Why didn't the Soviet Union let its citizens leave?

Why were the Soviet Union, and communist governments in general, restrictive of travel abroad? Wouldn't it have been more useful to allow dissidents to leave than to keep them in?
 
Why were the Soviet Union, and communist governments in general, restrictive of travel abroad? Wouldn't it have been more useful to allow dissidents to leave than to keep them in?

Because everyone tried to leave, not just political activists. Scientists, engineers, etc.
 
Why were the Soviet Union, and communist governments in general, restrictive of travel abroad? Wouldn't it have been more useful to allow dissidents to leave than to keep them in?

Because the State had invested in their education and wasn't exactly keen on letting the best and brightest go and reinforce its worst enemies in the West. That was the basic rationale behind the turning of entire nations into giant jails.
That said, there's no worse admission of defeat and failure than barring your subjects from emigrating.
 

Jack Brisco

Banned
Because everyone tried to leave, not just political activists. Scientists, engineers, etc.

Yup. So many left East Germany through Berlin so quickly the East German government built the Berlin Wall. Just a public statement about the real popularity of any Communist regime.
 
Because then all the qualified people with real options (plus really everyone else) would be stampeding to get out.
 
It wouldn't be just the intellectuals. Emigration was restricted in Soviet Russia as well as other Communist and totalitarian governments due to power issues; someone who left said countries could easily fight back somehow against those governments - be it leading military forces, rallying support from other countries or disseminating propaganda.
 
Even those with only a high school education, or less, were considered to have a debt to the state for their upbringing and education. Leaving the state deprived the state of your labor, and potential military service thereby wrecking/sabotaging the construction of true socialism. Naturally the more skilled or talented the individual was the greater the "sabotage". Plus, of course, the proganda from the capitalist countries falsified the reality on the other side, and one had to protect these citizens from exploitation.
 

raharris1973

Gone Fishin'
Donor
Monthly Donor
Occasionally, Communist regimes disobeyed this formula, reversed it, or threatened to.

Yugoslavia I think disregarded the formula.

Cuba reversed the formula with the Mariel boat lift.

When Carter asked Deng Xiaoping about emigration restrictions, Deng said he could give the US 10 million peasants a year, and the conversation ended.

Is there any plausible scenario where Communist governments are judging the value of their citizens and doing a deliberate exportation of those with lower labor value?
 
The Soviet Union was a lie. That lie being that dictatorship was somehow democracy; that loss of freedom was freedom. And people fled that lie, when given the chance, thus proving it as a lie. And the Soviets would not tolerate that. Their treatment of exodus was the same as their rule, and that of their puppet leaders in other nations. Citizens were expected to embrace the lie, tolerate it, or keep quiet and work with others. And when they did not, the hammer fell. The simple act of leaving was protest and dissent the Communists would never tolerate.
 

Wallet

Banned
Occasionally, Communist regimes disobeyed this formula, reversed it, or threatened to.

Yugoslavia I think disregarded the formula.

Cuba reversed the formula with the Mariel boat lift.

When Carter asked Deng Xiaoping about emigration restrictions, Deng said he could give the US 10 million peasants a year, and the conversation ended.

Is there any plausible scenario where Communist governments are judging the value of their citizens and doing a deliberate exportation of those with lower labor value?
Quote about the carter story?
 
Quote about the carter story?

It seems a little implausible, because, in asking China to allow more emigration, Carter wasn't(I assume) making any sort of commitment to taking in every single Chinese person who left. So Deng's Gotcha wouldn't really work.

I believe with the Mariel boatlift, the idea was that the Americans DID have a policy(driven by ideology) of taking in anyone who fled Communist Cuba, so Castro dedided to open up his jails and hoist the Yanks their own petard. (At least, that's how I remember it; further details would be of interest)
 
I did a quick search, and found a reference to that quote from China Daily, the PRC's official English newspaper:

http://usa.chinadaily.com.cn/epaper/2015-09/25/content_21981305.htm

Yeah, but the article just repeats it as an unsourced anecdote(with wording different from the rendering in this thread). It could be something like that apocryphal quote "You kill 700 million Chinese in a nuclear war, there will still be 300 million left to fight you", which I've heard atrributed to Mao; but also to the Chinese ambasador to Italy, and I'm sure others.

I'm just always a little suspicious when historical events are claimed to have turned on one pithy quote. Interesting discussion about the origins of the quote, in any case.
 
The idea that a country might let troublemakers and dissidents leave has merit, as it's even been practiced today, in kleptocracies. If those who would leave are most likely to vote against the ruling party, then it would be in the interest of the corrupt elites to foster conditions which promote emigration. Although, the theory of people owing the country for education and so on also has some merit.
 
Same as the others have said. If you rule with an iron fist, you want to make sure your citizens don't leave to your worst enemy.
 
It could be something like that apocryphal quote "You kill 700 million Chinese in a nuclear war, there will still be 300 million left to fight you", which I've heard atrributed to Mao; but also to the Chinese ambasador to Italy, and I'm sure others.

Hm. I might have to stand corrected on that Mao quote being apocryphal.

Mao’s exact words were: “I’m not afraid of nuclear war. There are 2.7 billion people in the world; it doesn’t matter if some are killed. China has a population of 600 million; even if half of them are killed, there are still 300 million people left. I’m not afraid of anyone.”

Although this famous quote has been passed around among ordinary Chinese, there are still many who have refused to believe it.

Though that's from a Falun Gong run site, the Epoch Times, so I'm not sure how credible they are. And I've heard different versions of the quote(eg. saying that the remaining Chinese "will fight you").

(This site may or may not have been responsible for some minor problems I had loading things on my computer screen)

The Epoch Times
 
Why were the Soviet Union, and communist governments in general, restrictive of travel abroad? Wouldn't it have been more useful to allow dissidents to leave than to keep them in?
My option there would not be anybody left to oppress if there was a open travel out of those countries.
 
Post WWII, there was also the general paranoia in the USSR. Letting people out would expose "secrets". While this sounds a bit absurd, the amount of information that was not shared with the outside world was truly stunning. IIRC, Gorky, the entire city, was closed to foreigners.

And there is the bigger issue. What if they want to come back? They return to the "workers paradise" with stories of grocery stores with full shelves, apartments for everyone, and the like.
 
Why were the Soviet Union, and communist governments in general, restrictive of travel abroad? Wouldn't it have been more useful to allow dissidents to leave than to keep them in?
We're talking about dissidents, so:
Under Stalin and Mao: To not lose all fellow travelers in the West. Bad PR
After them: They actualy did to some extent. Especialy if it was a well-known person. Better let them piss from the outside. The DDR also sold civilians to the BRD for hard cash. Older people but also critical people. A good friend of my came in this way as a youngster in the west.
 
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