university constituencies

with a POD no earlier than 1935 make all universities in the UK have a consituency which delivers MPs to the house of commons
 
with a POD no earlier than 1935 make all universities in the UK have a consituency which delivers MPs to the house of commons

It was Labour after 1945 which abolished university constituencies I believe?

Also (correct me if I'm wrong), I am aware that it was not until the Wilson era in the 60's that university students and academics became seen as an overwhelmingly left-leaning group?

A POD be to have universities seen as overwhelming left-wing (and not just a few socialists as in OTL but as a description of the general students population) earlier and Labour may not be willing to so readily abolish these.
 
Maybe transfer these university constituencies to the Lords in a manner akin to the bishoprics which are represented there. Not quite the same as the original scenario asked for, but at least they're still in Parliament.

Then have them transfered back to the House at some future date in some reform to the Lords
 
It was Labour after 1945 which abolished university constituencies I believe?

Also (correct me if I'm wrong), I am aware that it was not until the Wilson era in the 60's that university students and academics became seen as an overwhelmingly left-leaning group?

A POD be to have universities seen as overwhelming left-wing (and not just a few socialists as in OTL but as a description of the general students population) earlier and Labour may not be willing to so readily abolish these.
labour abolished university consituencies
 
It should also be noted that the electorate for University seats was (and in the Irish Senate still is) graduates not students.
 
It was Labour after 1945 which abolished university constituencies I believe?

Yep.

Also (correct me if I'm wrong), I am aware that it was not until the Wilson era in the 60's that university students and academics became seen as an overwhelmingly left-leaning group?

Kinda. Univiersity constituencies were already returning pretty independent minded types in the immediate years before they were abolished. (This lady who some of you may have heard of, was a university constituency MP) I think even before that, the members from them had a spirit of independence. Indeed, that's often been suggested as being one of the reasons why they were abolished. (Although they were undoubtedly a pretty undemocratic concept - please remember how insignificant the number of university graudates as a percentage of the population was in this period) So even if Labour hadn't abolished them, then the Tories probably would have at some point.

I think the only way you could make this work is if Britain went ultra-corporatist. Otherwise it's probably ASB.
 
Yep.



Kinda. Univiersity constituencies were already returning pretty independent minded types in the immediate years before they were abolished. (This lady who some of you may have heard of, was a university constituency MP) I think even before that, the members from them had a spirit of independence. Indeed, that's often been suggested as being one of the reasons why they were abolished. (Although they were undoubtedly a pretty undemocratic concept - please remember how insignificant the number of university graudates as a percentage of the population was in this period) So even if Labour hadn't abolished them, then the Tories probably would have at some point.

I think the only way you could make this work is if Britain went ultra-corporatist. Otherwise it's probably ASB.

When you say corporatist I assume you mean the UK becoming a system where there is a sort of institutionalised representation by interest groups rather than individualistic pluralism?
 
Ay-yup.

I mean a system in which it would be normal for professional bodies, industry and similar institutions to be a part of government/representation. University constituencies would fit in well in that kind of approach. We've never really had it full-on in the UK.
 
The average university has 5-10,000 students, the average constituency 70,000 electors, having 80 university constituencies would not just be an anomaly but a massive, ASB level, distortion.

However, that is only if it were a constituency per university - they could be clustered together. This would certainly be strange, but if the old multi-member constituenciess had survived, not unimaginable.

Possibly if the Conservatives has heeded Churchill's call to think more creatively about the electoral system (he advocated PR in cities for example) this could have happened.
 
The average university has 5-10,000 students, the average constituency 70,000 electors, having 80 university constituencies would not just be an anomaly but a massive, ASB level, distortion.

In all fairness, (IIRC) pre-abolition, the universities in England (save for Oxford and Cambridge) were combined as one 'seat'. I think there was only about six or seven seats in total at the time they were abolished.

Edit: Sorry, I didn't realise you were replying to the OP. Yes, that is ASB.
 
Ay-yup.

I mean a system in which it would be normal for professional bodies, industry and similar institutions to be a part of government/representation. University constituencies would fit in well in that kind of approach. We've never really had it full-on in the UK.

Actually I've been thinking about doing a thread similar to this about whether the UK could have developed into a corporatist nation in the 1970's and onwards. Some say that it goes against Anglophone political culture, but Aust was pretty successful with its Accord in the 1980's.

I know that this reply is off-topic.
 
Actually I've been thinking about doing a thread similar to this about whether the UK could have developed into a corporatist nation in the 1970's and onwards.

The 1970's is probably the very worst time you could pick as your POD; a lot of what was being discredited at that time was seen as being vaguely corporatist in nature. (Principally the 'beer and sandwiches' approach to the Trades Unions) Although if Labour somehow miraculously wings it, you could get some kind of corporatist structure. Unlikely though I think.

I think if you're going to do a corporatist UK, then you ideally need a POD which is pre-war. (EdT did a convincingly corporatist Britain under Mosley in 'a Greater Britain'.)
 
Last edited:
Also (correct me if I'm wrong), I am aware that it was not until the Wilson era in the 60's that university students and academics became seen as an overwhelmingly left-leaning group?
se.

Interesting.
This was also the time during which a lot of new universities were formed...Prior to that we mostly just had oxbridge and the red bricks- usually quite notoriously right wing.
But then admissions for commoners to every university also became easier at this time too.
 

67th Tigers

Banned
In all fairness, (IIRC) pre-abolition, the universities in England (save for Oxford and Cambridge) were combined as one 'seat'. I think there was only about six or seven seats in total at the time they were abolished.

Edit: Sorry, I didn't realise you were replying to the OP. Yes, that is ASB.

At the time the seats were abolished (1950), the UK had the following:

Oxford (2 seats)
Cambridge (2)
London (1)
Queen's, Belfast (1) - not abolished until 1969
Combined English (2) - (Birmingham, Bristol, Durham, Leeds, Liverpool, Manchester, Reading and Sheffield*)
Combined Scottish (3) - (Edinburgh, St Andrews, Aberdeen and Glasgow)
Wales (1)

Total = 12

* Interestingly, the three of these were former constituent colleges of Victoria University
 
Note that in general elections the University seats with multple seats had STV PR. Note also that Queens University was represented in the Northern Ireland Parliament (with 4 out of 52 seats in their House of Commons). Queens University lost its seats in the UK Parliament at the same time as other Universities- the election of 1950
 
The 1970's is probably the very worst time you could pick as your POD; a lot of what was being discredited at that time was seen as being vaguely corporatist in nature. (Principally the 'beer and sandwiches' approach to the Trades Unions) Although if Labour somehow miraculously wings it, you could get some kind of corporatist structure. Unlikely though I think.

I think if you're going to do a corporatist UK, then you ideally need a POD which is pre-war. (EdT did a convincingly corporatist Britain under Mosley in 'a Greater Britain'.)

Would have to agree with you. I assume you would need a POD before the trade unions become overly militant. Corporatist structures in liberal democracies are usually established by left-of-centre parties, so perhaps Labour is elected in 59 and Gaitskell puts something corporatist in place (I assume it would be easier under a right-wing Labour leader).

Could MacMillian from the Tories have introduced such a system?

Ted Heath in the 1970's did offer a deal in his 1972 Industrial Relations legislation, that offered union bosses the ability to discipline militant shop stewards in return for more moderate pay claims (the union bosses didn't go along with this. Perhaps if the union elite supported this it could occur.
 
Top