What if a Papuan Civilization existed In history?

[Cultivation Emperor]

(Papuan Ambum Civilization) what if the Papuans of New Guinea built a thriving civilization? in this alternate history timeline, the Papuans build extensive megalithic structures (based on the Ambum Stone) and started developing complex farming societies that transform into state societies with advanced irrigation systems and urban 'garden cities'. The papuan state societies are briefly unified by loosely governed empires and they exert influence on the Torres strait islanders and Australian Aboriginals of Northern Australia. This burgeoning Papuan civilization comes with into contact with Austronesians in Indonesia and the Philippines trading with them and gaining new technologies. How would this have affected history, cultures, demographics, economics, social dynamics, languages, cultures, religion, politics, etc??

Ambum stone - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Arkenfolm]

This burgeoning Papuan civilization comes with into contact with Austronesians in Indonesia and the Philippines trading with them and gaining new technologies

They wouldn't so much "come into contact" with them as much as butterfly their migration to eastern Indonesia and the Pacific. Some Papuan peoples were very good seafarers themselves and clearly were spreading west at the same time Austronesians were spreading east. They might reach as far as Makassar TTL.

Using estimates for the precolonial Maya, who lived in a vaguely similar environment, I could see a population of around 15-20 million on the entire island.

I'd love to see a unified empire in New Guinea. I think it's possible, despite the awful topography, assuming they import horses (maybe that would be why they'd colonise Australia--Papuans/Papuan-influenced Aboriginals could raise horses and other livestock to trade to New Guinea) and have a foundation to build on (i.e. centuries of agricultural states who have cleared a lot of the land).

Or perhaps it's simply a Majapahit-esque formation loosely ruling the entire island and nearby islands, assuming the Papuans are Indianised and build off those institutions. I think they'd be another part of the "spice islands" then they'd probably be trading certain tropical woods and incenses (maybe, IOTL these were never commercialised), nutmeg, and reselling certain Australian spices like Tasmannia peppers (which TTL would probably be domesticated).

 

[Cultivation Emperor]

Yeah, I am leaning towards this being a Majapahit-style confederated empire as well

 

[Cultivation Emperor]

They wouldn't so much "come into contact" with them as much as butterfly their migration to eastern Indonesia and the Pacific. Some Papuan peoples were very good seafarers themselves and clearly were spreading west at the same time Austronesians were spreading east. They might reach as far as Makassar TTL.

Ok, that would be quite interesting tbh.

 

[ramones1986]

Would Trans-New Guinea languages dominate the whole island, lowlands included?

 

[Cultivation Emperor]

Would Trans-New Guinea languages dominate the whole island, lowlands included?

Well yes

 

[davidsmith]

The question is why a civilisation didn't become dominant on the island of new guinea. They have some highly productive land which was utilised for food development.

 

[Arkenfolm]

Yeah, I am leaning towards this being a Majapahit-style confederated empire as well

You do have to consider that Majapahit was the product of 2,000+ years of Indian cultural development in terms of statecraft and administration, and even regionally borrowed heavily from the traditions of how local Malay and Javanese states were governed (and IIRC also the Khmer Empire, the premier superpower of Southeast Asia).

There seems to be clear cultural divides in Indonesia that you can say go back millions and millions of years due to geography (the Wallace Line, Sundaland, etc). Austronesians east of Java developed more slowly and differently, even if large empires like Singhasari and Majapahit did reach that far. I think you'd have to have some indigenous New Guinean state-building traditions before they get exposed to Indian culture as the "eastern pole" of Insular Southeast Asia, otherwise the island won't be particularly advanced.

The question is why a civilisation didn't become dominant on the island of new guinea. They have some highly productive land which was utilised for food development.

Because the highlands and lowlands are two different environments, and the highlands are nigh-impenetrable in terms of topography and splintered into a vast number of separate ethnic groups, many of whom are fiercely territorial. So agriculture ended up being "incomplete", so to speak, on the island. Particularly I think the failure to quickly spread into the lowlands of New Guinea was probably fatal for the chances of an indigenous civilisation.

 

[Cultivation Emperor]

I think you'd have to have some indigenous New Guinean state-building traditions before they get exposed to Indian culture as the "eastern pole" of Insular Southeast Asia, otherwise the island won't be particularly advanced.
Yeah, fair enough.

 

[Combatiendo Venceremos]

This thread is kinda old (just under four months) but there's no 'replying is necroing' box so I'll respond (sorry mods if this is necromancy I haven't been active on this site for long)

To be honest, I do see ways for Papua to develop into something like an insular Melansian reverse Myanmar, a very multi-ethnic country with a highly mountainous and isolated,but still agricultural and contacted, interior.

While the Highlands of Papua have the best soil, the Northern Coast have similar soil types, and Southern Lowlands have a mix of soil types with similarities to the Java, which is irl has pretty productive farmland and is the most populated island in the world.

If agriculture spread out of the Highlands earlier, and a draft animal were domesticated, like carabaos (introduced to the Philippines by Austronesians at close time periods to Austronesian settlements on Papua), or if that species of small elephant-like creatures survived or even maybe cassowaries, which were being raised by Papuan farmers for meat and might be able to be a draft animal if bred bigger (bit of a reach but eh), I think that Papua could have developed sedentary agricultural societies.

