What if:German submarine U-234 arrives in Japan

German submarine U-234 arrives in Japan

German submarine U-234 s a Type XB U-boat of the German Kriegsmarine during World War II first and only mission into enemy territory consisted of the attempted delivery of uranium oxide and other German advanced weapons technology to the Empire of Japan. After learning of Germany's unconditional surrender, the submarine's crew surrendered to the United States on 14 May 1945.

But what if she instead does not surrender but for the point of this what if she arrives in the Empire of Japan, what would the effect be for the Empire of japan as she was cargo included three crated Messershmitt Me-262 jet fighters and an ME-163 rocket-propelled fighter, Henschel HS-293 glider-bomb, extra Junkers jet engines, 10 canisters of uranium oxide, a ton of diplomatic mail, and over 3 tons of technical drawings, plus other technology (torpedo, fuses, armor piercing shells, etc.) and twelve passengers, including a German general, four German naval officers, civilian engineers and scientists, and two Japanese naval officers.
 
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It's too late for all that to be of use, let alone a difference. As for the post war Japan, by the time they begin building up their armed forces again, it's too old, even if they keep it hidden away from the Americans
 
I think a more interesting scenario, though it would obviously be ASB, is to see how the war would be affected if it arrived in Japan, but in May 1941 instead. ;)
 
Me 163 based Kamikazes!!!

So, they'd be like OTL Me 163s, then? I mean, the things did have a tendency explode during landing if there was fuel left in the tank.

As for the OP, I don't really see it changing anything, even if the sub magically arrives in 1941. Japan has neither the resources or the industry to truly exploit the information given to them and most of the tech is basically designed for German needs, which aren't really Japan's needs. Oh, some stuff would be useful, so they'd probably perform better in the war, but not enough to even shift the outcome from hopeless to might have a shot at it, a tiny one.
 
So, they'd be like OTL Me 163s, then? I mean, the things did have a tendency explode during landing if there was fuel left in the tank.

.

you're missing the point that 100% of kamekazis had the tendancy to explode when they landed... that was sort of like... um... the point!:rolleyes:
 
you're missing the point that 100% of kamekazis had the tendancy to explode when they landed... that was sort of like... um... the point!:rolleyes:

Actually, statistically speaking, not all that many succeeded in the whole 'crash and explode' thing. And I do seem to remember reading about at least one Japanese pilot (because there was that Russian pilot with a number of aerial victories that involved crashing his airplane into the enemy) that actually pulled multiple kamikaze runs in his career.

So, in conclusion: the Me-163 helps the Japanese do kamikaze attacks right, because you'll always explode. Always.
 
Actually, statistically speaking, not all that many succeeded in the whole 'crash and explode' thing. And I do seem to remember reading about at least one Japanese pilot (because there was that Russian pilot with a number of aerial victories that involved crashing his airplane into the enemy) that actually pulled multiple kamikaze runs in his career.

So, in conclusion: the Me-163 helps the Japanese do kamikaze attacks right, because you'll always explode. Always.

No the ME-163 rocket-propelled fighter brought onboard U-234 together with blue prints will help the Japanese to perfect their development of their Mitsubishi J8M Shūsui rocket-powered interceptor aircraft closely based on the German Messerschmitt Me 163 Komet.
 
No the ME-163 rocket-propelled fighter brought onboard U-234 together with blue prints will help the Japanese to perfect their development of their Mitsubishi J8M Shūsui rocket-powered interceptor aircraft closely based on the German Messerschmitt Me 163 Komet.

Can they do this before the war ends?
 
I think the thermal fuses carried by U-234 were used in the Plutonium Devices and the Uranium in Little Boy, this may keep Japan from getting nuked if August Storm goes in as OTL, which would have interesting post war butterflies when the next conflict occurs
 
One extremely good ATL would be the German sub arriving, delivering the Wunderwaffen and thus inspiring the Japanese to fight even after the August nuclear bombings.
Have the US invade the Home Islands facing rocket powered Kamikazes!
 
One extremely good ATL would be the German sub arriving, delivering the Wunderwaffen and thus inspiring the Japanese to fight even after the August nuclear bombings.
Have the US invade the Home Islands facing rocket powered Kamikazes!

A grand total of four of them. "Three crated Messershmitt Me-262 jet fighters and an ME-163 rocket-propelled fighter", remember. It's not like Japan had the industry or the time left to build any more.
 
It's not like Japan had the industry or the time left to build any more.
I think they did. They still have around 6 months to make some and if they have a couple of hundred by the time the home islands are invaded, it would make stuff interesting.
 
One extremely good ATL would be the German sub arriving, delivering the Wunderwaffen and thus inspiring the Japanese to fight even after the August nuclear bombings.
Have the US invade the Home Islands facing rocket powered Kamikazes!

Why would they invade? They'll just keep dropping bombs and blockading Japan until they either surrender or there's nothing left.
 
I think they did. They still have around 6 months to make some and if they have a couple of hundred by the time the home islands are invaded, it would make stuff interesting.

Well they would need to make the machine-tools for making the engines and airframes first, not to mention the time needed to recreate a working copy from the schematics while faces severe material shortages.
 

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Well they would need to make the machine-tools for making the engines and airframes first, not to mention the time needed to recreate a working copy from the schematics while faces severe material shortages.

Yeah. That's the catch, and then there's the need to have the personell to man the equipment, all of which would be better put to use making things of more immediate use, not wunderwaffen that wouldn't actually amount to anything. Maybe if they had plans for the He162 they could have done something with it but even that would likely be a massive waste of materials.
 
Yeah. That's the catch, and then there's the need to have the personell to man the equipment, all of which would be better put to use making things of more immediate use, not wunderwaffen that wouldn't actually amount to anything. Maybe if they had plans for the He162 they could have done something with it but even that would likely be a massive waste of materials.

Especially because they don't have the skilled pilots to make use of them in a conventional sense and as Kamikazes they just sit around with the rest of the stockpiled aircraft while the US reduces Japan to radioactive rubble.
 
Especially because they don't have the skilled pilots to make use of them in a conventional sense and as Kamikazes they just sit around with the rest of the stockpiled aircraft while the US reduces Japan to radioactive rubble.

Not that strong an objection--you don't need skilled pilots for Kamikaze missions.

A stronger objection is: even if they could get a design done in 6 months (answer: no; mass producing bleeding-edge technology is tougher than that, even with prototypes and blueprints)--what would they use for materials? Japan doesn't have a lot of mineral resources--that's why they invaded China in the first place.
 
No the ME-163 rocket-propelled fighter brought onboard U-234 together with blue prints will help the Japanese to perfect their development of their Mitsubishi J8M Shūsui rocket-powered interceptor aircraft closely based on the German Messerschmitt Me 163 Komet.
As a side note, previous "monsoon" U boats had delivered samples and technical plans of jet engines of one kind or another to the Japanese. The Germans and the Japanese, however, suffered a low grade paranoia fever of each other and the Germans ordered jet engine assistance slowed when they noted that the Japanese were making too much progress too quickly.
 
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