Union and Liberty: An American TL
- Thread starter wilcoxchar
- Start date
Awesome and very interesting developments. However, wasn't Sonora part of California at this point? You could easily have it with the Mexican Peasant's Republic approaching Durango Zacatecas / San Luis (don't remember which name you used for that one).
Still awesome to have the TL back!!! And Keep it up! We missed this!!!!
Developments in California
You mentioned in passing the capture of Monterrey, which is I believe the TTL Capital of California, by America. I believe this may bode ill for the Golden, ahem, Country (?
) in negotiations...
You mentioned in passing the capture of Monterrey, which is I believe the TTL Capital of California, by America. I believe this may bode ill for the Golden, ahem, Country (?
) in negotiations...Thanks!
Sun Yat-Sen is HAWAIIAN?
Dear GOd!
Interesting development in Hawaii!
Yeah. Sun Yat-Sen's life in Hawaii is one of those weird things about OTL that pop up from time to time. When I heard about it, I knew I wanted to do something with it.
I'll do a world map once the Great War is officially over, which will most likely be after the next update.
I'm pretty sure Sonora is part of California. Or did they declare indepence during the War?
Otherwise I'm liking the diversity of this update, but cannot really say anything specific with the amount of knowledge I have about these regions.
Maybe just: Keep 'em comin'!
As of late 1911? Nope, Sonora's not part of California anymore.
Zapata is approaching Zacatecas as well, and possibly Rio Bravo since they're eager to get Tampico back from Granidalgo.California is definitely in trouble.You mentioned in passing the capture of Monterrey, which is I believe the TTL Capital of California, by America. I believe this may bode ill for the Golden, ahem, Country (?
I'll go into its fate after the Great War next update.As of late 1911? Nope, Sonora's not part of California anymore.
California is definitely in trouble.
I fear for California's future....
Alaska is still Russian ITTL - and furthermore, includes most of the Yukon. My best guess would be the remaining British areas west of the Rockies, and perhaps also Manitoba and the parts of the Northwest Territories located to its west.
What a dramatic ending to the war!
On another note, how are relations between the two main Mormon groups in Espejo and Deseret (Manitoba)?
Good question.
Btw, TR hasn't had one of his adventures posted recently. I'd think he was pretty busy adventuring what with the Great War on American soil and all...
Part One Hundred-Thirty: Vienna, City of Peace
Part One Hundred-Thirty: Vienna, City of Peace
The Peace of Vienna:
Once the guns of war fell silent on September 27, 1911, the lengthy peace process began. Though France, Germany, and the United States emerged the clear victors in the war, the great powers of the New Coalition, Great Britain and Russia, were not entirely defeated and still had a leg to stand on in terms of negotiating power. The peace process was held in the German city of Vienna, symbolic of the city's long history as a diplomatic center of Europe and of the Congress held there a century before to end the First Napoleonic Wars. The parallels between the Peace of Vienna and the Concert of Europe were not lost on many of the newspapers of the time. Le Moniteur[1], the largest Parisian paper of the time, was the first to call the peace conference the Vienna Concerto No. 2, and the headline was soon repeated in other major papers including the New York Tribune and the Saint Louis Post-Dispatch.
The full peace process in Vienna lasted from October into late December. The American delegation was headed by President Theodore Roosevelt himself. The President was boisterous about being part of the negotiations, and marked the first official state visit by a sitting president to Europe. The American delegation also included Herbert Hoover, who had become close to Roosevelt for his relief activities in Europe and the Canadian border states during the war, and Oliver Wendell Holmes, an authority on admiralty law. The French and German delegations were headed by Joseph Caillaux and Friedrich Naumann. Prior to the beginning of negotiations, the French and German delegations had secretly contacted each other to discuss territorial demands. Naumann and the German delegation were to primarily demand land from the Russian Empire, while France would seek concessions in the Mediterranean and Atlantic. This was largely in line with the general foreign policy espoused by Naumann with a shift toward the east and German expansion in Slavic lands through annexation or carving satellite states.
During the peace conference, the five major players in the Alliance Carolingien were the United States, France, Germany, Corea, and South Africa. However, Korea and South Africa played little role for much of the negotiations. South Africa's participation mostly consisted of affirming its treaty arrangement with Germany to divide the Portuguese colony of Mozambique between the two. Corea, while it had French support, sought further territorial gains in East Asia and the Pacific. The Russians and British, who were the only Coalition members allowed a full presence in the negotiations, prevented Corea from even receiving Tsushima. Corea did succeed in securing a size reduction in the Japanese Navy and an exclusive trade concession in the Zhoushan islands.
