"What Madness Is This?" Volume I: The Union Forever

[Zoidberg12]

I haven't commented in a while, as I've been on vacation, but I've still been following everything. I've especially enjoyed reading about the demise of the new Germanian Empire. It's just fascinating that a nation which gained so much lost it all in just a few years. I also find the developments within Europa, or whats left of it, to be interesting as well. I have a feeling that Europa will end up becoming a fascist catholic nation in the next few decades. So we may see a war between the fascist American fundamentalists and the fascist Europan Catholics. That would be pretty insane, but it could actually happen. It also wouldn't surprise me if Julius Evola ended up taking over Italy. What Adolf will do in Austria-Hungary is anyone's guess. He may turn the kingdom into a fascist state or he may turn the kingdom into a government based on his own ideals, maybe even a federated Austro-Hungarian Empire.

One question I have is about Illuminist Russia. What happened to the various ethnicities under the control of Russia? Are they autonomous regions of Illuminist Russia? I can't really see the Illuminist Russians completely oppressing the many peoples of the former Russian Empire without giving them any sort of autonomy.

 

[Caulaincourt]

One question I have is about Illuminist Russia. What happened to the various ethnicities under the control of Russia? Are they autonomous regions of Illuminist Russia? I can't really see the Illuminist Russians completely oppressing the many peoples of the former Russian Empire without giving them any sort of autonomy.

I could see some kind of weird variant of Austrian personal Marxism emerging within Illuminism- e.g., in keeping with the 'every man a god' theme, nationalities transcend borders and that the "Ukrainians" of the new Russia, for example, are basically given cultural autonomy no matter where they live

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_personal_autonomy

 

[FranzAncheNo]

A question about sports. Given the terrible international relationships of almost every state/alliance, we won't see the Olympic Games ITTL, will we?

 

[traveller76]

A question about sports. Given the terrible international relationships of almost every state/alliance, we won't see the Olympic Games ITTL, will we?

Maybe in Europe but I doubt the RU and allies will participate. They would probably have some sort of separate Games.

 

[halfcoop]

A question about sports. Given the terrible international relationships of almost every state/alliance, we won't see the Olympic Games ITTL, will we?

Maybe each bloc has their own olympics, kinda like how the soviets briefly hosted their own version of the olympics.

League of Nations actually calling it the olympics, and tend to go overboard in its attempt to recreate it. A bit more rugged and ‘classical’ then the others. Maybe more focused on individual competitors then a national competition, emphasizing idea of a ‘pinnacle man’. Swimming, marathons, wresting, etc.

The Europa sphere(they should really have a name) can be ‘The World Cups’ A bit more recreational then other ones. Competition are rugby, soccer, and team sports rather then individual completions.

The Illuminati have the Spartakiad. I’m trying to think of some sorta of speciality for them. Maybe something along the lines of it being ‘modern’ in comparison to the other. Probably includes some non athletic completion like chess or debate. Maybe it’s just one big decathlon. Which a nation only have 10 athletes and they must all complete in all events.

 

[Diagram]

I'm rather surprised that CoCaro is getting away with anti-Black atrocities.

 

[Born in the USSA]

I'm rather surprised that CoCaro is getting away with anti-Black atrocities.

Race relations are even less straightforward TTL, so Mittelafrikans are considered Inferior by Union taxonomists, although I could imagine a pressure campaign for civil rights laws applicable strictly to black Betters (and their descendents) in CoCaro and Jacksonland, respectively.

 

[Born in the USSA]

Maybe each bloc has their own olympics, kinda like how the soviets briefly hosted their own version of the olympics.

League of Nations actually calling it the olympics, and tend to go overboard in its attempt to recreate it. A bit more rugged and ‘classical’ then the others. Maybe more focused on individual competitors then a national competition, emphasizing idea of a ‘pinnacle man’. Swimming, marathons, wresting, etc.

The Europa sphere(they should really have a name) can be ‘The World Cups’ A bit more recreational then other ones. Competition are rugby, soccer, and team sports rather then individual completions.