 

[ennobee]

But off course, there will be papa papuas with blueflies and papuas that are not a papa and have blueflies and papuas that have blueflies whether they are papa papuas or no papa papuas and then amongst the papuan blueflies we have papa blueflies and papuan blueflies that are no papas but fly around the papa papuas.... At least according to this comic from the 1970's

 

[ArchimedesCircle]

Didn't the coastal Papuans trade with the people living in modern Indonesia, or am I misremembering that?

 

[Arkenfolm]

If agriculture spread out of the Highlands earlier, and a draft animal were domesticated, like carabaos (introduced to the Philippines by Austronesians at close time periods to Austronesian settlements on Papua), or if that species of small elephant-like creatures survived or even maybe cassowaries, which were being raised by Papuan farmers for meat and might be able to be a draft animal if bred bigger (bit of a reach but eh), I think that Papua could have developed sedentary agricultural societies.

They wouldn't need a draft animal when they could just import water buffalo or a similar animal from Southeast Asia.

Didn't the coastal Papuans trade with the people living in modern Indonesia, or am I misremembering that?

The ones in the western part of the island did, yes.

 

[Beatriz]

What would their religion look like?

 

[HyperMuscularDemon]

What would their religion look like?

Most likely some sort of native Papuan religion.

 

[Combatiendo Venceremos]

Didn't the coastal Papuans trade with the people living in modern Indonesia, or am I misremembering that?

In Western Papua, yes, though trade with a Papuan sedentary agricultural civilization would be far more intense and could include the North Coast and South Coast and even indirectly the rest of Papua.

 

[Combatiendo Venceremos]

What would their religion look like?

In South Western Papua, Islam. In the North, a mix of Theravada Buddhism and a Papuan native religion mixed with aspects of Hinduism, Buddhism, and Islam, in the South East, a mix of Islam and the native religion, in the Far East, mostly the Native Religion, and in the Highlands the Native Religion+Aministic Folk Belief+Buddhism+Islam+Christianity coexisting.

 

[Combatiendo Venceremos]

They wouldn't need a draft animal when they could just import water buffalo or a similar animal from Southeast Asia.

The ones in the western part of the island did, yes.

A draft animal earlier would make the production of a staple crop like winged beans or, once trade starts, rice, a lot easier, which would allow some groups to produce enough food to stop needing to be nomadic hunter-gatherers faster.

 

[Arkenfolm]

In South Western Papua, Islam. In the North, a mix of Theravada Buddhism and a Papuan native religion mixed with aspects of Hinduism, Buddhism, and Islam, in the South East, a mix of Islam and the native religion, in the Far East, mostly the Native Religion, and in the Highlands the Native Religion+Aministic Folk Belief+Buddhism+Islam+Christianity coexisting.

Why would Buddhism survive in Papua? It was never widespread in eastern Indonesia, frequently blended with Hinduism in most places, and rapidly lost ground to Islam and Islamic syncreticism. Even if it were its own center of civilisation, Papua would be at the very edge of Indonesian civilisation.

I think the only real chance it would have is if Papuans had a different cultural mindset than Southeast Asia and especially Maritime Southeast Asia. Which to me seems unlikely since the most developed Papuans would be the coastal ethnic groups who would borrow Austronesian and then Indic civilisation to develop themselves. They would extensively trade local goods. So they'd end up with the similar mindset that if the wealthy foreign merchants buying their stuff practice a certain religion, and those merchants are accompanied by convincing preachers, then that religion is worth following.

A draft animal earlier would make the production of a staple crop like winged beans or, once trade starts, rice, a lot easier, which would allow some groups to produce enough food to stop needing to be nomadic hunter-gatherers faster.

There were many coastal Papuan groups who were completely sedentary and raised pigs, fish, and farm crops like sago in addition to hunting and gathering in their nearby area. Some made long distance trade that included food items. If anything, it wasn't a problem of food as much as it was a problem of trade. More trade means more specialisation and the beginnings of true urbanisation. Sumatra and Java and coastal Borneo had these elements by the 1st-3rd centuries AD, but it took another few centuries for these elements to spread to other areas of modern Indonesia.

Intriguingly, there is evidence that the southern Papuan coastal trading networks were increasingly developed around this time but never took off, probably because the Lapita culture only had marginal influence there. If the Lapita culture more strongly influenced this area (probably by settlement and integration with local populations), then I think you'd have a real basis for a Papuan civilisation that would hybridise with the developments in the southwest/northwest part of the island and could truly join the Southeast Asian cultural realm. But I don't know how Papuan it would look, aside from their looks and appearances. They might even end up dominated by a Malay elite as Papuan offshoots like Ternate were, or small Papuan states in the west of the island.

 

[Combatiendo Venceremos]

Why would Buddhism survive in Papua?

Sorry, that was notes from my own planned Papuan TL leaking into that post, which has a reason in that TL but would probably not happen unless a series of very specific events occurred.