A large majority of the peace conference's territorial exchange focus was in Europe as Great Britain was still a formidable power and refused many of the original demands to relinquish large parts of its colonial empire. Joseph Caillaux headed a commission to rework the terms of the Treat of Saint-Denis with members of the German and British delegations and the token Spanish and Italian delegations. In the end, a large part of the terms were left unchanged. France relinquished control of Piedmont, Sardinia and the Tuscan coast save a small sector around Pimobino to the Italians. The German delegation gave up control of its Venetian corridor, and of the Trento region. Most of the cession of territory made by the Spanish were kept, although Valencia remained an independent republic after France recognized the city-state. The revisions to the Treaty of Saint-Denis were codified in the Treaty of Schönbrunn, signed at the historic Habsburg palace.
The various commissions in the Peace of Vienna met at various locations around the city and its suburbs, leading to various treaties. The Western European negotiations were held in the Schönbrunn Palace, while the Eastern European negotiations took place in the Hofburg Palace in the city center. Naumann was at the center of the peace process between Germany, Russia, and Hungary, attempting to maximize the Russian loss of territory. A small Polish delegation was also present, invited by Naumann to lend credence to the creation of an independent Poland. Ultimately, German gains in the east fell far short of the Mitteleuropa envisioned by Naumann before and during the war. With the Hofburg Treaty, the eastern border of Germany was extended to much of what Prussia had gained from the partitions of Poland in the 1700s, but was not granted to its fullest extent. An independent Kingdom of Poland was carved out of the remainder of Congress Poland and Galizien. The restored Polish kingdom was set up as a constitutional monarchy similar to Germany's governing structure. Jozef Korzeniowski was appointed the country's first chancellor as a continuation from the temporary Polish government, and the elderly Prince Karol von Hohenzollern-Sigmaringen[2] became King Karol I of Poland on January 1, 1912. To appease the Zionists and some of the right wing politicians, the Reichstag enacted the Bodenheimer proposal for a Jewish autonomous province in the Polish territories. The resulting German province of Judenland consisted of the northern third of the former Kalisz Voivodeship and had its capital in the city of Kolo, a longtime Jewish center in Poland.
During the three months of the Peace of Vienna, President Roosevelt was actively involved in the peace process, primarily in the discussions on the treaties with California and regarding British possessions in North America. Roosevelt saw the opportunity of the first American state visit to Europe as a display of American power, and treated the journey from Brest to Vienna as a grand tour to present himself to the French and German people. He was also very boisterous during the discussions, which pleased his aides and other members of the delegation but occasionally displeased the delegates from other nations. The North American commission began with some of the less contentious parts of the negotiations; trade and naval matters. President Roosevelt affirmed the international status of the San Juan Canal, which was due to open in 1912, with profits from fees set by the Joint Commission on the San Juan Canal Zone[3] being divided between the American and Costa Rican governments for maintenance of the canal. Roosevelt and Oliver Wendell Holmes led the negotiations for the Maritime Convention on the Caribbean, which established the Caribbean Sea barring coastal economic zones as international waters.
While President Roosevelt was engaged in the smaller discussions of the Peace of Vienna, his true aim with his presence at the conference was to gain international acceptance for the enlargement of American territory and the dominance of the United States over the North American continent. To this end, Roosevelt focused havily on promoting American gains in California. Roosevelt's seeming obsession with the full annexation of California, which even France was reluctant to assent to, cost the United States in other possible areas of expansion, such as in British North America. Throughout the peace process, the President pushed for annexation, and when it was finally established as an agreed article in the Treaty of Schwarzenberg[4], Roosevelt took it as a personal triumph. The annexation did come with conditions, including that the United States would take on all of California's debts, which totaled over $600 million. Besides California, the American delegation concentrated its efforts on securing American dominance of the Caribbean and diminishing British possessions in the region. The Treaty of Schwarzenberg ceded the Bahamas and Turks and Caicos islands to the United States, and arranged the sale of British Honduras to Mesoamerica. While Roosevelt pushed for American annexation or independence for Jamaica as well, the British delegation refused to part with it. Britain was more willing to cede the Bahamas and British Honduras as they had been struggling economically for decades, but Jamaica had become profitable once again, and looked to become more so now with the shedding of two colonies under its administration. Additionally, while agreements between Wilfred Laurier and Roosevelt during the war had made the Laurentian region an afterthought for American gains, minor border adjustments with Canada were made and Deseret and Acadia received full independence.
