United Italy in the Middle Ages

When was the earliest possible chance for the unification of the Italian peninsula after the fall of Rome? There were few times in the Middle Ages when various rulers, be it Lombards of Franks controlled (most of) it, but the area soon fragmented into various city states, republics and duchies.

Was there a possibility for a real, united and independent Italian kingdom in the Early Medieval Era and later?

If so, how it would affect the development of Italy? In OTL, competition among various states made it prosperous. With a unified kingdom, many cities that were prominent in OTL would surely develop differently.

I have virtually no knowledge of Italian history, so are there any takers?
 
Was it not united already under Odoacer, and after him still united under the Ostrogoths?

They didn't really withstand the shocks of Belisarius' campaign and the Lombard invasions. Once the cohesiveness of Italy was lost, the rivalry between Pope and Holy Roman Emperor, neither of whom could tolerate the other controlling Italy but both of whom wanted said control, prevented any other power base from emerging to unite the peninsula and certainly prevented their rival from uniting it.

Perhaps the Hohenstaufens never become contenders for the HRE's throne or lose it down the road and focus on consolidating the Kingdom of Sicily, managing to ally with the early Communes to occupy most of the Peninsula?
 
this is a late medieval POD. but if their was a personal union between Milan and Naples i could see them having a shot. as they are the two most powerful states in their respective area with Naples having complete domination of the south while the Milan holds a strong position in the north however, i will see Naples needing to help Milan out with so many rivals in the north whats your guys thoughts.
 

Albert.Nik

Banned
A few possible timelines.
* Western Rome doesn't fall and reunites with the East as it begins to decline.
* Visigothic/Ostrogothic empire made stronger that they don't simply collapse but rather unleash a new age of antiquity but Germanic instead of Latin/Greek era conquering NA,Italy and Iberia and incorporating these strongly.
* Celts establish a strong empire in the Mainland Europe after the WRE weakens and falls. Former Roman Empire becomes Celtic empire and spans over Eastern Anatolia,Levant,NA and Italy/Spain.
* Byzantines successfully reconquer, incorporate and settle it.
* A different West/North/Northwest Germanic people invade and settle it,again creating a new antiquity and annex North Africa and the Middle East eventually,too.
* A remotely possible strong Basque Empire.
 
They didn't really withstand the shocks of Belisarius' campaign and the Lombard invasions. Once the cohesiveness of Italy was lost, the rivalry between Pope and Holy Roman Emperor, neither of whom could tolerate the other controlling Italy but both of whom wanted said control, prevented any other power base from emerging to unite the peninsula and certainly prevented their rival from uniting it.

Perhaps the Hohenstaufens never become contenders for the HRE's throne or lose it down the road and focus on consolidating the Kingdom of Sicily, managing to ally with the early Communes to occupy most of the Peninsula?

What about a more disastrous collapse of the Carolingian Empire that permits an independent Kingdom of Italy to arise?
 
How early is too early after the fall of Rome for the OP? Keeping a Byzantine Italy together or having a Norman unite the peninsula don't seem to be quite what was intended even if both are plausible.
 
So, the 10th Century Popes to go aconquering?

I mean, it’s a difficult concept given the dysfunctionality of the Papacy at that point but it seems at least slightly possible?

Maybe some mercenary does it in the name of the Pope and sets up an independent in all but name Kingdom of Sicily? Then a few decades down the line his family dies out and the Pope decides to push his claim for real?
 
How early is too early after the fall of Rome for the OP? Keeping a Byzantine Italy together or having a Norman unite the peninsula don't seem to be quite what was intended even if both are plausible.

I mean, I had mostly post-Charlemagne POD in mind, but I guess this is possible, too. I'm more interested in how it would change the development of Italian cities (and Italy as a whole) though.
 
What about a more disastrous collapse of the Carolingian Empire that permits an independent Kingdom of Italy to arise?

It happened between the 9th and the 10th century. Then happened the Ottonian reconquest and an union which lasted for six centuries between Germany and North Italy.

Anyway about my possible scenaries:

  • Berengario d'Ivrea being a more able commander and above all not using Ungar mercenaries and avoid stupid revenges like Pavia, building a more stable kingdom.
  • A more hard rupture between Papacy and Empire during the investiture controversy bringing Mathilde of Canossa to lead an Italian revolt.
  • Frederick II never becoming emperor, but only king of Italy and his successors retaining the crown so leading towards the progressive merging of Italy and Sicily, so Svevian-Norman lead unification.
  • After Legnano, the Lombard League electing of their own a King of Italy, but who?
 
It happened between the 9th and the 10th century. Then happened the Ottonian reconquest and an union which lasted for six centuries between Germany and North Italy.

Anyway about my possible scenaries:

  • Berengario d'Ivrea being a more able commander and above all not using Ungar mercenaries and avoid stupid revenges like Pavia, building a more stable kingdom.
  • A more hard rupture between Papacy and Empire during the investiture controversy bringing Mathilde of Canossa to lead an Italian revolt.
  • Frederick II never becoming emperor, but only king of Italy and his successors retaining the crown so leading towards the progressive merging of Italy and Sicily, so Svevian-Norman lead unification.
  • After Legnano, the Lombard League electing of their own a King of Italy, but who?
These are all very interesting scenarios. Of all, I would favor the third one: Hoenstaufen Italy could make wonders.
 
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