What If Cato Dies In/To/From Cyprus?

Dirk

Banned
What if Cato the Younger, the most vehement opponent of Julius Caesar, had died in the fighting to take Cyprus, or had died in a shipwreck on the way to or from his command?

Preferably I'd like it to be while sailing home, because then the butterflies are minimal. With Caesar away in Gaul this doesn't affect the Gallic Wars, and the crossing of the Rubicon is still a possibility.

BUT!

But, it is known that Pompey was on the verge of accepting Caesar's bid to run for a second consulship in absentia, with Cato changing his mind somehow. So the major departure from OTL, as I see it, is that Caesar is allowed to run and never has to cross the Rubicon.

There is no civil war, Caesar is consul for a second time and properly and fully organizes Gaul, then returns home to become a venerated icon and respected elderly statesman. His legions are retired and settled in Gaul. What other effects do you see?
 
Problem : Cato's mission in Cyprus occured in 58/57, much earlier than the beginning of negotiations between Pompey and Caesar about Caesar's candidacy in absentia for a second consulship.

But let's say Cato died in 57 or 56. The question then is : would anyone else have taken back his role and pushed things ou to the clash ?

The answer is, to my point of view : obviously positive. Cato was only a figurehead and there were other optimates as stuborn as him : Domitius Ahenobarbus, the Claudii Marcelli, ... Etc.

And most of all, Cato or not Cato, the breach between Caesar and Pompey only occured when and because Pompey wanted and decided to.
 
Problem : Cato's mission in Cyprus occured in 58/57, much earlier than the beginning of negotiations between Pompey and Caesar about Caesar's candidacy in absentia for a second consulship.

But let's say Cato died in 57 or 56. The question then is : would anyone else have taken back his role and pushed things ou to the clash ?

The answer is, to my point of view : obviously positive. Cato was only a figurehead and there were other optimates as stuborn as him : Domitius Ahenobarbus, the Claudii Marcelli, ... Etc.

And most of all, Cato or not Cato, the breach between Caesar and Pompey only occured when and because Pompey wanted and decided to.

Well what about keeping Julia Caesaris alive along with killing off Cato? Julia seemed to be the glue holding her father and husband together, so if she's alive I can't really see either moving against the other.
 
Well, in this case, as a famous historian once wrote : Pompey and Caesar would have established the imperial regime for this commun heir, if he had lived

You can very easily imagine young Gaius Julius Caesar Pompeianus, that is Pompey's third son adopter by his maternel grandfather Caesar to continue the line of the Julii Caesares (from our Caesar's branch).
 

Dirk

Banned
Well what about keeping Julia Caesaris alive along with killing off Cato? Julia seemed to be the glue holding her father and husband together, so if she's alive I can't really see either moving against the other.

That's...actually a really good idea. Cato dies and, though Pompey and Julia are already married by the time Cato leaves Cyprus (Cato went to Cyprus sometime around or just after 60BC; Pompey and Julia were married in the spring of 59BC), this butterflies things in Julia's life, preventing her miscarriage and death in childbirth.

So an implacable enemy of Caesar is gotten rid of and he and Pompey are as close as two men in their position can be. Pompey's future is secure even if Caesar manages to overshadow him: How could Caesar harm his own grandson's father?

As to who Caesar adopts, it would be his eldest grandson who's adopted (Romans didn't really have such a staunch concept of primogeniture), if he doesn't still decide to adopt Gaius Octavius, who would still show his political and academic brilliance, despite being physically not up to par.

Any thoughts?
 
You can be certain that Caesar would have adopted nobody else than his grandson if he had had a grandson by Pompey and Julia. This was common practice in the roman aristocracy and there are several examples of this.

What can be guessed is that, if The alliance between had lasted, it would have producteur its effects for a whole generation. That's what Cicero wrote in his in his private letters when the triumvirate was renewed in 56.

Except for the fiercest opponents, most of the nobility would have ended up by rallying to the triumvirs
 

Dirk

Banned
You can be certain that Caesar would have adopted nobody else than his grandson if he had had a grandson by Pompey and Julia. This was common practice in the roman aristocracy and there are several examples of this.

What can be guessed is that, if The alliance between had lasted, it would have producteur its effects for a whole generation. That's what Cicero wrote in his in his private letters when the triumvirate was renewed in 56.

Except for the fiercest opponents, most of the nobility would have ended up by rallying to the triumvirs

Alrighty then, thanks; I did not know of this precedent. It looks as though the stage is set, though I must catch up on my reading about what exactly was happening then and who the main players were.
 
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