The Weltkongress:
With the revival of the Concert system of diplomacy during the closing stages of the Great War, many influential figures in foreign policy, especially among the victorious powers, brought up the idea of a continuous Congress system to follow the Peace of Vienna. The creation of the Weltkongress was spearheaded by German and French ministers. Herbert von Bismarck, Foreign Minister and Otto von Bismarck's eldest son, and King Ernest August II of Hanover[5] led the German efforts, while Maurice Rouvier, echoing Frédéric Passy's previous calls for a permanent international conference before his death, was the main French proponent along with Caillaux. Rouvier, Bismarck, and the Hanoverian king had held frequent discussions during the war to set up a Committee for Global Peace, and had already drawn up proposals for a global assembly of nations, which would arbitrate disputes between nations. These first drafts included the creation of an international court within the congress framework for general disputes, as well as special commission to hear trade and tariff disputes between nations.
However, the Hanover Committee proposals for trade and international courts being handled within the assembly were opposed by British and American representatives once the discussion of a permanent World Congress began to take shape in 1912. The British were loudly opposed to what they thought of as efforts to secure the Franco-German dominance of European and world affairs and walked out of the discussion in February. The American delegation was more hopeful for negotiations but had some reservations. President Roosevelt, supportive of the idea of a World Congress, had returned to the United States at the new year to oversee the new Congressional session and in preparation for the 1912 election campaign. In his stead, he sent Vice President Taft, one of the Roosevelt cabinet's major proponents of the World Congress[6], and presidential adviser Elihu Root to Vienna. The United States opposed the idea of an international trade court, claiming that European intervention in American bilateral trade relations with other nations would be a violation of the Monroe Doctrine. Additionally, the United States opposed having other members' delegates be the arbitrators in court decisions, instead desiring panels of independent judges appointed by the Weltkongress, and opposed a proposal that members had an obligation to protect each other if attacked.
Although the Peace of Vienna was generally concluded by the end of 1911, the formation of the Weltkongress was almost continuous with the peace negotiations in the early months of 1912. The Charter of the Weltkongress was finally completed in March of 1920, with the first informal meeting of the signatory nations taking place in Vienna the next month. Due to the objections raised by the United States' delegation, the trade court idea was dropped and the International Court was separated from the Weltkongress itself, instead taking the form of the International Court of Arbitration in Brussels with panels of judges to hear the cases sent to it by the Weltkongress. The signatory nations to the Weltkongress Charter included the victorious Alliance members and most neutral nations in Europe, most Ibero-American nations, Persia, China, Corea, and Japan. The United States attended the first meeting of the Weltkongress, but as Congress had not yet ratified the Charter it was not yet officially a member state.
The first meetings of the Weltknogress were held in the Schönbrunn Palace in Vienna, and elected international lawyer Charles Albert Gobat of Switzerland as the organization's first Secretary General. The official languages of the Weltknogress at the time of the founding charter's passage were French, German, English, and Spanish. While Great Britain and Russia were notable exceptions during the founding of the Weltkongress, Russia became a member in 1915. The Weltkongress held scheduled meetings of the assembly twice a year, with special sessions for emergency events. Soon after the Weltknogress was founded, Gobat proposed the construction of a new building with the purpose of housing the Weltkongress. In 1922 in celebration of the tenth anniversary of the Weltkongress, Viennese architect Karl Ehn was commissioned to build a new site for the congress in the Donaustadt district of Vienna on the opposite side of the Danube from the city's historic center. This was intended to create an international diplomatic complex, and to extend the urban center of Vienna across the river. Ehn, an adherent of the Rotes Wien designed the complex not as a sprawling palace, but as an efficient and compact garden city for diplomats, their staff, and any curious members of the public. The Weltkongresshalle is a grand eight story building stretching along the bank of the Danube, lined with a terra cotta stucco facade[7]. Opposite the river from the hall lie a large park and courtyard, which is flanked by more conference halls and diplomatic apartments for the representatives and their families and staff to stay in during sessions.
[1] Le Moniteur Universel was privatized ITTL during Louis-Napoleon's presidency.
[2] OTL Carol I of Romania.
[3] The Joint Commission is an international body primarily made up of representatives from the United States and Costa Rica.
[4] Signed in the Palais Schwarzenberg in eastern Vienna.
