Was it politic\lly possible for Lincoln to have been more progressive on race

Could Lincoln have maintained office and the ability to govern had he

a) Ensured that 'colored' troops got equal pay?

b) Allowed for the possibility of black commissioned officers?

c) Stated before the 1864 election that former slaves whould have the vote?



As I read it (and I know this is deeply controversial) Lincoln was moving in a progressive direction on these issues. Not fast enough for brave good abolitionists but faster than many of his contemporaries.

Would fast moves have resulted in a more just Post war society or President McLellan and who knows what?
 
I doubt he could move much faster and still get re-elected. The Emancipation Proclamation was controversial as is. If he wouldn't have been assassinated he might have been able to do it his 2nd term.
 
Could Lincoln have maintained office and the ability to govern had he

a) Ensured that 'colored' troops got equal pay?

b) Allowed for the possibility of black commissioned officers?

c) Stated before the 1864 election that former slaves whould have the vote?



As I read it (and I know this is deeply controversial) Lincoln was moving in a progressive direction on these issues. Not fast enough for brave good abolitionists but faster than many of his contemporaries.

Would fast moves have resulted in a more just Post war society or President McLellan and who knows what?

That last might very easily have led to President McClellan.

Regarding equal pay, he could have advocated it but Congress would have had to vote the money, which they might well have refused.

Black commissioned officers maybe, though he wouldn't have courted controversy by putting them in charge of white soldiers.
 
There were a few black commissioned officers, I remember reading about one in particular, unfortunately I cannot remember his name, who held the rank of Major.

Ironically, the first African-American officers were the officers of the 1st Louisiana Native Guard (CSA)! They were an all free black militia formed in New Orleans (I think) at the start of the war. However they received no real recognition by the CSA government. I believe after the USA took New Orleans they became a US unit.

However so as to not steal the thread; the black vote was not going to happen without the 14th amendment. Remember abolitionists, despite being very vocal, were a minority.

Equal pay was not going to happen either. There was still the overwhelming attitude about blacks not being "good enough" to get what a white man could get. Very sad, but I do not like the "whitewashing" of history that sometimes occurs to make things seem better than they were.

I believe that Lincoln did the best that he could under the constraints of his time. There is also some evidence to suggest that Lincoln carried some of the common prejudges of his time as well.
 
Didn't they get equal pay in 1864? I seem to recall that one actually happening late war.

But Lincoln moving any faster...can't see how.
 
These are all possible but require a point of divergence prior to the start of the Civil War. Lincoln needs to have something occur in his life that makes him as willing to grant equal rights to blacks as he was to fight to preserve the Union. This would need to be kept low key to still receive the Republican nomination and win the election but again this is doable since much of the North was at this point more than willing to vote against the slave power of the South.

None of these ideas were new or particularly radical but convincing the Northern public would not have been easy. By playing up the idea that restoring the Union was a continuation of the ideas of liberty espoused by many of the Founding Fathers it may have been possible to link suppression of the rebellion with emancipation and equality in a way that was palatable to the Free States. This course may have thrown the border states into a closer relation with the Confederacy but if Lincoln's views did not come to light until mid 1864 it would not have changed the final outcome much.

Northern public opinion seemed at a cusp at this period of time and had Lincoln championed the cause of equal rights more it may have followed his lead. Unfortunately, Lincoln was more pragmatic and less a revolutionary.

Benjamin
 
These are all possible but require a point of divergence prior to the start of the Civil War. Lincoln needs to have something occur in his life that makes him as willing to grant equal rights to blacks as he was to fight to preserve the Union. This would need to be kept low key to still receive the Republican nomination and win the election but again this is doable since much of the North was at this point more than willing to vote against the slave power of the South.

None of these ideas were new or particularly radical but convincing the Northern public would not have been easy. By playing up the idea that restoring the Union was a continuation of the ideas of liberty espoused by many of the Founding Fathers it may have been possible to link suppression of the rebellion with emancipation and equality in a way that was palatable to the Free States. This course may have thrown the border states into a closer relation with the Confederacy but if Lincoln's views did not come to light until mid 1864 it would not have changed the final outcome much.

Northern public opinion seemed at a cusp at this period of time and had Lincoln championed the cause of equal rights more it may have followed his lead. Unfortunately, Lincoln was more pragmatic and less a revolutionary.

Benjamin

He could have, if he wanted to lose to Little Mac. These ideas were pretty radical in 1864. I think he could get them in his second term (assuming an ATL where he survives) as things were heading in that direction.
 
I found this on the PBS website regarding black soldiers.

Black soldiers faced discrimination as well as segregation. The army was extremely reluctant to commission black officers -- only one hundred gained commissions during the war. African American soldiers were also given substandard supplies and rations. Probably the worst form of discrimination was the pay differential. At the beginning of black enlistment, it was assumed that blacks would be kept out of direct combat, and the men were paid as laborers rather than as soldiers. Black soldiers therefore received $7 per month, plus a $3 clothing allowance, while white soldiers received $13 per month, plus $3.50 for clothes.
 
I found this on the PBS website regarding black soldiers.

Black soldiers faced discrimination as well as segregation. The army was extremely reluctant to commission black officers -- only one hundred gained commissions during the war. African American soldiers were also given substandard supplies and rations. Probably the worst form of discrimination was the pay differential. At the beginning of black enlistment, it was assumed that blacks would be kept out of direct combat, and the men were paid as laborers rather than as soldiers. Black soldiers therefore received $7 per month, plus a $3 clothing allowance, while white soldiers received $13 per month, plus $3.50 for clothes.


We know all this. The question is could Lincoln gone much faster and get re-elected? My answer is no. What he did was controversial as is not talking about things that were more radical for the time.
 
We know all this. The question is could Lincoln gone much faster and get re-elected? My answer is no. What he did was controversial as is not talking about things that were more radical for the time.

I just included this quote to show that there were a limited number of black officers commissioned during the war.
 
A, yes; B, I'm doubtful; C, very likely not.

Could Lincoln have maintained office and the ability to govern had he

a) Ensured that 'colored' troops got equal pay?

b) Allowed for the possibility of black commissioned officers?

c) Stated before the 1864 election that former slaves whould have the vote?



As I read it (and I know this is deeply controversial) Lincoln was moving in a progressive direction on these issues. Not fast enough for brave good abolitionists but faster than many of his contemporaries.

Would fast moves have resulted in a more just Post war society or President McLellan and who knows what?
 
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