Thanks, all!
LOL! Having the British attack on the day of Operation Barbarossa! Love it!
Smart Nazis? What madness have you created? Wagner is engaging in wheeling and dealing diplomatically that rivals some of the greatest leaders and diplomats of history.
I just couldn't resist using the date. Glad you enjoyed it!
Great stuff.
Wagner must be so glad that Benny the Moose managed to restrain his greed re: Nice, Savoy, and Corsica remaining French and not touching Algeria. One thing to throw him a bone, let Italy annex Monaco?
Is Germany returning the French POWs?
Interested to see how Wagner will deal with the Low Countries. Belgium is pretty much finished now.
Bismarck Mk. II
Probably when the African Front blows open.
Germany is returning the French prisoners and Monaco goes to Italy. The chapter has been edited to reflect this information, which I had meant to include. Regarding the Low Countries, yes Belgium is clearly in a bad way. As a matter of fact, I'm considering having a plebiscite held in Flanders as was proposed a few pages back.
Oh man, first Norway and now France. The best part is that it's in no way a Britain-screw, the attack on Norway was a beautiful deception by Wagner, and this one was OTL Churchill's crazy idea.
When he somehow brings the Soviets in on the Axis' side (maybe going through with bombing the Caucasus?), he's going to be out on his ass so fast, Wagner'll have to go to the hospital for whiplash.
I do hope Churchill's reputation is still positive ITTL.
He pulled a Belgium and stabbed an ally in the back. Granted the former was because of German deception and the latter was wavering, but still...
...the only way he can salvage his reputation is by defeating Germany. And that's not going to happen.
Churchill, you dun goofed.
Wasn't Gallipoli enough for you?
Taking Belgium apart was an excellent move. Annexing Wallonia and Congo will give French impression that Germans are treating them fairly (certainly compared to British), as opposed to acting vengeful. Lose some, gain some.
Let's not forget that outside of WW2, he did practically nothing IOTL to cover himself in glory. When you think about it that way, maybe he doesn't deserve a good reputation.
There's still the Gallipoli fiasco everyone seems to forget.
Tip of the iceburg. Chanak, the General Strike, Kenya after the war, his whole career was full of disasters. Not to forget Greece and the Dodocanese campaigns during the war, or his shameful Godwin attacks on the NHS which got him booted out of office in 1945 before the war was even over.
I guess succeeding in keeping Britain in the war doesn't equate winning the peace as well, eh?
Unfortunately for the Allied cause, there is really no way Churchill's reputation isn't suffering to an extent as a result of these events.
I'd say lose some, gain more. Compared to Wallonia and Congo the colonies they lost are chump change.
Of course, but if you weight In Alsace-Lorraine, well, that's gonna leave sour taste in French mouths no matter how generous Germans will be elsewhere.
Agreed...but that should be in the far future like say a decade or so after the war. Right now, the shock of the British stab-in-the-back and surprise (and perhaps a little 'they're not as bad as we thought they were' shame) at Germany's offer of 'peace with honor' (which include rich new territory that make lost territory pale by comparison) would take precedence in French minds.
EDIT: And even then, factoring in the good Franco-German relations brought by joint victory, Elsass-Lothringen might amicably be resolved once and for all after the war. Like say, the French-speaking parts go back to France while the German-speaking ones stay with Germany. Stranger things have happened.
It is fair to say that the more salient aspect in French opinion at the moment is what France has gained. Loosing Alsace-Lorraine is by no means a light blow, but it was to be entirely expected in light of the overwhelming nature of the defeat.
PERFECT.
Britain and France will see each other as betrayers and HATE each other with PASSION. Britain (afterwar) will likely more resent France the turncoats, for taking colonies, than Germany.
I totally like how Wagner scared Petain with the Versailles castle, to have him accept everything.
With the British sneak attack, plus no occupation and no reparations, French people will be on board for this new war, and see Petain as their savior (from harsh peace).
Many French, who hated Germans with passion, may warm up to them fast.
"When they could have crushed us like we did in '19, or worse, they spared us and they were the enemy. While our so-called friends turned on us".
You handled well the conundrum of Spanish and Italian claims on French colonies. Spain and Italy didn't get EVERYTHING they want but are clear winners so good compromise.
Losing Morocco, Tunisia and Djibouti is bad but not terrible (Djibouti they can't defend it anyway). While Mauritania can be settled in a gentleman's deal.
And Belgian Congo, economically, is worth more than those three colonies COMBINED
Japan needed more the bases than Indochina herself so win-win there too.
