Where do the Jewish people go if Israel ceases to exist early on?

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PGSBHurricane

This is not directly related to what's going on right now in the Arab-Israeli conflict (that would be for chat/politics). But it does have me, someone of Jewish heritage, thinking about what could have happened in the past. If, for whatever reason, either the UN Partition Plan to create both an Arab state and Jewish state never happens in 1947 or Israel loses the War of 1948, where do you think most Jews would end up and how would this affect Judaism as a religion for years and decades to come? I've seen people on here say that millions of Jews would flood the USA but given that it actually wasn't until the creation of Israel that anti-semitism went down in the USA and immigration quotas started to ease, I don't know if this would be true. In fact, I would say that the peak of American anti-semitism was between 1945 and 1948. Anyway, considering that up to 98% of Jewish refugees in Europe had Palestine as their first choice for their destination, this would definitely shake things up. Thoughts?
 
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PGSBHurricane

Also, when I asked how it would impact Judaism as a religion (also ethnicity), I mean what kind of identity would it take, would numbers be different, would there be increased Jewish pride or would they keep their heads down and try to assimilate at almost any cost, etc.
 
juanml82

juanml82

They'd have to go to the Americas, as Europe wouldn't yet be safe for them. Based on the size of the current Jewish communities, mainly to the USA, Argentina and Brazil. If the USA isn't receiving them, Argentina and Brazil
 

PGSBHurricane

juanml82 said:
They'd have to go to the Americas, as Europe wouldn't yet be safe for them. Based on the size of the current Jewish communities, mainly to the USA, Argentina and Brazil. If the USA isn't receiving them, Argentina and Brazil
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As far as the USA goes, do keep in mind that even after WW2, many if not most American politicians did not want to admit Jewish refugees. Would Truman issue an executive order in this case? And how would the Jewish religion itself be impacted?
 

Deleted member 109224

The Jews of Tunisia, Morocco, and Algeria probably end up in France. Maybe the Jews of Lebanon and Syria too.
 

Deleted member 109224

PGSBHurricane said:
Would this be because of Pan-Arabism during the Cold War? And with Greeks, Armenians, and other "foreigners" encouraged to leave Egypt under Nasser?
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Jews in Algeria and Tunisia, including the Sephardim who were there before the French conquest, were French citizens and more went to France than to Israel OTL. The majority of French Jews today are North African Sephardim. So I imagine France would take in the Jews from their North African possessions.

Yeah Pan-Arabists were very insistent on 'cleansing' their countries of non-Arab elements. Given what happened in North Africa OTL to the Harki (hundreds of thousands lynched) and Pied Noires (over a million expelled), I imagine the Jews of the region would end up in the same basket.


Come to think of it, Leon Blum was Prime Minister of France from 1946-1947 and an ardent Zionist. Maybe he pushes for bringing the Jews of Israel to France (or Algeria?) if Israel fails.
 

PGSBHurricane

Jackson Lennock said:
Jews in Algeria and Tunisia, including the Sephardim who were there before the French conquest, were French citizens and more went to France than to Israel OTL. The majority of French Jews today are North African Sephardim. So I imagine France would take in the Jews from their North African possessions.

Yeah Pan-Arabists were very insistent on 'cleansing' their countries of non-Arab elements. Given what happened in North Africa OTL to the Harki (hundreds of thousands lynched) and Pied Noires (over a million expelled), I imagine the Jews of the region would end up in the same basket.


Come to think of it, Leon Blum was Prime Minister of France from 1946-1947 and an ardent Zionist. Maybe he pushes for bringing the Jews of Israel to France (or Algeria?) if Israel fails.
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Maybe the Jews of the other former British Mandates (not including Palestine) end up in Britain/the Dominions?
 

Chris Nation

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British Africa was a surprisingly popular choice for Jewish emigration. South Africa, Southern Rhodesia, Northern Rhodesia, and Kenya all had sizeable (as a percentage of total white population) Jewish communities.

South Africa in particular.
 

Reflection

I imagine more Jews would go to the US, especially in the Northeast in NYC and near (which has the largest Jewish population outside of Israel). It's feasible that some small, otherwise unremarkable towns in the East Coast could become settled by Jews for ease of space.
 

PGSBHurricane

Reflection said:
I imagine more Jews would go to the US, especially in the Northeast in NYC and near (which has the largest Jewish population outside of Israel). It's feasible that some small, otherwise unremarkable towns in the East Coast could become settled by Jews for ease of space.
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I guess it really comes down to the US deciding to ease the quotas, because relatively few were let in between 1945 and 1948.
 

Nivek

PGSBHurricane said:
As far as the USA goes, do keep in mind that even after WW2, many if not most American politicians did not want to admit Jewish refugees. Would Truman issue an executive order in this case? And how would the Jewish religion itself be impacted?
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USA, south Africa too
 

brunohusker

Chris Nation said:
British Africa was a surprisingly popular choice for Jewish emigration. South Africa, Southern Rhodesia, Northern Rhodesia, and Kenya all had sizeable (as a percentage of total white population) Jewish communities.

South Africa in particular.
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Hmm that’s an interesting concept. I know a few Jews ended up there but a mass migration would be an interesting affect on the demographics.
 

Chris Nation

Banned
brunohusker said:
Hmm that’s an interesting concept. I know a few Jews ended up there but a mass migration would be an interesting affect on the demographics.
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They already had an outsized influence on the history of the region. The last Prime Minister of the Federation of Rhodesia and Nyasaland was the son of Lithuanian Jews. Helen Suzman, the famous liberal MP during the apartheid era in South Africa was also descended from Lithuanian Jews. Helen Zille, the long time former leader of the Democratic Alliance in SA is the daughter of German Jews who left in the late 30s.

One Northern Rhodesian (Zambian) Jew even served as the Chairman of the US Federal Reserve (Stanley Fischer).

One interesting fact about these communities is they often assimilated rapidly. For example, in Southern Rhodesia in the 50s, one out of every seven white marriages was between a Jew and a Gentile.
 

brunohusker

Chris Nation said:
They already had an outsized influence on the history of the region. The last Prime Minister of the Federation of Rhodesia and Nyasaland was the son of Lithuanian Jews. Helen Suzman, the famous liberal MP during the apartheid era in South Africa was also descended from Lithuanian Jews. Helen Zille, the long time former leader of the Democratic Alliance in SA is the daughter of German Jews who left in the late 30s.

One Northern Rhodesian (Zambian) Jew even served as the Chairman of the US Federal Reserve (Stanley Fischer).

One interesting fact about these communities is they often assimilated rapidly. For example, in Southern Rhodesia in the 50s, one out of every seven white marriages was between a Jew and a Gentile.
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Did they support Apartheid or not? That’d be an interesting timeline too. If Israel doesn’t work out, you have more Jews go to Southern Africa. Wasn’t that a plan Jan Smuts had before his party lost in 48 when apartheid got implemented?
 
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PGSBHurricane

In terms of what happens to Judaism itself alongside the immigration to other places, I think either more Jews become Orthodox (who had a higher tendency to believe that the Jews cannot go back to the Holy Land until the Messiah returns) or they lean towards Reformed Judaism or non-practicing in an effort to assimilate.
 

PGSBHurricane

brunohusker said:
Did they support Apartheid or not? That’s be an interesting timeline too is Israel doesn’t work out, you have more Jews go to Southern Africa. Wasn’t that a plan Jan Smuts had before his party lost in 48 when apartheid got implemented?
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Most Jews actually supported the United Party which was the one that was moreso courting whites to settle there. The United Party had plans to gradually enfranchise everyone in the country.
 
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