Why Ottoman Emp. didn't try to make colonies in new world?

Status
Not open for further replies.
It would have been difficult for the Ottomans to thoroughly beat the Portuguese, their only realistic sea route to the east. It was a combination of a lot of things though, like huge hostile borders and that they had a more urgent naval theater in the eastern Med. The kind of ships best suited for that area are not the best for the Indian Ocean so their attention and resources especially were divided. It takes a lot to run a ship building program especially one so far from the "home base" in Constantinople and then they started to fall behind in terms of naval tech (post 1600s).

I don't think it's impossible but it's a tough thing to bring about.
 

Anaxagoras

Banned
Spain always colonises Central Asia when I play the 1000 AD scenario on Civ4. They start out by taking a barbarian city in the Caucasus via the Black Sea. I think the AI needs tweaking ;)

Well, if it works on Civ4, then it has to be able to work in actual history, right?;)
 
Spain always colonises Central Asia when I play the 1000 AD scenario on Civ4. They start out by taking a barbarian city in the Caucasus via the Black Sea. I think the AI needs tweaking ;)

Hell with 1000AD, that happens to me in 18Civs! I start as Aztecs, conquer the Americas, build up my conquering fleets of riflemen, and descend upon Europe in 1400. I conquer Spain...only to discover that they have outposts in the Urals. :confused:
 

Thande

Donor
Maybe the Ottomans could be given some Caribbean islands as part of one of those massive swap-around treaties, although I don't see why they'd need them. (Maximum irony points if it's the Turks and Cacos Islands :p )
 
Maybe the Ottomans could be given some Caribbean islands as part of one of those massive swap-around treaties, although I don't see why they'd need them. (Maximum irony points if it's the Turks and Cacos Islands :p )

Probably one of those "Well, we have to give them SOMETHING for their troubles in this war, and we'll be damned if it's any more Balkan territory - hey, how about Saint-Barthélemy, it's not like the Swedes need it."

Hrmm, thoughts on the above scenario - the Ottomans manage to get their act before the Napoleonic Wars, and take the opportunity to put the boot in against Austria, harkening back to the age-old Franco-Ottoman Alliance of Convenience as a proud tradition. Nappy is slightly uncertain as to what to do with them after they reclaim Banat and fully reassert their authority over Wallachia and Moldavia (much to Russia's chagrin), and gives them Saint-Barthélemy as something to keep them vaguely occupied.
 
This, and their only access to the open sea was controlled by one of their fiercest enemies, Spain.

Because everyone has to go to America :rolleyes:
However, I can see the Ottomans attempting some degree of Indian Ocean colonization under the right circumstances. Ottoman Australia, anybody?

Australia seems a bit far out of their reach. Also, why would they want to go there? There's nothing there asides from lots of 'empty' land as far as the Ottomans would be concerned, and they already have plenty of that.
---

re: Indian Ocean Ottomans;

WI the Ottomans, seeking to circumvent the European powers who were searching for alternate trade routes to the Far East, decide to set up forts and trade posts along the Eastern African coast line..

re: Caribbean Sea Ottomans;

That'd be a really interesting TL. Do the Ottomans actually invest into their island possessions, or are they simply bartering tools to use in the peace conferences after the next war?

Also, depending on the POD and timeframe, how does the US react to the above? It might be one thing for a few European powers to have small island possessions in the Caribbean, but would the US think differently about the very non-white, non-christian, Ottoman Empire having a toe in the door?
 

loughery111

Banned
Spain always colonises Central Asia when I play the 1000 AD scenario on Civ4. They start out by taking a barbarian city in the Caucasus via the Black Sea. I think the AI needs tweaking ;)

Agreed... even in the modified versions they start off by taking over the barbarians that are standing in for what I assume to be the Khazars. Then for some reason they wind up expanding that holding... odd. Why the Russians never manage that is beyond me.
 
Last edited:
Ottomans had no reason to.

The better option is go east into persia southeast to arabia or south and southwest to colonize africa.

Spain does not like the ottomans most european power's don't like the ottomans correct me if I am wrong.

if they do this and have some other stepping stones along the way then they could have some colonies maybe around california but that may be asb
 
Relations between the Sublime Porte and the rest of Europe were... complex to say the least. I wouldn't characterize it as dislike. Spain/Portugal and the Ottomans certainly had a generally antagonistic relationship but for the rest of Europe it was a pretty fluid and dynamic relationship.

Spain does not like the ottomans most european power's don't like the ottomans correct me if I am wrong.

if they do this and have some other stepping stones along the way then they could have some colonies maybe around california but that may be asb
 
But Spanish conquistador killed all Mayans, Aztecs, Incas and other local tribes, and today there is nothing about them! Only some ancient ruins.

