What if President Grant was assassinated early on in his second term by the KKK?

fdas

fdas

Banned
Motivated by hatred of Grant, members of the KKK plot to kill the president who they see as representing Northern oppression. The plot involves hundreds of KKK members who secretly gather in Washington DC and prepare stashes of weapons. In August of 1873 they launch an armed uprising and attack the White House before anyone is able to oppose them. After capturing the White House, president Grant and most of his cabinet are killed. The vice president is able to survive since he was not there. Eventually, the army is able to defeat the KKK members and restore order.

How does the country react in the aftermath of this event? With Grant dying before all of the scandals come to light, does he end up far more venerated in the future? And how will this galvanize support for Reconstruction, affecting the public's attitude toward the South?
 
Taunay

Taunay

Henry Wilson (The vice president) voted to convict Andrew Johnson and was opposed Presidential power to Southern Reconstruction. The murder of President would make the North furious.
Reconstruction would actually happen ITTL instead of OTL worst-case scenario
 

Hugh Third of Five

fdas said:
With Grant dying before all of the scandals come to light, does he end up far more venerated in the future?
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Many of those "scandals" were wild exaggerations by Lost Causers. With that being said the North would be in no mood for reconciliation. Reconstruction would be thorough. Abridging the voting rights of the freedmen would not be tolerated; anyone attempting to threaten voters or elected officials would be hanged.
 
Slime_blob

Slime_blob

This can result into blacks.fleein for their lives are now apparently it looks like in more danger as the president who tried uplifting them is killed by some white supremacist. Maybe flee to the North, Liberia and Haiti?
 

Hugh Third of Five

Slime_blob said:
This can result into blacks.fleein for their lives are now apparently it looks like in more danger as the president who tried uplifting them is killed by some white supremacist. Maybe flee to the North, Liberia and Haiti?
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The cost of fleeing to Liberia or Haiti would be more expensive than most black people could afford. Also with a more hardline approach to reconstruction, there would probably be less incentive to move north, though a number of butterflies could fly between the Grant administration and OTL Great Migration.
 
Slime_blob

Slime_blob

Hugh Third of Five said:
The cost of fleeing to Liberia or Haiti would be more expensive than most black people could afford. Also with a more hardline approach to reconstruction, there would probably be less incentive to move north, though a number of butterflies could fly between the Grant administration and OTL Great Migration.
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Well either the government helps them, they could afford it or some private institution does, as there is like someone killed their president whom they like alot
 

Mikestone8

AltoRegnant said:
I imagine the army is going back in the south
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How much army is there by 1873? Presumably most of the wartime one is back in civilian life by now.

And iirc the KKK no longer existed (at least on paper) in 1873, though the assassins could be former members. Wouldn't the white supremacists just lie low for a couple of years and wait for the furore to die down?
 
Taunay

Taunay

Mikestone8 said:
Wouldn't the white supremacists just lie low for a couple of years and wait for the furore to die down?
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White supremacists aren't exactly known for being good strategists. Like, invading a Caribbean country in the middle of the Cold War or pushing public opinion against them by committing violence against Civil Rights protesters. In fact, they would use this moment to celebrate Grant's death and try to recruit more Southerners to the cause, by saying that they had killed "a tyrant" and an "oppressor of the South". I could see guerrilla warfare in some states, and depending on just how brutal it is, Northern anger would go back up. After all, the North isn't just letting two presidents being assassinated by Southern White supremacists being unnoticed (They Had AJ but at least they were able to pass their amendments, even if weakly enforced)
 
Chapman

Chapman

Donor
"Laying low" might be an option for individual Klan members involved in this attack, assuming they survive. They might be able to make a getaway, unidentified, and without the conveniences of modern technology to assist the authorities, manage to hide away for some time (if not for the rest of their lives). However, as noted above, white supremacists as a bunch are not necessarily the most strategically brilliant. This event would cause a huge outrage in the north and many would be demanding action. The weak enforcement of Reconstruction is about to become much more heavy-handed and unapologetic. One POTUS killed by a Confederate sympathizer is bad enough. A second one killed, this time murdered in the White House in what would have to be a very dramatic scene? That won't sit well with most of the country, not just the north. The ensuing response by the federal government will have quite a bit of popular momentum behind it. And again, I can easily see some of these not-very-bright Klan members (and assorted non-Klan racists) messing this up further by trying to use it as a PR message for their cause. Eventually groups like the Klan will be ground down to a nub - though that isn't to say other organizations can't fill the void. Perhaps organizations with just a little bit more sense who understand that the intense violence isn't a winning strategy in the long term. But for a while I imagine anyone associated with the Klan will be watched and have their reputation take a hit.
 