The Illuminati have the Spartakiad. I’m trying to think of some sorta of speciality for them. Maybe something along the lines of it being ‘modern’ in comparison to the other. Probably includes some non athletic completion like chess or debate. Maybe it’s just one big decathlon. Which a nation only have 10 athletes and they must all complete in a series of tasks.

I love it! So now the question is do they all happen at the same time just to spite one another? Talk about peak TV.

 

[Born in the USSA]

So something I've been mulling over could make for an interesting deviation from the original going down the line. So in 1.0 (as we all know), succession in the Union is not actually hereditary until Oswald installs his son. I never cared for Oswald II so I propose an alternative arrangement: given the fact that Steele (Strongest of Strong Men) was the adopted son of Custer (All Hail), and considering the Union's raging Rome fetish, what about a system where the President/Supreme Chiefs/Titans of Industry "adopt" someone as their favored successors? This wouldn't be the actual adoption mechanism of course, but would be more of a legally formalized system of direct patronage, naturally setting up a situation where Oswald II tries to seize power before being brutally cut down by his father's chosen successor, a better result for all involved.

 

[halfcoop]

So something I've been mulling over could make for an interesting deviation from the original going down the line. So in 1.0 (as we all know), succession in the Union is not actually hereditary until Oswald installs his son. I never cared for Oswald II so I propose an alternative arrangement: given the fact that Steele (Strongest of Strong Men) was the adopted son of Custer (All Hail), and considering the Union's raging Rome fetish, what about a system where the President/Supreme Chiefs/Titans of Industry "adopt" someone as their favored successors? This wouldn't be the actual adoption mechanism of course, but would be more of a legally formalized system of direct patronage, naturally setting up a situation where Oswald II tries to seize power before being brutally cut down by his father's chosen successor, a better result for all involved.

How Roman of them, so they might be all about it...

 

[Born in the USSA]

How Roman of them, so they might be all about it...

I know right? Jeb Bush was born in 1953, just saying.

 

[Murica1776]

I'm rather surprised that CoCaro is getting away with anti-Black atrocities.

It's all a question of timing and distance. The Confederation's forced deportation of their African population coincided with the Great Disturbance and the rise of Custer. The Union was too distracted pacifying the South, fighting a low-grade civil war, and consolidating a new government under a new dictator. By the time all of that was fully sorted, the Carolinas could have had most, if not all, of their black population deported. After that, all of those atrocities were happening in places sufficiently removed from the Yankee homeland to not be worth dealing with.

I'm sure there's some sort of system worked out where what few African-Americans that deign to travel to/through the Carolinas are protected from the racism of the Carolinians by the authorities and the explicit threat of American intervention. Of course, this is probably something that barely happens in the first place so there's very little chance of any of Carolina's anti-black atrocities affecting the safety, prosperity, or sensibilities of the average Yankee. Which of course means they won't intervene.

 

[245]

It's all a question of timing and distance. The Confederation's forced deportation of their African population coincided with the Great Disturbance and the rise of Custer. The Union was too distracted pacifying the South, fighting a low-grade civil war, and consolidating a new government under a new dictator. By the time all of that was fully sorted, the Carolinas could have had most, if not all, of their black population deported. After that, all of those atrocities were happening in places sufficiently removed from the Yankee homeland to not be worth dealing with.

I'm sure there's some sort of system worked out where what few African-Americans that deign to travel to/through the Carolinas are protected from the racism of the Carolinians by the authorities and the explicit threat of American intervention. Of course, this is probably something that barely happens in the first place so there's very little chance of any of Carolina's anti-black atrocities affecting the safety, prosperity, or sensibilities of the average Yankee. Which of course means they won't intervene.

will you do something with normanism in the future?

 

[Murica1776]

will you do something with normanism in the future?

Napo already used it. Of course if he decided that he wanted to revive it after the inevitable fall of Yankeeland, I'd be more than happy to do something. If not, I'm still happy to have contributed. He's the Pinnacle Man and Atheling of this TL, so you're going to have to ask him

 

[Time Enough]

I wonder how Korea is doing, looking around as all it's neighbors are subsumed into the forces of Qing, Illumanist and of course Fascism. Given some of it's real life history I'm hoping for Korea to become a Libertarian Socialist Commune Country (fun fact there was actually a Libertarian Socialist state created in Korea in the 1930s...guessed what happened to it).