Wallonia for Oran is a nice gesture too.
Oh and France can use what happened for anti-British propaganda in the US. "Look at how they stabbed us in the back".
Even the US anti-German people can't deny France is well within her rights to declare war.
Oh and in Britain, Churchill's position may get shaky.
For now, MPs will appreciate how he was willing to do the right thing to protect Britain, even if ethically wrong.
But soon, when they will have to fight the full might of the French (plus other Axis members) througout their African colonies (while protecting Near / Middle East) it will look like a MASSIVE miscalculation. And unethical miscalculation.
It probably won't be enough to oust Churchill, but it may shatter the unity in Parliament and hurt morale...
Excellent! I thought having Germany pull out of France and creating a buffer (no fly zone) against the UK would have been enough. This is an excellent turn around. The citizens of the UK have to be shocked at this turn of events. Wagner has outwitted the normally politically astute English at every turn and this will gain him immense political prestige both internally and world wide. It would be interesting to hear a "man on the street" interview in London about now!
This really puts the screws to Churchill as his all or nothing approach has cost England dearly in this situation. While I understand his concern about the French fleet I (personally) never thought the attack at Mers El Kebir was justified, at least not at that point in time. Again Churchill made these types of decisions, if they work out it's great, but if not it could end up costing the UK the war...
Thank you both! Indeed, the international implications are very favorable for Germany and the Axis, particularly with the way it plays in the US, where the contrast between the British attack and the generous peace deal is clear. And as you point out, it does help heighten creeping doubts the British public may be feeling about the continuation of the war.
In my opinion, I think Wagner should have been more generous with his own allies in the new peace with France after British backstabbing in Mers El Kebir. Mussolini has given much in recent years to not spoil the German diplomacy to open conflict in the Balkans. In this situation, with a defeated France, he had not given way to obtain immediately Nice (with Monaco included), Savoy and Corsica regions -after all, Fascist Italy was still a monarchy under the House of Savoy and one of the fathers of Italian unification (Garibaldi) was born in Nice-. And because of these Mussolini claims, Franco would use them to request Roussillon, Andorra and the French Basque Country. All this would be a price considered minor for Petain himself if he thought France would receive a very harsh peace as the received by Germany in 1919 -for example, the loss of Ardennes, Nord and Pas de Calais departments, plus the all of pre-2016 region of Lorraine-, plus of the fact of not immediately touch the status of all Algeria, the jewel of the French empire.
PS: Indeed, in the German annexation of Alsace-Lorraine, could it include the French department of Meurthe-et-Moselle? I asked because I think Bismarck always regreted not having included Briey -or other territory of that zone; I'm not entirely sure- due to the subsequent discovery of its minerals, after Franco-Prussian War.
And as for future status of Oran, I think there is a misprint because it puts city rather than region.
Monaco is going to Italy. Regarding the rest Mussolini wanted, do you think Wagner could have persuaded him to forgo them in favor of, say, greater support for Italian expansion in the Balkans? Regarding Spanish claims, would Spain receiving Roussillon and Andorra be a reasonable settlement?
Meurthe-et-Moselle is not included with Alsace-Lorraine. Undoubtedly, the minerals are something the Germans would like to have, but given that the French have agreed to cooperate economically with the rest of the Axis alliance and war effort, forgoing direct control is not too large a sacrifice.
You're right about Oran, that was a typo on my part and the update has been edited accordingly.
So will Walter Kohler ITTL be Wagner's Albert Speer or will he work with Speer?
An interesting question! In OTL, Kohler was essentially Wagner's Speer. However, in TTL Wagner has been working quite well with Todt (whose fatal crash has been butterflied) and Speer. So it'll be more the latter, Kohler assisting Speer with the highly important task of integrating the other economies of the European mainland, and especially the manufacturing of western Europe, with the German war effort.
A generous peace to France means the Axis will take their pound of flesh from the British. Considering they have lots of colonies I can see Britain ending the war with only the White Dominions on their side and loosing everything else.
Unless Wagner actually invades GB, there is no way he can force UK to relinquish areas like Jamaica or Nigeria. A lot of British territory is simply too far away logistically for Axis to ever reach. Worst case scenario, UK loses Pacific and Middle Eastern possessions, including India.
While I can't at the moment reveal exactly what is going to happen to which parts of the British Empire because of spoilers, there is little doubt the UK is going to be losing quite a bit in the relatively near future.