Taunay

Taunay

Chapman said:
"Laying low" might be an option for individual Klan members involved in this attack, assuming they survive. They might be able to make a getaway, unidentified, and without the conveniences of modern technology to assist the authorities, manage to hide away for some time (if not for the rest of their lives). However, as noted above, white supremacists as a bunch are not necessarily the most strategically brilliant. This event would cause a huge outrage in the north and many would be demanding action. The weak enforcement of Reconstruction is about to become much more heavy-handed and unapologetic. One POTUS killed by a Confederate sympathizer is bad enough. A second one killed, this time murdered in the White House in what would have to be a very dramatic scene? That won't sit well with most of the country, not just the north. The ensuing response by the federal government will have quite a bit of popular momentum behind it. And again, I can easily see some of these not-very-bright Klan members (and assorted non-Klan racists) messing this up further by trying to use it as a PR message for their cause. Eventually groups like the Klan will be ground down to a nub - though that isn't to say other organizations can't fill the void. Perhaps organizations with just a little bit more sense who understand that the intense violence isn't a winning strategy in the long term. But for a while I imagine anyone associated with the Klan will be watched and have their reputation take a hit.
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Yeah, I agree. Just for the sake of comparison, imagine that, in 1965, before the Voting Rights Act, some white supremacist organization murdered LBJ. The vast majority would be appaled, but a small group would try to use this as a PR move, trying to recruit more people to the movement. The Voting Rights Act would be even more strict and race relations could even be better in the long-term by uniting blacks and whites under a common tragedy and showing some white moderates that white supremacists, if they had their way, would not spare them
 

Kalvan

fdas said:
Why isn't it possible to get such a group together?
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With the closing of DeBowe's Review, and before the rise of William Randolph Hearst, the closest thing to encrypted mass social media at that time and place would be a combination of (not so) secret decoder rings and church and saloon doors and public notice boards one can nail flyers with secret messages to readable with those decoder rings.

Of course, printing presses back then were massive capital expenditures, too. And getting the word out is only one part of the logistics puzzle to solve...
 
fdas

fdas

Banned
Kalvan said:
With the closing of DeBowe's Review, and before the rise of William Randolph Hearst, the closest thing to encrypted mass social media at that time and place would be a combination of (not so) secret decoder rings and church and saloon doors and public notice boards one can nail flyers with secret messages to readable with those decoder rings.

Of course, printing presses back then were massive capital expenditures, too. And getting the word out is only one part of the logistics puzzle to solve...
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Couldn't KKK members use word of mouth to communicate the details of the plan to people they know are also fervently committed to their cause? The plan isn't too complicated, they just need to get together in DC on the right day and attack. Getting the weapons is the hard part, but it should be possible due to there not being any good surveillance technology at the time. Caches of guns could be smuggled in easily.
 

brunohusker

First of all, the klan is banned and reconstruction will continue as long as there is a threat. Sure this might galvanize southern whites, but the feds might st least keep troops down there.

Secondly, the klan will still sadly be kind of active even if it goes underground, and will terrorize noncompliance whites. Sure you will have voices who tell them to stop for their own class, and will tell them it’s what’s needed for full control of politics in the south, but there still will be a violent klan-type movement.

As for African Americans, some might stay, but many might move west. The government might even give them some “reparations” in the form of land in the west. I don’t know how many would try, but maybe a larger exoduster movement is possible, even if they still can vote in the south.

Lastly, electorally, I’d think the Democrats are finished in the north, and you might see some proto-socialist parties or more worker type parties to represent workers. The democrats are mostly a southern party after this.
 

brunohusker

Chapman said:
"Laying low" might be an option for individual Klan members involved in this attack, assuming they survive. They might be able to make a getaway, unidentified, and without the conveniences of modern technology to assist the authorities, manage to hide away for some time (if not for the rest of their lives). However, as noted above, white supremacists as a bunch are not necessarily the most strategically brilliant. This event would cause a huge outrage in the north and many would be demanding action. The weak enforcement of Reconstruction is about to become much more heavy-handed and unapologetic. One POTUS killed by a Confederate sympathizer is bad enough. A second one killed, this time murdered in the White House in what would have to be a very dramatic scene? That won't sit well with most of the country, not just the north. The ensuing response by the federal government will have quite a bit of popular momentum behind it. And again, I can easily see some of these not-very-bright Klan members (and assorted non-Klan racists) messing this up further by trying to use it as a PR message for their cause. Eventually groups like the Klan will be ground down to a nub - though that isn't to say other organizations can't fill the void. Perhaps organizations with just a little bit more sense who understand that the intense violence isn't a winning strategy in the long term. But for a while I imagine anyone associated with the Klan will be watched and have their reputation take a hit.
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Totally agree that if the klan does they will be ground down. I’m sure you’ll see more respectable groups rise up who want similar but less intense aims. Also, it’s not like any generals afterwards were itching for the south to fight again. Maybe some bitter types but they’d be outgunned quickly. Plus such groups might even turn more into simple gangs like the James-Younger gang. That might even be an interesting tl. Have a southern racist organized crime group fighting feds and local law enforcement. Maybe they even start providing “protection” for a fee. Of course this might backfire and such groups just become folk heroes.
 
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