When could the Boeing 2707 have flown?

kernals12

Banned
Assuming congress didn't cut funding, when would Boeing's SST make its first flight given reasonable assumptions on the inevitable problems that would crop up?
 
It was originally planned for prototype construction to begin in 1967, with first flight in 1970, production aircraft starting to be built in 1969, full flight test operations in 1970, and certification for service in 1974.

Given that mockups and prototype construction was just beginning in '69/'70, you can probably add two to three years to all those dates to get an adjusted schedule, which puts the 2707 making its first flight right in the heart of the oil shocks, with years of flight testing to go, and not reaching passenger service until about 1977.
 

kernals12

Banned
It was originally planned for prototype construction to begin in 1967, with first flight in 1970, production aircraft starting to be built in 1969, full flight test operations in 1970, and certification for service in 1974.

Given that mockups and prototype construction was just beginning in '69/'70, you can probably add two to three years to all those dates to get an adjusted schedule, which puts the 2707 making its first flight right in the heart of the oil shocks, with years of flight testing to go, and not reaching passenger service until about 1977.
I think it'd be impressive if they got the 2707 into service at the same time as Concorde despite being a much more complicated airliner. One other thing, Air France and British Airways were government controlled and would be willing to fly this extremely unprofitable aircraft for the sake of national pride. I'd like to see any of America's notoriously profit troubled airlines try to fly the 2707.
 
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I think it'd be impressive if they got the 2707 into service at the same time as Concorde despite being a much more complicated airliner. One other thing, Air France and British Airways were government controlled and would be willing to fly this extremely unprofitable aircraft for the sake of national pride. I'd like to see any of America's notoriously profit troubled airlines try to fly the 2707.
Well, that assumes that the flight test schedule holds, which it probably wouldn't. "No earlier than 1977" mught be the better way to phrase it. A debut after 1980 could be equally possible, as could a cancellation of development during flight test due to cancelled orders as a result of oil shocks.
 
Assuming congress didn't cut funding, when would Boeing's SST make its first flight given reasonable assumptions on the inevitable problems that would crop up?
In most timelines where development continued, the prototype will be ready to fly some time real soon.
 
An interesting question.

Not least because there are reasons you can't use the Anglo-French Concorde as a direct benchmark for the Boeing 2707 due to critical differences in their respective designs.

Concorde was able to succeed in part thanks to its Top Speed being Mach 2.04. Having it be no greater than that limited the Aerodynamic Heating on the plane to a level low enough that existing materials (Aluminium for one) could be used. Its earlier start also allowed it to enter service sooner, and build up a customer base that combined with some major re-pricing of the tickets following the Oil Shocks allowed (the BA Concorde's at least) to operate at a profit until 2000.

The Boeing 2707, in part to be more than the Concorde was designed with a Top Speed of Mach 2.7 (part of where its name came from) which thanks to much greater heating loads demanded the use of much more exotic materials that could handle these increased stresses, a major pacing item, as was trying (and later abandoning) the use of a variable swept-wing.

I'd say if the US Government and Boeing kept at it, a mid-late 1970's for test flights and entering service either at the end of the 1970's, or the beginning of the 1980's.

Then there will be the hard part. Getting a market for it that it can operate in effectively.
 

NoMommsen

Donor
...
and build up a customer base that combined with some major re-pricing of the tickets following the Oil Shocks allowed (the BA Concorde's at least) to operate at a profit until 2000.
...
Could you provide a source for that ?

All I've found so far stated the opposite : that Concorde never made a profit.
 
Could you provide a source for that ?

All I've found so far stated the opposite : that Concorde never made a profit.

Here's a few:


http://www.concordesst.com/retire/faq_r.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Concorde#Operating_economics

https://www.tenfactsabout.co.uk/0007concorde.htm


Which all state that once they raised the Ticket Price to match Public Perception of how much was being paid for a flight, it operated at a profit of £30-50 million/year for BA.
 
I think it'd be impressive if they got the 2707 into service at the same time as Concorde despite being a much more complicated airliner. One other thing, Air France and British Airways were government controlled and would be willing to fly this extremely unprofitable aircraft for the sake of national pride. I'd like to see any of America's notoriously profit troubled airlines try to fly the 2707.
If we were talking about the Lockheed L-2000 we just might see it in the early 1970's, if nothing goes wrong.

But the Boeing with the moving wings, no way we see it till the late 70's.
If they went with the Fix wing design of the 300 model earlier, it might be possible in the early 70 again if nothing goes wrong and the Government support remains.

But with the lost of government support, and the oil Crisis, neither plane would have appeared earlier the late 70's.
This is assuming that they find a market.
 
A little off the OP but I think relevant is whether a brand new SST design would be welcome nowadays. It would be useful for halving the travel time on those long Pacific routes. Now whether that market alone could support the development, purchasing and operation of a modern SST fleet is the question. Then there are some possible environmental concerns with the engine exhausts and the ozone layer and such. But I wonder.
 
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