"What Madness Is This?" Redux: The Union Forever

Discussion in 'Alternate History Discussion: Before 1900' started by Napoleon53, Sep 13, 2018.

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  1. Time Enough Nightmare angel of the Tea Rooms

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    Just finished the chapter and I have to say poor Germania, it's ripped itself to pieces for very petty reasons. Oh well at least we have the Berlin Free State out of it which I expect will be like Weimar Berlin on steroids (gay bars on every corner, entire areas of weird artist buildings, drug salesmen owning stalls, political groups beating the shit out of each everyday). Also I can see the Illumanists being like;

    "Well all these destroyed houses means we can rebuild...in Modern style...ha, ha." Cue Bauhaus buildings everywhere.

    I can see the Netherlands being buddies with Finland over Kapp and his government, the Netherlands has an awkward relationship with the Fascists. Maybe we get a small Protestant Captialist alliance lead primarily by the Dutch, essentially a non-aligned style alliance. The Netherlands is probably rather confused by what's happening.
     
  2. The Congressman Populist Liberty Conservative

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    When there is just the threat of collapse, Steele would likely just start another war in order to eat up the surplus production. I can imagine them trying to form a "Core" Union of North America, British Isles, Australia, and Japan, while just turning the rest of the world into a massive inferior ghetto/Generalplan Ost colonization type situation where all surplus production/population are used up in keeping the inferiors down. A nation always at war
     
  3. Murica1776 Building an American Tomorrow

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    See, here's the tricky bits.

    A.) Steele will die and be replaced by Oswald who is absolutely batshit and wants the whole world to worship him.
    B.) You have to find a target that doesn't take up too many resources. Eating into surplus is one thing. But another total war that cuts into the creature comforts of an America that, knowing TTL, is going to be much more consumerist than even OTL, but in the worst way possible, would probably piss people off. Violently.

    "Sure there's a war on, but goddammit I NEED MY TURBOCHARGED COLONEL FORD THAT GETS 5 MPG SO I CAN BUY A 4TH TV AND SOME NEW PATIO FURNITURE AT THE MALL!" *murderous rage*

    That would be pretty damn difficult to pull off.
     
  4. Napoleon53 Pinnacle Order of Monocled Sirs ಠ_ರೃ

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    Loving this convo.

    The Union is a parody of the OTL USA's worst attributes. And I'm surprised no one has had the same train of thought as I did about the "permenant warfare." It doesn't have to be WWIII to keep the economy going. It could be some irradiated hellhole on Continent X that features a "continued counter-insurgency operation to find, capture, and execute terrorists or turn their country into a parking lot. (Again)."

    "In other news, Samuel P. Bush IV announced continued success in the South American quarantine strip, with the aeroforce delivering freedom at mach 2. Today's news was brought to you by FIRE-BREATHER, America's favorite cocaine cigarette."
     
  5. Murica1776 Building an American Tomorrow

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    "Good Evening, I'm Walter von Braun, and this is Union News. Tonight's top story, President Oswald has announced a slight tax bump to pay for the Ongoing Victory in Indochina. The President assures the nation that this tax bump "Will not affect the American Way of Life in any way, shape, or form. Jehovah has blessed us with the highest standard of living on Earth, as befits the people of the New Jerusalem, and my Administration vows to keep it that way."

    Honestly, when you put it that way, it could work so long as no one who buys into the Union's line too hard seizes power. The Military-Industrial Complex grinds through just enough resources and wealth to keep the economy from overheating, plus the Banking Clan could behave similarly to the Fed and raise interest rates if inflation looks too dicey. As the population expands, the economic situation stabilizes, and the Union expands slightly more to get the resources to keep the war going.
     
  6. Napoleon53 Pinnacle Order of Monocled Sirs ಠ_ರೃ

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    "A world cane-not long enduah half-free, and half-slayve. Futhermoah, we must safeguard our own freedoms and right to pursue happiness and prawperty, unlike in the days of my rather pinch-penny predecessoah. I knew Joe Steele. Ladies and gentlemen, I am no Joe Steele. Freedom and prawperty forever!"
     
  7. Born in the USSA Well-Known Member

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    It's a bit off topic but has anyone ever read East of West? I'm trying to project Union society and current aesthetics into a similar sci-fi future and it's pretty wild. Cyberpunk megacorps where everyone still wears tophats! AFC churches the size of city blocks and thirty stories tall! The entirety of the federal government inside a huge ass tower! Some bull "long-lost apocalyptic Burr prophecies" being enacted by high ranking true believers to end the world! It would definitely be ASB but there's a lot of fun to be had.
     
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  8. Murica1776 Building an American Tomorrow

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    That statement from Napo almost has me wondering... What if the endgame for TTL isn't nuclear war, or Fascist world domination, but instead the modern world distorted through a funhouse mirror.

