What were people responsible for firing nuclear weapons supposed to do afterwards in the Cold War?
- Thread starter Captain Homicide
- Start date
Thank you, but isn't The Last Ship about a pandemic (ironic)? I've watched the TV series.
IIRC Resurrection Day, by Brendan DuBois, featured a Soviet bomber crew in the USA.
I suppose if things went quite well for one side, the chain of command might in theory at least be able to direct some surviving SSBN's to take on other roles, but I think this thread was built on the premise that there was no longer a chain of command to provide direction to the surviving crews.
I am inclined to agree with gatordad699 re the likely attitude of the crews without specific orders directing them to do something along these lines.
In the alternate history novel, Resurrection Day by Brendan DuBois, a story about what would have happened if the Cuban Missile Crisis had gone wrong. The main character meets two gentlemen who had that very problem.
I wonder what the policy is now with a smaller number of warheads and possibly a longer war lasting weeks not days.
I recall watching a video once of the curator in an ICBM silo turned into a museum as he walked a group of visitors through a theoretical launch procedure. He spoke of closing the silo doors and ensuring they were prepared for the blast of an incoming enemy weapon, putting out fires caused by the launch, and so on. He then mentions that in a real launch, this entire time the senior man in the silo has been operating from a checklist. The last item on the list?
"Await further orders."
He then rhetorically asks from where such orders were expected to issue. Yes, there were bunkers, and hardened lines of communications, and designated alternate officials, but no way to know how much of that would survive.
So again, further orders from whom, and to what effect?
He then lists off about how long the air scrubbers can be expected to work once the silo complex is sealed, and about how long the stores of food, water and other supplies can last. Near then end of that time, he says, they would have had a rather stark choice.
I. Stay in the silo awaiting further orders, and likely just die.
II. Pack up the remaining supplies, exit the complex, and try to figure out what's going on outside.
It's a rather grim prospect, and that is part of why such an exchange never happened in the first place. Nobody wanted to risk that future, if you could even call it one.
Experience of a downed B52 crew appears in Drakonfin's A Land of Sad Songs which is well worth a read. A Finnish Protect and Survive.
If I recall, the advice of an RAF air marshal to bomber crews was to keep flying east and find a nice plump mongolian girl!
If I recall, the advice of an RAF air marshal to bomber crews was to keep flying east and find a nice plump mongolian girl!
Not quite.
In 6000AD tabloids breathlessly declare that genetic testing has shown that many people in the Mongolian Khanate have similar DNA to those from the Irish isles. This provides the first real evidence the Irish invasion theory says Professor X'azu Querty of the University of Nukeabad., though he cautioned that it was more likely a trade* relationship rather than an "invasion".
*Fun fact, the items like lipstick, nylons etc in Dr Starngeloves' survival kit were to barter with the locals for food and shelter. And probably sex.
Missile field and SAC ground crews were mainly going to be part of the heavy fallout. Carriers were expected to suffer heavy losses, same for SSBN. There were actually plans, at least on the American side, for "alternate landing" sites for returning B-52s/B-1/B-2 to refuel and rearm (undoubtedly one of the most overly optimistic bits of military planning since Barbarossa).
Possibly. It's been a minute or two.
Early on it was possible some less developed military airfields would survive at least the first wave of strikes. By the 80s? Let's just say there's a reason SAC crew prepared to land on stretches of the interstate highways. Realistically bombers were going to be a one and done gig with a few exceptions, after which the crews would either try to make it home, such as it was, or find a country not involved in the war in range of their fuel reserves.
Both sides expected a phase of "brokeback warfare" after the first wave of strikes, during which a smattering of surviving personnel would struggle to carry on their last intelligible orders using whatever weapons and facilities were left, seeking out and attacking targets until the fuel was gone, the weapons ran out, the food and water ran low, or they were themselves killed by some people in different uniforms doing the same damn thing they were.
Outside of some SSBN the whole "we continue to strike" only works if it it a limited exchange. Given the mindset of the MAD era, a Limited Exchange seems rather optimistic.
My own understanding from what I could dig up online was it was an expectation that some weapons, facilities and personnel would survive due to happenstance, things like weapon failures, a silo here and there being destroyed before it can launch and so an airbase that would have been atomized still is, but later than called for in the plans.
In my opinion any sort of "brokeback" phase would have been largely conventional forces not important enough to rate the big bombs flailing away at each other out of reflex for anywhere from hours to years, depending on just what level of national leadership survives, if any, to eventually order them to fucking stop killing each other for no reason already.
I suppose the scene in "Dr Strangelove", where the B52 crew has several big folders with contingency plans including landing options, is pretty correct. Including that several "options" have 99% probability of non-survival like "parachute over the Atlantic in the hope that a weather ship not only survived, but could observe and save them".
The prefered option for bombers would be returning to CONUS/Soviet Union, secondly an allied country and third a neutral country. In the case of SAC I assume Sweden was a potential landing site (unfortunally the Soviets knew this, and a lot of Swedish airfields would be glowing before SAC reached Soviet airspace). Boomers would probably go deep for several days, then send up an antenna and begin to listen. British SSBN still carry a handwritten letter from the prime minister with instructions.
Some command assets could have been used to direct/support surviving bombers and boomers, such as Looking Glass or some updated version of National Emergency Command Post Afloat. They could inform survivors of the situation and possible refuges. I also guess that a lot of military bases would radio just before they were hit, such as "This is Offut. All planes away. Hatches closed. Seven heavy warheads 30 seconds away. End." to inform survivors of the situation.
The prefered option for bombers would be returning to CONUS/Soviet Union, secondly an allied country and third a neutral country. In the case of SAC I assume Sweden was a potential landing site (unfortunally the Soviets knew this, and a lot of Swedish airfields would be glowing before SAC reached Soviet airspace). Boomers would probably go deep for several days, then send up an antenna and begin to listen. British SSBN still carry a handwritten letter from the prime minister with instructions.
Some command assets could have been used to direct/support surviving bombers and boomers, such as Looking Glass or some updated version of National Emergency Command Post Afloat. They could inform survivors of the situation and possible refuges. I also guess that a lot of military bases would radio just before they were hit, such as "This is Offut. All planes away. Hatches closed. Seven heavy warheads 30 seconds away. End." to inform survivors of the situation.
Fuzzy Dunlop
Banned
Referencing "The Day After" again.
The opening attack has a good section on what goes on inside the 'Looking Class' as the enemy missiles start hitting their targets.
It's actually taken from an earlier PBS program called 'First Strike' and was recorded by real airmen taking part in a live 'drill' which adds to the realism.
Hope that helps.
There were supposed to be ARB (Alternate Recovery Bases) with teams sent out from home bases to service surviving bombers and tankers. This, of course, assumes that SAC can generate them during the prewar crisis and isn't responding to a BOOB (Bolt Out Of the Blue) attack. Even in a worst-case scenario, there would be enough surviving civilian fields and highways suitable for use. The joke in SAC was that once bombers and tankers accomplished their missions, they had their courses and fuel loads plotted, and head for the South Pacific.
Missile subs were to turn into attack submarines and start looking for Soviet ships or subs to engage.
Some missile subs were actually assigned as a reserve. meaning if they got the message that said "Execute SIOP", they were NOT to launch unless further orders received. The same for attack subs armed with SLCMs, unless assigned theater strike targets instead of SIOP.
Missile subs were to turn into attack submarines and start looking for Soviet ships or subs to engage.
Some missile subs were actually assigned as a reserve. meaning if they got the message that said "Execute SIOP", they were NOT to launch unless further orders received. The same for attack subs armed with SLCMs, unless assigned theater strike targets instead of SIOP.