrion of the Pampas in the XIX century, or a different outcome of Argentinian civil wars in the first half of the XIX century.
4) I don't know how it is in the rest of South American country, but at least in Argentina, we aren't taught much about the history of our neighbours. We know more about the history of Europe and the US than about the history of Prú, Colombia or Venezuela in the XIXth and XXth centuries. We don't know even that much about brazil or even Chile. So, while we could have an easier access to materials about these countries than most of those who live in the US or Europe, and we can also read it easily, we'd still have to do a lot of research to write a TL about any South American country other than our own (Again, I don't know if this is the same for other Southamerican countries).
5) There's not that much info about Precolumbian peoples (which many would find interesting) and the info that exists is extremely fragmented. You've got the Chronics of the conquerors, you've got some written by modern antropologists, you've got some by archeologists, but the information is too scattered. The info that does exists is very specific, scholarly, and not always available online. For instance, I've always wondered if an authoctonous civilization could have existed in the river plate bassin, but I don't know where to find if there were native plants that could have been domesticated, nor if the land that borders Partaná River is as fertile as the one that borders the Eufrates, for example.
1) There aren't many Southamericans here.
2) It takes time and commitment to write a TL, specially one in anonther language. Maverick was great doing so, unfortunately he's no longer here.
3) There are many interesting PODs, the thing is, I don't know if most of you'd find them interesting, since it wouldn't change that much worldwide. For example, last month I was reading a book about the colonization of Northwestern Argentina in the second past of the XVI century, I period I knew almost anything (I knew about the colonization of the eastern part of Argentina, whose first settlers came directly from Spain and I had a vague idea that the Northwest was colonized by settlers comming from Perú, but I didn't knew much more). When I read it, I came across very interesting PODs that could have delayed the colonization of the region for quite a long while, maybe even for a century or more. But then what? Surrounded by Spanish settlers in Eastern Argentina, Bolivia and in Chile, I don't see what could the natives do that would change anything else worldwide.
And that happens to many ideas I come across. There will always be readirers interested in TLs where American history goes slighlty different, but how many would be interesting in reading about a slightly different colonizatrion of the Pampas in the XIX century, or a different outcome of Argentinian civil wars in the first half of the XIX century.
4) I don't know how it is in the rest of South American country, but at least in Argentina, we aren't taught much about the history of our neighbours. We know more about the history of Europe and the US than about the history of Prú, Colombia or Venezuela in the XIXth and XXth centuries. We don't know even that much about brazil or even Chile. So, while we could have an easier access to materials about these countries than most of those who live in the US or Europe, and we can also read it easily, we'd still have to do a lot of research to write a TL about any South American country other than our own (Again, I don't know if this is the same for other Southamerican countries).
5) There's not that much info about Precolumbian peoples (which many would find interesting) and the info that exists is extremely fragmented. You've got the Chronics of the conquerors, you've got some written by modern antropologists, you've got some by archeologists, but the information is too scattered. The info that does exists is very specific, scholarly, and not always available online. For instance, I've always wondered if an authoctonous civilization could have existed in the river plate bassin, but I don't know where to find if there were native plants that could have been domesticated, nor if the land that borders Partaná River is as fertile as the one that borders the Eufrates, for example.