What if these 2 aircraft meet in combat ….
- Thread starter Monk78
- Start date
Assuming it was a Harrier FRS1, (Sea Harrier, the most likely opponent as both were carrier based in the main), then I think the Sea Harrier would have the edge. Mostly down to the pilots, although I believe the Sea Harrier had better radar, (happy to accept correction).
If this was the 1980's then we're also back to the R-60 Vs AIM 9L question too.
Guns wise, the Sea Harrier had the 2 x 30mm Aden Cannon Vs the Yak's single 23mm cannon.
However, while I would say the Harrier is better, I am biased.
GuildedAgeNostalgia
Gone Fishin'
IL-76 comes across a C-17, could one down the other by theoretically dropping their cargo on top of the other?
It dependes on the cargo - volcanic ash might clog or damage the engines, although why anyone would be carrying it by air would be a mystery to me. Meanwhile, a well-placed jeep or pallet load of tinned mutton - both rather more likely cargo than ash - would require good timing and Hollywood levels of luck to hit, but would certainly be hard to ignore and likely to be very destructive.
Your best chance is to be carrying a whole load of Manpads or similar hand held missiles (or maybe a Ma Deuce if you have a competent armourer on board to help set it up while getting into position).
I think I'm going to have to give this to the Il-76 for one simple reason.
I know this whole thread has many hand waves in it, but weren't the F104s supposed to go to the central front to support 5th air division and the CF5s were to go to Norway during the transition to war?
As I understand things…
During parts of the Cold War Canada forward deployed CF104’s to Europe and Canadian based CF104’s were used for training and other tasks.
During parts of the Cold War Canada planned to send two squadrons of CF5’s from Canada to Norway and also had other CF5’s based in Canada.
Presumably at least some CF104’s and CF5’s were expected to remain in Canada ? It also occurs to me that in addition to emergency air defence roles there may also have been at least a notional CAS and or Reconnaissance role to support any ground forces that remained in Canada ?
Last edited:
-SEPECAT Jaguar vs Soviet fighters (Migs or Sukhois) of Chad or Lybia. The Jag was underpowered and not very agile but during the cold war french pilots were taught DACT (Dissimilar Aircraft Combat Training) against Mirages and knew how to fight back. Also applies to GW1.
-France also had Skyraiders in Algeria, how about the FLNC having a smallish air force and Skyraiders fighting back (I know they got victories in both Korea and Vietnam).
-I was tempted to say "A2A victories for the SNCASO Vautour" but the Israelis already got there between 1959 and 1967.
-France also had Skyraiders in Algeria, how about the FLNC having a smallish air force and Skyraiders fighting back (I know they got victories in both Korea and Vietnam).
-I was tempted to say "A2A victories for the SNCASO Vautour" but the Israelis already got there between 1959 and 1967.
On May 7, 1977 off Djibouti a pair of French Crusaders were supposed to meet some Armée de l'Air last F-100s for mock dogfight. The Crusaders pilots then found the F-100s looked odd and fought bizarelly. They were actually Yemeni MiG-21s ! Both side armed their guns and missiles - just in case - but the fight did not broke out.
Crusader vs F-100 would be interesting, unfortunately they were on the same side of the Cold War.
Of course the Greeks and Turks provided some unique US fighters fratricide fights, all the way from F-84 to F-16.
No there was the Northrop P61 Black Widow and I think a well flown Defiant could take it in a dogfight.
Last edited:
The Defiant was slower and had no forward firing weapons. 304 mph and 8 minutes to 15,000ft.
Black Widow. 364mph 20,000ft in 12 minutes with a 2500ft/s climb rate.
No idea how tight the Black widow can turn but it should be used at high speed straight no turns slashing attacks. The Defiant has maybe an hour and a half in the air and the Black widow has 4 plus. Radar on black widow means clouds are not cover.
A well flown aircraft is always a difficult opponent but the Defiant is poorly armed, slow and not capable of forward firing from what I understand. I have never heard of an interrupter gear for the turret.
The 4 20mm cannon only need a few hits to make things difficult, the 4 0.50 cal guns also only need a few hits to do severe damage to spars etc. The 0.303 is less lethal against the Widow.
Comes down to pilots in terms of choosing correct tactics. BTW imagine Battle of Britain with Black Widows as the fighters for the RAF. BTW I know it is ASB territory but fast well armed and hard hitting.
That's interesting mate, I assumed that the voodoo were sufficent to cover the CONUS AD task.
Would be interesting to find out one way or another 👍😀
To be fair I only recall reading one reference in a Canadian Govt Publication regarding a possible Emergency air defense role for Canadian based CF5's and CF104's. I have no idea how much emphasis was actually put on that role.
Airfix used to do a Dogfight Double kit with an Israeli Mirage IIICJ and an Egyptian Mig-15. As crappy as both those kits were! https://www.themodelcentre.com/03143-5pre
The Israelis got the Mirage in early '62 but I'm not sure if the Egyptians were still using the Mig-15 as a frontline fighter then. I'm pretty sure they'd moved on to the -17, -19 and -21 by the time of the '67 disagreement.
What if the Mirage and the -15 did meet in combat? Ignoring the Mig pilot managing to jump the Mirage, I'm guessing the Mirage would be expected to win, if only due to the far higher quality of the average Israeli pilot. Yes or no?
The Israelis got the Mirage in early '62 but I'm not sure if the Egyptians were still using the Mig-15 as a frontline fighter then. I'm pretty sure they'd moved on to the -17, -19 and -21 by the time of the '67 disagreement.
What if the Mirage and the -15 did meet in combat? Ignoring the Mig pilot managing to jump the Mirage, I'm guessing the Mirage would be expected to win, if only due to the far higher quality of the average Israeli pilot. Yes or no?
ME-262 vs A-10 Thunderbolt 2
Super Tucano and Texatron Scorpion vs a P-51 or BF-109
AH-64 vs A6M Zero
AH-1Z Viper vs FW-190
Super Tucano and Texatron Scorpion vs a P-51 or BF-109
AH-64 vs A6M Zero
AH-1Z Viper vs FW-190