Also I'm wondering if my idea of Buddhist Socialism or the ideology of Dharmism is a thing. Because I'm hoping for armies of Buddhist proclaiming Inner Tranquility, Equality and Nirvana whilst ruthlessly purging all those that come in there way (if they don't convert).

C'mon Destruction of Self

 

[halfcoop]

I wonder how Korea is doing, looking around as all it's neighbors are subsumed into the forces of Qing, Illumanist and of course Fascism. Given some of it's real life history I'm hoping for Korea to become a Libertarian Socialist Commune Country (fun fact there was actually a Libertarian Socialist state created in Korea in the 1930s...guessed what happened to it).

Also I'm wondering if my idea of Buddhist Socialism or the ideology of Dharmism is a thing. Because I'm hoping for armies of Buddhist proclaiming Inner Tranquility, Equality and Nirvana whilst ruthlessly purging all those that come in there way (if they don't convert).

C'mon Destruction of Self

Maybe they can be the Siam of this Asia. Someone’s number 2 but has just enough independence

 

[Worffan101]

I wonder how Korea is doing, looking around as all it's neighbors are subsumed into the forces of Qing, Illumanist and of course Fascism. Given some of it's real life history I'm hoping for Korea to become a Libertarian Socialist Commune Country (fun fact there was actually a Libertarian Socialist state created in Korea in the 1930s...guessed what happened to it).

Also I'm wondering if my idea of Buddhist Socialism or the ideology of Dharmism is a thing. Because I'm hoping for armies of Buddhist proclaiming Inner Tranquility, Equality and Nirvana whilst ruthlessly purging all those that come in there way (if they don't convert).

C'mon Destruction of Self

Is anything in Madness going to be libertarian for more than a week? All the Republican Union managed was becoming a quasi-feudal state run by corrupt regionalism instead of federalism, before Lincoln turned it into a de facto unitary state and Custer made it an outright totalitarian regime.

A 1984 reference would be pretty funny, though.

 

[Zoidberg12]

Heres a map I made of the world in 1920, just after the end of the Russian Civil War.

Some parts of the map are speculative. Some of the nations bordering Russia, such as Romania, Georgia, Persia and China, have taken advantage of the Russian Civil War to take over some lands from the Russian Empire. During the fall of the Germanian Empire and the independence of Mittelafrika, the Netherlands have taken over the islands of Fiji and Tonga from Germania and Europa has taken over the Friedrich Wilhelm Islands from Germania, known IOTL as the South Georgia and the South Sandwich Islands.

 

[Born in the USSA]

Heres a map I made of the world in 1920, just after the end of the Russian Civil War.

Some parts of the map are speculative. Some of the nations bordering Russia, such as Romania, Georgia, Persia and China, have taken advantage of the Russian Civil War to take over some lands from the Russian Empire. During the fall of the Germanian Empire and the independence of Mittelafrika, the Netherlands have taken over the islands of Fiji and Tonga from Germania and Europa has taken over the Friedrich Wilhelm Islands from Germania, known IOTL as the South Georgia and the South Sandwich Islands.

View attachment 467816

Really nice! I never realized Persia TTL was so big. One nitpick, doesn't Jacksonland now own the neighboring portion of Mittelafrika all the way to Madagascar (I'm sorry, Yonderland)?

 

[Prince Daemon Targaryen]

Heres a map I made of the world in 1920, just after the end of the Russian Civil War.

Some parts of the map are speculative. Some of the nations bordering Russia, such as Romania, Georgia, Persia and China, have taken advantage of the Russian Civil War to take over some lands from the Russian Empire. During the fall of the Germanian Empire and the independence of Mittelafrika, the Netherlands have taken over the islands of Fiji and Tonga from Germania and Europa has taken over the Friedrich Wilhelm Islands from Germania, known IOTL as the South Georgia and the South Sandwich Islands.

View attachment 467816

Remember, the Reich gave Jacksonland most of the Portuguese colonies. They now have both Mozambique and the two former Germanian colonies that border South Africa