Utter Byzantine Victory at Manzikert

Suppose that instead of a humiliating defeat and the capture of the Byzantine Emperor at Manzikert in 1074, there was a complete and total victory over the Seljuks, that the Byzantines managed to capture Alp Arslan and to up the ante slightly more, that the follow up campaigns for at least the next few years were successful in, at the very minimum, keeping out any other Turkic attempts at seizing Anatolia?

Would such a decisive victory, followed up well have been enough, perhaps to maintain the strength of the Empire in the long term? I'm interested in establishing an AH, where Byzantium not only survives, but flourishes into at least the early twentieth century, and perhaps, to the 'present day', and this seems like a good place to start.
 
I think for even major historical events like Manzikert about a century or two is the limit of their influence. Even with a victory at Manzikert the Byzantines would still have to contend with; the Mongols/Timur, black death, Renaissance, printing, reformation, military revoltion of the 1500s, rise of Atlantic Europe, discovery of the new world/route to Asia, merchantilism, absolutism in Europe, French/American/other revolution in Europe, the agricultural revolution, european global imperialism, industrial revolution, formation of Germany etc, nationalism, firepower revolution of 1890-1910, total war, decolonisation, nuclear weapons, globalisation, revolution in military affairs, information age/post-industrial society. Any couple of these could knock the empire out of exsistence sometime between 1071 and now.
 
I think for even major historical events like Manzikert about a century or two is the limit of their influence. Even with a victory at Manzikert the Byzantines would still have to contend with; the Mongols/Timur, black death, Renaissance, printing, reformation, military revoltion of the 1500s, rise of Atlantic Europe, discovery of the new world/route to Asia, merchantilism, absolutism in Europe, French/American/other revolution in Europe, the agricultural revolution, european global imperialism, industrial revolution, formation of Germany etc, nationalism, firepower revolution of 1890-1910, total war, decolonisation, nuclear weapons, globalisation, revolution in military affairs, information age/post-industrial society. Any couple of these could knock the empire out of exsistence sometime between 1071 and now.

Fair enough, but it's certainly a start for a Byzantine survival timeline, I think. I think the next huge challenge may be surviving the Mongol depredations- if they manage to do THAT, then there's a chance they might end up as the Ottoman Empire analogue of an alternate timeline. They're located in the same area, and even more beneficially, most of the surrounding area (in Europe) practices the same Orthodox Christian faith.
 
Schism still occurs so Byzantine Empire has to contend the hostility of Pope and Western Europe...

It already had occurred before that, and for the most part, the hostility of the Pope and Western Europe was relatively passive. The 1204 episode would be quite impossible with a strong empire. It's worth noting also that before the disaster of Manzikert, Byzantium was almost certainly the strongest Christian state.
 
It already had occurred before that, and for the most part, the hostility of the Pope and Western Europe was relatively passive. The 1204 episode would be quite impossible with a strong empire. It's worth noting also that before the disaster of Manzikert, Byzantium was almost certainly the strongest Christian state.

Dont forget that 4th Crusade was about money and Pope's desire to make "schismatic" Greeks submit to the Apostolic Throne...
All u need is an ambitious Pope and some greedy Lords...
 
Manzikert.

I don't recall all of the details, but the main problem for the Byzantines at that time was the decline of the theme system. I don't think that a victory at Manzikert would have mattered that much in the long run, unless the theme system could be extensively reformed.
 
I'm interested in establishing an AH, where Byzantium not only survives, but flourishes into at least the early twentieth century, and perhaps, to the 'present day', and this seems like a good place to start.

I'm already doing one, with a POD 12 years before Manzikert, so if you need any help I would be happy to oblige...
The link to my timeline is on my sig, if you're interested...
apologies for the shameless piece of self advertisement! :D
 
I don't recall all of the details, but the main problem for the Byzantines at that time was the decline of the theme system. I don't think that a victory at Manzikert would have mattered that much in the long run, unless the theme system could be extensively reformed.

I knew the decline of the themes was a major problem facing the Empire. Most likely, I'll have to integrate a series of reforms. The end goal is to make the Empire not only viable, but, in the end, a truly major power in Europe and the Middle East. My rough thought is that the Byzantines will enjoy good times for another century, and then have a particularly rough 13th century, and of course, as we all know, Europe in general had a tough 14th and 15th centuries- but Byzantium manages to hold on to its core territories. And then, in the late 15th and 16th centuries, perhaps, reemerges as the most powerful Christian state once again, retaking lost territories and expanding beyond their old borders.

I'm already doing one, with a POD 12 years before Manzikert, so if you need any help I would be happy to oblige...
The link to my timeline is on my sig, if you're interested...
apologies for the shameless piece of self advertisement! :D

No problems at all! I'll definitely take a look. Byzantium is an interest of mine, but it's hardly my main area of expertise, so to speak.
 
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Suppose that instead of a humiliating defeat and the capture of the Byzantine Emperor at Manzikert in 1074, there was a complete and total victory over the Seljuks, that the Byzantines managed to capture Alp Arslan and to up the ante slightly more, that the follow up campaigns for at least the next few years were successful in, at the very minimum, keeping out any other Turkic attempts at seizing Anatolia?

Would such a decisive victory, followed up well have been enough, perhaps to maintain the strength of the Empire in the long term? I'm interested in establishing an AH, where Byzantium not only survives, but flourishes into at least the early twentieth century, and perhaps, to the 'present day', and this seems like a good place to start.
 
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