Union of Sweden and Norway: Never ends

Oweno

Banned
What if Norway had not broken off from the Union in 1905. I think eventually they will swallow up Finland from Russia. And when the Nazis are about to roll into Denmark Scandanavian Union rolls in. Takes control of Iceland and Greenland. Scandanavian Superpower
 
What if Norway had not broken off from the Union in 1905. I think eventually they will swallow up Finland from Russia. And when the Nazis are about to roll into Denmark Scandanavian Union rolls in. Takes control of Iceland and Greenland. Scandanavian Superpower
Unlikely, but you could have pushed the end of the Union forward, and, mayhap, made it survive. It wouldn't mean much, though, just that two states would be in personal union, and have an unusual amount of bilateral agreements, or maybe some kind of lesser EU for Sweden and Norway only.
Absorbing Finland is unlikely, though (Sweden didn't really want it back anymore, they just wanted it independent from Russia).
But, really, the Union was, by 1900, more or less destined to either end, or become just a personal union.
 
Swedish attack on Finland would be extremely unlikely.
And if it would have happened, it would most certainly have failed, or led to a Soviet Finland and perhaps Sweden.
 
It never was anything more than a pesonal union :p:)
Ah, no. There was that foreign policy thing, too (plus some laws about trade and such that could equally well have been in place without a personal union). That's what the Union in the end broke on, after all.
 
What if Norway had not broken off from the Union in 1905. I think eventually they will swallow up Finland from Russia. And when the Nazis are about to roll into Denmark Scandanavian Union rolls in. Takes control of Iceland and Greenland. Scandanavian Superpower

Even united, all the scandinavian nations would not be superpowers;)

The populace isn't willing to do any military commitment. If f.x. Iceland wanted independence it would just get it after a referendum, like OTL. Besides Iceland was only in a personal union with Denmark from 1918 so they didn't need Denmark for anything.
 

Oddball

Monthly Donor
Ah, no. There was that foreign policy thing, too (plus some laws about trade and such that could equally well have been in place without a personal union). That's what the Union in the end broke on, after all.

You are both right and wrong. :)

Foreign policy rested with the king. In theory it still does according to the Norwegian constitution.

The Union broke when the parliament sought to take away the kings de facto control of it and make it just de jure (like it is today).
 
First i have to say that i don't know all the details of the Swedish Norwegian breakup.


What would happen if Sweden goes to war to keep Norway in the Union, for example would we have some sort of foreign influence like Russia supporting a free Norway.
 
It never was anything more than a pesonal union :p:)

In your oppinion, is there plausible way the personal union could have continued? And, over time, have grown into a sort of Scandinavian/Nordic Union (or something along those lines) together with Denmark and Iceland, and possibly even Finland? Maybe a nordic repsons to the European Coal and Steel Community (ECSC)?
 
What if Norway had not broken off from the Union in 1905. I think eventually they will swallow up Finland from Russia. And when the Nazis are about to roll into Denmark Scandanavian Union rolls in. Takes control of Iceland and Greenland. Scandanavian Superpower

The USA will still take over Iceland and Greenland before the Germans get there. The British fleet would seal off the North Sea, and the USN lands forces before the Wehrmacht could do anything.
 

Oddball

Monthly Donor
First i have to say that i don't know all the details of the Swedish Norwegian breakup.


What would happen if Sweden goes to war to keep Norway in the Union, for example would we have some sort of foreign influence like Russia supporting a free Norway.

OTL, in 1905 Britain supported Norway while Germany supported Sweden in the initial phase. Wether they would have done so if it had come down to actual war is OTOH hard to say. IMHO Britain might have, Germany Im more unsure about.
 

Oddball

Monthly Donor
In your oppinion, is there plausible way the personal union could have continued? And, over time, have grown into a sort of Scandinavian/Nordic Union (or something along those lines) together with Denmark and Iceland, and possibly even Finland? Maybe a nordic repsons to the European Coal and Steel Community (ECSC)?

Hard to say. If the Swedes had been less ignorant to Norways interrests perhaps. IMHO the hard feelings from 1814 had to some degree lessened when 1860 came around, and the Union came under real pressure again.

The problem was the giant difference in the two nation's commercial interests and their natural "continental" partners (GB/Germany).
 
I suspect there would be a considerable drive for a breakup today, if the union had continued.

Norway felt like a separate nation to the Norwegians in 1905, and I suspect this would have continued. The fact that North Sea oil money would likly have gone to central parts of Sweden would not have been well recieved.

On the other hand, after the North Sea oil got going, I can see Sweden digging in more about keeping Norway.

I think a better chance for a Nordic union would be a slightly different WWII.
 
Heh, I'm actually making a TL with a sort-off EU for the Nordic Countries.
The POD, incidentally, is an earlier (peaceful) dissolution of the Union.
 
That sounds interesting - any posts here of that?
Ah, not exactly. I mentioned it in the A Time of Empire thread, but only be name, and I, uhm, mentioned an aspect of it to Abdul Hadi Pasha to cheer him up back in September, but that's about as far that goes. Actually, this is the first time I've actually mentioned the POD for Nordanvinden Blåser (temporary name until I find out what Nordanvinden is in English, as Zephyr is Västanvinden).
 

Oddball

Monthly Donor
I suspect there would be a considerable drive for a breakup today, if the union had continued.

Yes indeed. The POD would have to be a lot earlier than 1905.

The fact that North Sea oil money would likly have gone to central parts of Sweden would not have been well recieved.

According to that analogy, Western Norway should seek independence from the "central" parts of Norway... :cool::D

I think a better chance for a Nordic union would be a slightly different WWII.

Or interwar periode
 
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