What if Saudi Arabia accepts Bin Laden's help?

This is my first thread, so I apologize for any roughness. I was watching The Kingdom again this morning, and was inspired to propose this scenario, since I hadn't really seen done before.

When Osama bin Laden returned from Afghanistan in 1990, he was praised in the Saudi press as a 'hero of the jihad', who had, along with al-Qaeda, "brought down the mighty superpower" of the Soviet Union. With Iraq invading Kuwait, bin Laden went to the Saudi Minister of Defense, Prince Sultan and offered to defend Saudi Arabia using al-Qaeda, instead of having non-Muslim troops entering Saudi Arabia:

[Bin Laden:] "I am ready to prepare 100,000 fighters with good combat capability within three months. You don't need Americans. You don't need any other non-Muslim troops. We will be enough."

[Prince Sultan:] "There are no caves in Kuwait. What will you do when he lobs missiles at you with chemical and biological weapons?"

[Bin Laden:] "We will fight him with faith."


Historically, he was rebuffed, and went on to denounce the reliance of the Saudi government on American military power, and his increasing criticism eventually lead to the government trying to silence him, leading to his moving to Sudan with his terror network.

But what if Prince Sultan had agreed to his proposal, and instead of coalition forces, it was al-Qaeda who faced off against the Iraqis? I don't know if it would be a case of political ASB for such an occurrence to happen, but what might some of the outcomes be of this situation?
 

Khanzeer

Banned
Mujahedeen were fooled by their own propaganda
When they fought with conventional tactics they were massacred look at the battle of Jalalabad 1989
 
Gee, can't figure out why he was rebuffed!
To be fair, Iran pulled off the same stunt. Khomeini promised paradise to every man who dies in battle during the Iran-Iraq war, so people would up running towards Iraqi lines in nothing but a coffin shroud and explosive belts. Sometimes, without even the belts! The latter was when they'd clear out Iraqi minefields or absorb machine-gun fire by "human wave" tactics. Scared the shit out of the Iraqis, it did.

Of course, the bigger difference is that the Iranians had a semi-competent army, something which the Saudis lack. The 'human wave' tactics were just to wear down defenses and use up ammunition before the main assaults began.
 
To be fair, Iran pulled off the same stunt. Khomeini promised paradise to every man who dies in battle during the Iran-Iraq war, so people would up running towards Iraqi lines in nothing but a coffin shroud and explosive belts. Sometimes, without even the belts! The latter was when they'd clear out Iraqi minefields or absorb machine-gun fire by "human wave" tactics. Scared the shit out of the Iraqis, it did.

Of course, the bigger difference is that the Iranians had a semi-competent army, something which the Saudis lack. The 'human wave' tactics were just to wear down defenses and use up ammunition before the main assaults began.

And another difference would be that Khomeini made his appeal to(no offense, but...) delusional religious fanatics, whereas the Prince Sultan, while probably a religious man, would have been someone with a fairly firm grasp on the realities of warfare, who knew you couldn't just pray your way out of a slaughter.
 
I don't see how taking him at his offer helps the KSA? It might create some havoc for Iraq but it doesn't get them out of Kuwait.
Further, isn't that what they did with Syria, starting ISIL? That didn't turn out so well.
 
And another difference would be that Khomeini made his appeal to(no offense, but...) delusional religious fanatics, whereas the Prince Sultan, while probably a religious man, would have been someone with a fairly firm grasp on the realities of warfare, who knew you couldn't just pray your way out of a slaughter.
You're not wrong. Bear in mind Iran had just undergone a religious revolution a few years previous, mostly as a result of the failure of the moderates and the monarchists/traditionalists to offer real solutions to the Iranians. Iran had a deluge of religious zeal at the time, and most of the human wave volunteers were young men aged 16-23, the perfect age for strong and radical ideals and faith. Iran, like most Middle Eastern/3rd World countries has a middle-heavy population towards younger people. Furthermore, Khomeini's title is a religious leader, a mullah and religious authority in Shi'ite-dominated Iran.

The Prince Sultan, by contrast, while religious is a secular king with little claim to religious righteousness besides custodianship of the Holy Cities. The Saudis are traditionalists and religious, but they're not comfortable appealing to wild and uncontrollable faith, since they're not certain they can control it (unlike Khomeini, who was literally the highest religious authority of his country). Perhaps this is another reason why Prince Sultan was so weary of calling in the mujahedeen; once they're done with Iraq, who's to say they won't turn around against the Western-aligned and wealthy Sauds, proclaiming them to be inadequate heirs to Mohammad's message? What if, in the process of stirring the populace against Saddam, they also stir the population against the Sauds?

The Sauds have a very clear policy about troublemakers, despite how the education system breeds religious fanatics like rabbits; send them outside, or they get tossed in a deep dark jail cell, never to see daylight again. Best to keep such troublekeepers at bay, after all, not near the people where they can incite a vulnerable populous into following an even more zealous and self-righteous fanaticism. Mostly, they're aimed at Saudi's problems abroad; Syria, Iraq, Afghanistan, etc... and then never allowed to return. That was true for the mujahedeen, and it's another reason why Prince Sultan wouldn't accept Bin Laden's offer.
I don't see how taking him at his offer helps the KSA? It might create some havoc for Iraq but it doesn't get them out of Kuwait.
Further, isn't that what they did with Syria, starting ISIL? That didn't turn out so well.
Pretty much. Like I said, it would more likely incite the local Saudi population to turn against the increasingly decadent Sauds rather than help Saudi Arabia get Saddam out of Kuwait.

Not to mention... you guys thought Bashar Al-Assad was monstrous when he quelled revolts? He's just an ice-cold bastard, like his father, Hafiz, but dear God in Heaven was Saddam terrifying. He'd do stuff even Hafiz would have blanched at - and Hafiz had ended a 1982 Muslim Brotherhood revolt in Hama by leveling the city with air power an artillery. He might have a lot of problems with fighting the mujahedeen, but he'd have no qualms about crushing them utterly. I mean, ask the Kurds.
 

Deleted member 94680

I don't see how taking him at his offer helps the KSA? It might create some havoc for Iraq but it doesn't get them out of Kuwait.
Further, isn't that what they did with Syria, starting ISIL? That didn't turn out so well.

I suppose the idea would be that Bin Laden becomes tied up in the defence of Saudi Arabia and eventually improves his efforts beyond religious fanatics. It seems the man himself would be able to bring considerable financial backing to a programme, but mainly he would be satisfied with helping the KSA, rather than casting around for a new cause.
 

Khanzeer

Banned
Also bear in mind
Saudis knew Soviet withdrawal had a lot more to do with their internal power dynamics, poor economy than the capabilities of muhajideen.They made a romantic figure to sell to the average Muslim but reality is facing any army In open battle they were just target practice.See how Iran dealt with MEK in 1988 even when they were really weakened.

Southern Iraq is shia dominated, they will fight just as zealously to keep wahabi militias from arriving at their doorstep
Saddam named his missiles " al hussain" and " al Abbas " , I'm assuming to appease shias
he could easily turn shia fear of wahabi to his advantage

Secondly the gun slinging muhajideen if they liberate Kuwait they will not return to their king they will form a 90s kind of ISIS super state

Training their fighters to man anything more than simple MANPADS, MRL, HMG, and simple artillery will be a nightmare

Plus command and control will be almost nonexistent , all commanders thought they were equals no chain of command

Iraqi military is well familiar with fighting light infantry as pasdaran were pretty innovative in their approach
 
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