[5] With hostilities between Britain and Germany, the Hanoverian line was deprived of its title of Duke of Cumberland and Teviotdale.
[6] Speculation abounded that Roosevelt wanted to keep Taft away from the early stages of the 1912 campaign, but there is little to substantiate these rumors.
[7] Something like the OTL Karl Marx Hof of the Jakob Reumann Hof.
The Peace of Vienna:
Once the guns of war fell silent on September 27, 1911, the lengthy peace process began. Though France, Germany, and the United States emerged the clear victors in the war, the great powers of the New Coalition, Great Britain and Russia, were not entirely defeated and still had a leg to stand on in terms of negotiating power. The peace process was held in the German city of Vienna, symbolic of the city's long history as a diplomatic center of Europe and of the Congress held there a century before to end the First Napoleonic Wars. The parallels between the Peace of Vienna and the Concert of Europe were not lost on many of the newspapers of the time. Le Moniteur[1], the largest Parisian paper of the time, was the first to call the peace conference the Vienna Concerto No. 2, and the headline was soon repeated in other major papers including the New York Tribune and the Saint Louis Post-Dispatch.
The full peace process in Vienna lasted from October into late December. The American delegation was headed by President Theodore Roosevelt himself. The President was boisterous about being part of the negotiations, and marked the first official state visit by a sitting president to Europe. The American delegation also included Herbert Hoover, who had become close to Roosevelt for his relief activities in Europe and the Canadian border states during the war, and Oliver Wendell Holmes, an authority on admiralty law. The French and German delegations were headed by Joseph Caillaux and Friedrich Naumann. Prior to the beginning of negotiations, the French and German delegations had secretly contacted each other to discuss territorial demands. Naumann and the German delegation were to primarily demand land from the Russian Empire, while France would seek concessions in the Mediterranean and Atlantic. This was largely in line with the general foreign policy espoused by Naumann with a shift toward the east and German expansion in Slavic lands through annexation or carving satellite states.
During the peace conference, the five major players in the Alliance Carolingien were the United States, France, Germany, Corea, and South Africa. However, Korea and South Africa played little role for much of the negotiations. South Africa's participation mostly consisted of affirming its treaty arrangement with Germany to divide the Portuguese colony of Mozambique between the two. Corea, while it had French support, sought further territorial gains in East Asia and the Pacific. The Russians and British, who were the only Coalition members allowed a full presence in the negotiations, prevented Corea from even receiving Tsushima. Corea did succeed in securing a size reduction in the Japanese Navy and an exclusive trade concession in the Zhoushan islands.
A large majority of the peace conference's territorial exchange focus was in Europe as Great Britain was still a formidable power and refused many of the original demands to relinquish large parts of its colonial empire. Joseph Caillaux headed a commission to rework the terms of the Treat of Saint-Denis with members of the German and British delegations and the token Spanish and Italian delegations. In the end, a large part of the terms were left unchanged. France relinquished control of Piedmont, Sardinia and the Tuscan coast save a small sector around Pimobino to the Italians. The German delegation gave up control of its Venetian corridor, and of the Trento region. Most of the cession of territory made by the Spanish were kept, although Valencia remained an independent republic after France recognized the city-state. The revisions to the Treaty of Saint-Denis were codified in the Treaty of Schönbrunn, signed at the historic Habsburg palace.
The various commissions in the Peace of Vienna met at various locations around the city and its suburbs, leading to various treaties. The Western European negotiations were held in the Schönbrunn Palace, while the Eastern European negotiations took place in the Hofburg Palace in the city center. Naumann was at the center of the peace process between Germany, Russia, and Hungary, attempting to maximize the Russian loss of territory. A small Polish delegation was also present, invited by Naumann to lend credence to the creation of an independent Poland. Ultimately, German gains in the east fell far short of the Mitteleuropa envisioned by Naumann before and during the war. With the Hofburg Treaty, the eastern border of Germany was extended to much of what Prussia had gained from the partitions of Poland in the 1700s, but was not granted to its fullest extent. An independent Kingdom of Poland was carved out of the remainder of Congress Poland and Galizien. The restored Polish kingdom was set up as a constitutional monarchy similar to Germany's governing structure. Jozef Korzeniowski was appointed the country's first chancellor as a continuation from the temporary Polish government, and the elderly Prince Karol von Hohenzollern-Sigmaringen[2] became King Karol I of Poland on January 1, 1912. To appease the Zionists and some of the right wing politicians, the Reichstag enacted the Bodenheimer proposal for a Jewish autonomous province in the Polish territories. The resulting German province of Judenland consisted of the northern third of the former Kalisz Voivodeship and had its capital in the city of Kolo, a longtime Jewish center in Poland.