This is not true. Most of the native population simply intermarried with the Spanish. True, many were killed, but don't you think there is a reason many Hispanic people look nothing like Spaniards.

The idea that we know nothing about them is also not true. Their cultures are fairly well known to us, both in the original form and in the ways they've influenced Mexico and Peru. The Mayans and Incans even survive as a viable ethnic group.
 
This is not true. Most of the native population simply intermarried with the Spanish. True, many were killed, but don't you think there is a reason many Hispanic people look nothing like Spaniards.

The idea that we know nothing about them is also not true. Their cultures are fairly well known to us, both in the original form and in the ways they've influenced Mexico and Peru. The Mayans and Incans even survive as a viable ethnic group.

Yeah, I'll support this by saying that the majority of the population of Latin America is of so-caled "mestizo" blood, meaning mixed Spanish and indian. Even Cortes, during his conquest of the Aztec empire, wasn't constantly "RAWR KILL KILL KILL!!!1." Besides, does the OP think that the Ottomans would let the Aztecs and Incas and Mayans keep their human sacrifice going just because they let Orthodox Christians remain?
 
Yeah, I'll support this by saying that the majority of the population of Latin America is of so-caled "mestizo" blood, meaning mixed Spanish and indian. Even Cortes, during his conquest of the Aztec empire, wasn't constantly "RAWR KILL KILL KILL!!!1." Besides, does the OP think that the Ottomans would let the Aztecs and Incas and Mayans keep their human sacrifice going just because they let Orthodox Christians remain?

Not at all. They were no people of the book. I can see intense Islamification happening in the Americas.
 
Not at all. They were no people of the book. I can see intense Islamification happening in the Americas.
Hindus were not people of the book either. Im still quite unsure as to whether a Islamic conquest of mesoamerica would lead to mass conversions to Islam. What would the Muslims have to gain from it? And what would be the negative consequences?
 
Hindus were not people of the book either. Im still quite unsure as to whether a Islamic conquest of mesoamerica would lead to mass conversions to Islam. What would the Muslims have to gain from it? And what would be the negative consequences?

I think they would definitely want to stop the human sacrifice, at the very least.
 
Agreed... even in the modified versions they start off by taking over the barbarians that are standing in for what I assume to be the Khazars. Then for some reason they wind up expanding that holding... odd. Why the Russians never manage that is beyond me.

Sorry for bumping this, but when I play that the Vikings get wiped out by the Spanish, and maybe once or twice they get a city in Canada. Russia stays in Europe, but avoids the Arctic Sea, and the Mongols end up either being destroyed by China or destroying China, they never do anything else. China gets harassed by the barbarians from Indochina, and the Mongols, and Japan does absolutely nothing. I usually play as France, I colonize the north Atlantic islands and get some cities into Canada. I then proceed to war with the Aztecs, then make peace, then get involved in some European conflict. I proceed afterwards to go on an age of exploration and get colonies into Australia and South Africa and South America and the Caribbean. The rest of Europe, excluding Spain, stay in Europe, as Spain ends up in Siberia. I then get bored and end up putting Japanese in Korea, Chinese in California, Europeans along the east coast of North America, and put a few Arab and Ottoman colonies in Venezuela and Mexico. Then I proceed to enlarge Russia and the Mongols and have the Mongols wage war against Russia and the Ottomans and the Byzantines and then eventually put a massive horde of them into east Germany and Poland. I seriously think they need to retry that scenario in Civ5 G&K.
 

CalBear

Moderator
Donor
Monthly Donor
Sorry for bumping this, but when I play that the Vikings get wiped out by the Spanish, and maybe once or twice they get a city in Canada. Russia stays in Europe, but avoids the Arctic Sea, and the Mongols end up either being destroyed by China or destroying China, they never do anything else. China gets harassed by the barbarians from Indochina, and the Mongols, and Japan does absolutely nothing. I usually play as France, I colonize the north Atlantic islands and get some cities into Canada. I then proceed to war with the Aztecs, then make peace, then get involved in some European conflict. I proceed afterwards to go on an age of exploration and get colonies into Australia and South Africa and South America and the Caribbean. The rest of Europe, excluding Spain, stay in Europe, as Spain ends up in Siberia. I then get bored and end up putting Japanese in Korea, Chinese in California, Europeans along the east coast of North America, and put a few Arab and Ottoman colonies in Venezuela and Mexico. Then I proceed to enlarge Russia and the Mongols and have the Mongols wage war against Russia and the Ottomans and the Byzantines and then eventually put a massive horde of them into east Germany and Poland. I seriously think they need to retry that scenario in Civ5 G&K.

Wait...

You Necro'd a FOUR YEAR DEAD thread to talk about Civ 5?

You SO don't want to do this every again.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top