What if the USA sent Khomeini an ultimatum when the hostage crisis began?

Lusitania

Donor
I repeat: Lebanon was a very different situation from Iran. Iran's hostage crisis was supported by its true ruler, Khomeini. Meanwhile, the situation in Lebanon was that of a civil war between several militias and with the involvement of other countries. That would make intervening in Lebanon far more complicated than intervening in Iran.
We keep talking about Khomeini being is charge and when the hostages happen, he and his goons were still not in charge of the country, they were working on it and standing up to the hated SATAN US helped them. If the US had gotten them out quickly even if portion of the hostages were killed it might of weaken him and prevented them from gaining control of country as they did. But the worse thing that could of happen was to declare war or threaten war since that would of played into their hands.

Following the revolution there was a possibility that a real democracy could of taken hold or a more neutral government but the religious fanatics wanted power and the hostages were a means to it.

Also a few people have talked about comparing Iran to Libya but again we talking about two different places. Libya had a leader and government in place that was facilitating terrorism, Iran at time was in flux and nothing the US could do sort of covert operation to free them and strike at the leaders could of resolved the issue.
 
Didn't Reagan withdrawn from Lebanon due to a terrorist bombing? Womp womp.

Reagan did not even want them there. Getting them out one way or another was fine to him.

At that it was 105 days between the truck bomb attack on the Marines and the decision to withdraw the US contingent. The collapse of the current Lebanese government with the resignation of the PM & his cabinet 5 Feb & the start of rioting or fighting between the Druze & Shiite Militias the 5th & 6th Feb triggered the specific decision made 7 February 1984.

The truck bomb attack was on 23 October 1983, BLT 2/8 started landing to replace BLT 1/8. Landing a new unit on schedule is hardly a hasty or panicked withdrawal.
 
At that it was 105 days between the truck bomb attack on the Marines and the decision to withdraw the US contingent. The collapse of the current Lebanese government with the resignation of the PM & his cabinet 5 Feb & the start of rioting or fighting between the Druze & Shiite Militias the 5th & 6th Feb triggered the specific decision made 7 February 1984.

The truck bomb attack was on 23 October 1983, BLT 2/8 started landing to replace BLT 1/8. Landing a new unit on schedule is hardly a hasty or panicked withdrawal.

So you're saying the bombing wasn't the proximate cause of the withdrawal? Contradicts most historians' views of it. Or take the word of Colonel Geraghty:

On October 12, 198, President Reagan signed the Lebanon War Powers Authorization Resolution into war, although Secretary of State Schultz immediately made it clear that should the Marines still be in Lebanon, the administration would not feel bound to withdraw them at the end of the congressionally authorized eighteen months. Eleven days after the bill was passed, the suicide truck bombing hit the Marine BLT building. The magnitude and devastation of the bombings of the U.S. and French compounds doomed the following week's national reconciliation talks in Geneva before they began and triggered a major change in the U.S. national policy to withdraw the USMNF within four months.. Iran and Syria had done their homework."
 
So you're saying the bombing wasn't the proximate cause of the withdrawal? Contradicts most historians' views of it. Or take the word of Colonel Geraghty:

No, I am not. Where do you see that?

The bomb was a important factor, but it it took several other events to bring the final decision. What is challenged is the narrative that the Multinational Force or Marnis withdrew swiftly in a "panic". I run across many people who believe the US or Multinational Force departed within a few days. Have even seen claims of abandoned tanks, artillery, & heliocpters.

The Multinational Force was inserted with hope of defusing the internal conflicts and preventing a repeat of the refugee camp massacres. This was politically naieve & even before the attacks on the French and Marines it was evident the effort was very likely to fail. It was a idealist effort, but as we know the path to hell is paved with good intentions.
 
No, I am not. Where do you see that?

The bomb was a important factor, but it it took several other events to bring the final decision. What is challenged is the narrative that the Multinational Force or Marnis withdrew swiftly in a "panic".

Ah, so you were arguing against a claim I didn't make. Okay.
 
Ah, so you were arguing against a claim I didn't make. Okay.

Unless you were hinting the Multinational Force or Marines departed in a panic no. I was expanding on your remark. The argument is with the 'panic withdrawl' folks.

The intevenotinists were pretty unrealistic in this from the start. Those of us that were skeptics put on our optimistic faces and hoped for the best, but the evidence or history of Lebanese politics and culture was not good. There was pleanty of evidence previous to October the mission was failing, but the interventionists we're not the sort who could readily accept bad news. After the October attacks the interventionists clung to their position despite a loss of support in the US and more evidence. The end of what they claimed a US friendly government worth supporting in early Feb left the interventionists without even that straw.

When I returned to Quantico in 1985 I found interventionists still present and voluble. Some were insiders in the exec branch & we're still pounding the bar top about 'Saving the Lebanese people'.
 
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IIRC, Carter once said that if he had razed Tehran to the ground, he'd have been re-elected even if all hostages perished. Before, I thought that he was mistaken in this view, but after many of the posts here I think he might have been quite right...

Also I find if very coincidental that the frequency of various things like high jacking airplanes went noticeably up after the US rolled over and played dead on the hostage situation and basically took a noticeably drop after Regan ordered the attack on Libya. So you can sing the praise of Carter and his handling of the situation but if he ever did anything right I can’t recall it and he may have done the best for the hostages but all the other Americans (and other innocent folks) that suffered in the attacks that went on (and still go on ) were sure screwed by Carter.
Hijacking of US airplanes was more frequent before 1979 than in the period between 1979 and 1986 (five against three occurrences in the same period), so it's no coincidence - it simply didn't happen. Though
as it has already been pointed out, Reagan gave in to the terrorists after the Lebanese bombing, which might have encouraged the hijacking of TWA flight 947 in 1985 - so your theory might have something right.
Or perhaps not, considering there were two hijacking within a year of the attack on Libya.
 
IIRC, Carter once said that if he had razed Tehran to the ground, he'd have been re-elected even if all hostages perished. Before, I thought that he was mistaken in this view, but after many of the posts here I think he might have been quite right...
I must confess that I, too, sometimes feel the pull of the mobster and gangster method, so to speak, as the way to really get things done.

But I’m going to pull a quote to the contrary, and from no less a source than Master Yoda himself!

———————

Luke: “Is the dark side stronger?”

Yoda: “No, no, no. Quicker, easier, more seductive.”

-The Empire Strikes Back (1980)

——————————

And then, there are lessons from poker. For example, being the new sheriff at the table works for a while, but then this player starts taking some big hits and losing some big chunks of money, and very unnecessarily at that. And I make no apologies of using the example of poker, for I think it’s probably the most studied example of game theory out there.
 
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