Why didn't the Portuguese attack Meccain the 1520's?

Hey there,

The Portuguese had full mastery of the seas until the 1540's at leas.

They considered muslims as THE enemy. So why didn't they attack Mecca? It was basically defenseless from the sea, no?
 
While the Portuguese and the Spaniards were still undeniable islamophobes within their own borders, the age of crusades is over. They would get no rewards in attacking the holy cities other than the fiery wrath of the muslim world.
 
While the Portuguese and the Spaniards were still undeniable islamophobes within their own borders, the age of crusades is over. They would get no rewards in attacking the holy cities other than the fiery wrath of the muslim world.
A quick way to lose said mastery of the seas is literally turn those traders and polities that are already there violent before you have a chance to surprise them with your violence first, which is what happened OTL.

You know, this might be an interesting timeline....
 
You know, this might be an interesting timeline....
A more-or-less plausible PoD for such a scenario would be Don Sebastian being an even bigger islamophobe and attempting to start a crusade through the sea instead of through land, which he attempted to do in Morocco. But we all know how it played out in the end. I highly doubt it would be possible since the portuguese commerciant bourgueoisie wouldn't be so interested in ceasing trade with the islamic world.
 
A more-or-less plausible PoD for such a scenario would be Don Sebastian being an even bigger islamophobe and attempting to start a crusade through the sea instead of through land, which he attempted to do in Morocco. But we all know how it played out in the end. I highly doubt it would be possible since the portuguese commerciant bourgueoisie wouldn't be so interested in ceasing trade with the islamic world.
I figured that the portuguese probably care more about the economic interests of their kingdom rather than any religious motive.
I'm just thinking maybe some stray spanish pirates (who pruport to love the king and hate muslims) end up getting mistaken for some kind of advance guard of a crusade, and send the Islamic World ballistic. Kind of like administering an electric shock.
 
I figured that the portuguese probably care more about the economic interests of their kingdom rather than any religious motive.
I'm just thinking maybe some stray spanish pirates (who pruport to love the king and hate muslims) end up getting mistaken for some kind of advance guard of a crusade, and send the Islamic World ballistic. Kind of like administering an electric shock.
Well a lot of trading regions were not Muslim (China, South India, Ceylan, Burma...) and the Muslims already hated them with the strength of a burning sun, at least the Arabs and Ottomans.

It could hurt with Persia of course, but even Venice continued trade with Muslims after Jerusalem and Constantinople fell.

The system of shipping pass was used heavily oo restrict muslim ship commerce, as they were like the Dutch of the Indian Ocean. You did aave local initiatives not actively pissing off Muslims but they only seemed that, local
 
As mentioned before, the age of crusading is already over by the 16th century. It was best to trade or do clever diplomacy with the muslims than to piss them off and derail any chance of exploiting the riches of the east more easily. For example, the French kingdom even had an alliance of convenience with the Ottomans, whom they saw as an useful harassing force against their Austrian habsburg enemies. In turn, the habsburgs sought an alliance with the Persians with the intention to get the Ottomans off their back.
 
It could hurt with Persia of course, but even Venice continued trade with Muslims after Jerusalem and Constantinople fell.
Now this may be wrong, but was the religion of the Venetians absolutely centered on these two places? Given that Jerusalem had been out of christian hands for a very long time, and Constantinople was both irrevocably bound to the identity of the Byzantine empire and to the Eastern Orthodox church as opposed to the Roman Catholic one, why would the chosen example care? Eastern Orthodox Christians were greatly incensed at the fall of Constantinople, the trouble is either they were Russia or they were too weak to take on the Ottomans regardless. And furthermore, weren't the Venetians actually enemies of the Byzantines? Would a more fitting analogue for the Venetians not be the fall of Rome? Even then, even single given major sects of Christianity do not have just one city of paramount, central importance like Islam does.
 
Hey there,

The Portuguese had full mastery of the seas until the 1540's at leas.

They considered muslims as THE enemy. So why didn't they attack Mecca? It was basically defenseless from the sea, no?

No return on investment. They were quite happy to burn ships full of Haj pilgrims bjt only as an ancillary activity to securing the spice island routes
 
Hey there,

The Portuguese had full mastery of the seas until the 1540's at leas.

They considered muslims as THE enemy. So why didn't they attack Mecca? It was basically defenseless from the sea, no?

Why bother?

Mecca may not be well defended, but it's not on the sea, it's 80 km inland, in a desert full of hostile natives. There's nothing much to loot there. It's a long way the wrong direction, anyway. To get to Jiddah (the port of Mecca), the Portuguese have to sail 2,000 km up the Gulf of Aden and the Red Sea, which is a barren dead end as far as trade is concerned.

It is of no importance to Christians. The Crusades and the Reconquista were not about "carrying the war to the enemy", but about "redeeming" Christian shrines and lands from the paynim.

Mecca is not and never was a Christian place. I doubt if they even understood what it really meant to Moslems. Or exactly where it was.

I'd also note that elsewhere in the Indian Ocean, the Portuguese did not make any systematic attacks on Islam, such as demolishing mosques. They were a modest force, operating a long long long way from home; their ambitions were appropriate.
 
Why bother?

Mecca may not be well defended, but it's not on the sea, it's 80 km inland, in a desert full of hostile natives. There's nothing much to loot there. It's a long way the wrong direction, anyway. To get to Jiddah (the port of Mecca), the Portuguese have to sail 2,000 km up the Gulf of Aden and the Red Sea, which is a barren dead end as far as trade is concerned.

Well, just to say if you control Jeddah, you can asphyxiate Egypt further, which was one of their primary goal to redirect trade through the Cape of Good Hope. But yeah, Jeddah is not the most strategic port there.

Mecca is not and never was a Christian place. I doubt if they even understood what it really meant to Moslems. Or exactly where it was.
They did know where it was. However you're right, they thought it was important because it was the tomb of Mahommet.

I'd also note that elsewhere in the Indian Ocean, the Portuguese did not make any systematic attacks on Islam, such as demolishing mosques. They were a modest force, operating a long long long way from home; their ambitions were appropriate.
Good point, nothing systematic. Thanks for the answer!
 
The idea that "Crusades were out of fashion, nobody's going to attack Mecca just 'cause it's Muslim" is overdone: war against the heathen was still very much a thing, even if crusades to Jerusalem specifically weren't, and one of the reasons for the voyages of exploration was to find new allies against the Turk. The reason why they didn't attack Mecca was probably because they didn't consider it feasible: the city was some distance inland, in unfamiliar territory, and the Portuguese probably didn't have good information as to how well defended it was. Attacking in such circumstances is just asking for a defeat.
 
The Portuguese DID attack Jeddah; mostly for mixed commercial and somewhat religious reasons. It's just they never managed to capture it, so a follow-up to Meccah was impossible.

Portugal may have been strong at sea, they couldn't take any city they wanted against Mamluk and later Ottoman opposition...
 
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