What if the Golden Horde had "become Russia"?

In China, the Mongols became the Yuan -- a legitimate Chinese dynasty that governed the empire directly through Chinese institutions. In essence, they became China.

In Iran, the Mongols became the Ilkhanate. Although the Ilkhan retained his nomadic armies in the pastures of Iran, the country itself was directly governed for the most part and there were garrisons throughout Iranian towns. Likewise, the Ilkhan became Iran.

In Russia, the Mongols became the Golden Horde -- a political entity that kept to the steppe, was always very distinct from its unwilling Slavic vassals, and ultimately chose not to remove the local Russian princes and replace them with the Horde's own governors.

What if the Mongols of Saray had also implemented direct administration in Russia and settled down in the sedentary zone?
 
The difference between the two examples you listed and Rus' is that the Mongols never ruled Rus' directly and had no reason to. Rus' was far away, poor and not really worth settling, unlike both China and Persia, so the Golden Horde found it a lot more beneficial to just rip tribute from them and be done with it.
 
Both Persia and China had a long history of being the seats of great empires prior to the Mongol invasions, whereas Kievan Rus was never really a unified state, let alone an empire that would leave a major cultural impression.
 
The difference between the two examples you listed and Rus' is that the Mongols never ruled Rus' directly and had no reason to. Rus' was far away, poor and not really worth settling, unlike both China and Persia, so the Golden Horde found it a lot more beneficial to just rip tribute from them and be done with it.

This is true but I wonder if this would apply to a Golden Horde that maintained full cohesion in the 15th century. The Russian economy was doing quite well by the late 14th century no? if Moscow keeps rebelling, I have to wonder if the Golden Horde would just decide to annex them and be done with it. There's also Ottoman aid to consider.
 
This is true but I wonder if this would apply to a Golden Horde that maintained full cohesion in the 15th century. The Russian economy was doing quite well by the late 14th century no? if Moscow keeps rebelling, I have to wonder if the Golden Horde would just decide to annex them and be done with it. There's also Ottoman aid to consider.

In that case, the Horde likely just picks a different Grand Prince from among the other Russian states to collect its tribute after sufficiently looting Moscow to cause the local economics to move around a different hub (No merchant is going to want to base their business out of a city that gets burned every other Tuesday).

However... reading the first post it looks like the POD is that the Golden Horde decided to implement a more direct rule right from the get-go. In that case, I do see them probably taking more inspiration from the Ottomans for systems of managing their Orthodox subjects ; probably requiring a direct movement of the court into one of the main Russian cities and slowly stripping the power from/marrying in the local Russian nobility.
 
This is true but I wonder if this would apply to a Golden Horde that maintained full cohesion in the 15th century. The Russian economy was doing quite well by the late 14th century no? if Moscow keeps rebelling, I have to wonder if the Golden Horde would just decide to annex them and be done with it. There's also Ottoman aid to consider.

Yes, the "Russian" economy only grew after one of many principalities consolidated power, that being Muscovy. As for more cohesion, I doubt that is possible. Succession in the Golden Horde came about by electing a prince of Borjigin blood, but because there were so many the claimants, you would have factionalism, that even spread into the Rus principalities under the Golden Horde claimants would look for the backing of Rus Princes to help against their rivals.

In for a Golden Horde Russia, the Horde aside from wherewithal, needs stability, the only times the Golden Powerful can be counted on 4-5 khans considering the high turnover rate.
 
I am not sure even with Juan dynasty (they were too budhist for confucian China and their reign wasn´t much popular or long-lasting).
With Russia - what about more stable "empire" in steppes with khans playing their vassals on north against each other?
Interesting point is eventual conversion to christianity...
FillyofDelphi: whoa, idea of "Golden Horde aka Ottoman empire of north" is great!
 
I am not sure even with Juan dynasty (they were too budhist for confucian China and their reign wasn´t much popular or long-lasting).
With Russia - what about more stable "empire" in steppes with khans playing their vassals on north against each other?
Interesting point is eventual conversion to christianity...
FillyofDelphi: whoa, idea of "Golden Horde aka Ottoman empire of north" is great!

Conversion to Christianity is unlikely: Muslim dynasties have, in many many instances, proven they can rule over vast non-Muslim populations, especially if they don't go too crazy with the conversion efforts. If anything, you might see some shifts in Russia towards, if not Islam, a move within Russian Orthodoxy to be in more line with Islamic principals as the urban population of the Tartar-settled cities tries to become more like the local upper class (Similar to historical concerns about some "Turning Turk" in Ottoman-controlled territories). Iconoclasim, at the very least, is likely to get a boost from Islamic influences.

As for the stable steppe Empire... unlikely. The Steppes aren't very suitable terrain for urbanization and centeralization of political power, which the OP says is the case here (Imposing direct rule on the Russians... perhaps through a Millet-type system). For that, it's better if the Tartars move UP from the steppes and live in Russia proper, like the Turks did. Perhaps another Khanate/tribal group acends in Centeral Asia, putting pressure on the Horde to migrate North just as the Russian city-states are getting weakened via plague/Teutonic-crusader shenanigans? The later would be especially effective, as it would alienate the Ruskies from the Catholic Christians.
 
What if the Mughals who had became India were also Mongols like in the sense they were more like the immediately post-Genghis successor as opposed to the more distant Timurids.
 
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