    The New United States is a hyperpower, which is always fighting some little war somewhere to keep jingoism high, and the economy humming. Domestically, the average Yankee is distracted by patriotism, consumerism, and "spreading his Pinnacle Fluids," among other things, and firmly believes in both Fascism and in his own freedom. The Free World is similar, and practically a bunch of Yankee colonies under different flags.

    Russia is recovering from the collapse of its Illuminist People's Union, and is spreading its influence in Central Asia once again under a Putin-esque mix of Kolchak and Viktor. This Has Been Noted in Philadelphia.

    China is a Beutelist/Illuminist state in name only, while in practice embracing corporatist totalitarianism. Their growing power is Philly's biggest concern, and if anything is going to cause a nuclear war, it's that.

    The Middle East is in an eternal three way war between expansionist Greater Israel, which is practically a state of the Union, Sunni Jabal Shammar, and Shia Persia. The "War on Jihadist Terror" has been an exceptional way for the Union to drain excess resources and energy.

    Africa is filled with murderous Yankee backed Strong Men who like to war with each other over resources. All Hail the Pinnacle Race!

    Continental Europe is mostly part of the Free World now, although there are undercurrents of anti-Americanism which range from justified to biting the hand that feeds you. Former Illuminist Eastern Europe is a warzone between America and Russia.

    A world worthy of destruction, but perhaps unable to receive it. The domination of global governments by cynics means that policy is just rational enough to prevent a disaster. Almost 1984-ish in a sense, but much more Stepford than 1984's bellicose totalitarianism.
     
  9. RightWinger93 Well-Known Member

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    Damn, if you put it like that, our world seems quite dystopian yet only a step behind the Madnessverse.
     
  10. Born in the USSA Well-Known Member

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    Imagine Madnessverse King of the Hill
     
  11. Murica1776 Building an American Tomorrow

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    I would say the difference between TTL and OTL in that sense is reasoning and of course the actual brutality of the world.

    For example, the US OTL has been fighting the War on Terror "forever" because of a lack of strategic vision and willpower, combined with an unrealistic view of what it can achieve. ITTL, it would be because the Union government is trying to stop the economy from exploding and keep the public focused on an external enemy to drum up patriotism.

    The results are similar, but the reasoning is vastly different. IOTL, the US has its flaws, as TTL most certainly shows. However, most everyone, even most of our leaders have always bought into what we said to one degree or another. We might be stupid or selfish about it a decent portion of the time, but that is the nature of the human race. ITTL, the American project is built on said stupidity and selfishness, and held together by the cynicism of the dictators who rule. That's the difference between this dystopia and the normal world imo.
     
  12. Born in the USSA Well-Known Member

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    In JEB! we trust! There's a whole room somewhere filled with Mission Accomplished banners
     
  13. 245 Well-Known Member

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    who says we're going to have banking clans old man, when we can have banking MEGACORPORATIONS!
     
  14. dakkafex Fedaykin Death Archivist

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    Hell yeah, East of West is amazing. The same author also did the wonderfully strange Black Monday Murders, which is a lot more esoteric but depicts something of how I imagine the RU's industrial and financial clans evolving by the end of the 20th century.
     
  15. Born in the USSA Well-Known Member

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    Henry Ford using Spiritual Marxism to manipulate the stock market! I love it!
     
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  16. Murica1776 Building an American Tomorrow

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    Ok, so I have a question about Zap Zephyr. IOTL, lots of American pulp sci-fi heroes fight evil conquering tyrants and warlords and try to either protect humanity or liberate oppressed aliens (especially oppressed alien girls who look suspiciously human). However, the Republican Union sure as hell ain't OTL America. So, what if instead, at least a good portion of Zap's stories aren't about him fighting evil alien tyrants, but instead about him going full Conquistador on some alien Infees? After all, he is a Pinnacle Man! It's in his blood to conquer all he can!
     
  17. Born in the USSA Well-Known Member

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    *When you realize *Star Wars will be from the point of view of Darth Vader*
     
  18. Sunstone77 Well-Known Member

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    The timeline ends with a young Yank using the pseudo-name Steele53 begins crafting he shall dub Where is the Madness?! :openedeyewink:
     
  19. Napoleon53 Pinnacle Order of Monocled Sirs ಠ_ರೃ

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    When you realize Zap Zephyr might BE Darth Vader.

    [Zap pauses in front of Texas Jett, an infamous space bounty hunter]. "NO DISINTIGRATIONS."

    Script of the 1977 "Zap Zephyr: The Pinnacle Men Strike Back" movie.
     
  20. Murica1776 Building an American Tomorrow

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    Jun 22, 2016
    If Zap is Darth Vader, then could there be.... A Emperor President Palpatine? Potentially played as a bit part by none other than Zap superfan and real life genocidal maniac President Charles Oswald?

    Also, I'm trying to figure out if the fact that the Union's favorite sci-fi hero is essentially a horny genocidal space imperialist/warlord is awesome or horrifying. I mean, it's gonna be propaganda palooza, but if someone suggested a TV or movie series about a de-Madnessified version of that concept, I would probably watch the hell out of it.
     
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