During the three months of the Peace of Vienna, President Roosevelt was actively involved in the peace process, primarily in the discussions on the treaties with California and regarding British possessions in North America. Roosevelt saw the opportunity of the first American state visit to Europe as a display of American power, and treated the journey from Brest to Vienna as a grand tour to present himself to the French and German people. He was also very boisterous during the discussions, which pleased his aides and other members of the delegation but occasionally displeased the delegates from other nations. The North American commission began with some of the less contentious parts of the negotiations; trade and naval matters. President Roosevelt affirmed the international status of the San Juan Canal, which was due to open in 1912, with profits from fees set by the Joint Commission on the San Juan Canal Zone[3] being divided between the American and Costa Rican governments for maintenance of the canal. Roosevelt and Oliver Wendell Holmes led the negotiations for the Maritime Convention on the Caribbean, which established the Caribbean Sea barring coastal economic zones as international waters.
While President Roosevelt was engaged in the smaller discussions of the Peace of Vienna, his true aim with his presence at the conference was to gain international acceptance for the enlargement of American territory and the dominance of the United States over the North American continent. To this end, Roosevelt focused havily on promoting American gains in California. Roosevelt's seeming obsession with the full annexation of California, which even France was reluctant to assent to, cost the United States in other possible areas of expansion, such as in British North America. Throughout the peace process, the President pushed for annexation, and when it was finally established as an agreed article in the Treaty of Schwarzenberg[4], Roosevelt took it as a personal triumph. The annexation did come with conditions, including that the United States would take on all of California's debts, which totaled over $600 million. Besides California, the American delegation concentrated its efforts on securing American dominance of the Caribbean and diminishing British possessions in the region. The Treaty of Schwarzenberg ceded the Bahamas and Turks and Caicos islands to the United States, and arranged the sale of British Honduras to Mesoamerica. While Roosevelt pushed for American annexation or independence for Jamaica as well, the British delegation refused to part with it. Britain was more willing to cede the Bahamas and British Honduras as they had been struggling economically for decades, but Jamaica had become profitable once again, and looked to become more so now with the shedding of two colonies under its administration. Additionally, while agreements between Wilfred Laurier and Roosevelt during the war had made the Laurentian region an afterthought for American gains, minor border adjustments with Canada were made and Deseret and Acadia received full independence.
The Weltkongress:
With the revival of the Concert system of diplomacy during the closing stages of the Great War, many influential figures in foreign policy, especially among the victorious powers, brought up the idea of a continuous Congress system to follow the Peace of Vienna. The creation of the Weltkongress was spearheaded by German and French ministers. Herbert von Bismarck, Foreign Minister and Otto von Bismarck's eldest son, and King Ernest August II of Hanover[5] led the German efforts, while Maurice Rouvier, echoing Frédéric Passy's previous calls for a permanent international conference before his death, was the main French proponent along with Caillaux. Rouvier, Bismarck, and the Hanoverian king had held frequent discussions during the war to set up a Committee for Global Peace, and had already drawn up proposals for a global assembly of nations, which would arbitrate disputes between nations. These first drafts included the creation of an international court within the congress framework for general disputes, as well as special commission to hear trade and tariff disputes between nations.
However, the Hanover Committee proposals for trade and international courts being handled within the assembly were opposed by British and American representatives once the discussion of a permanent World Congress began to take shape in 1912. The British were loudly opposed to what they thought of as efforts to secure the Franco-German dominance of European and world affairs and walked out of the discussion in February. The American delegation was more hopeful for negotiations but had some reservations. President Roosevelt, supportive of the idea of a World Congress, had returned to the United States at the new year to oversee the new Congressional session and in preparation for the 1912 election campaign. In his stead, he sent Vice President Taft, one of the Roosevelt cabinet's major proponents of the World Congress[6], and presidential adviser Elihu Root to Vienna. The United States opposed the idea of an international trade court, claiming that European intervention in American bilateral trade relations with other nations would be a violation of the Monroe Doctrine. Additionally, the United States opposed having other members' delegates be the arbitrators in court decisions, instead desiring panels of independent judges appointed by the Weltkongress, and opposed a proposal that members had an obligation to protect each other if attacked.
Although the Peace of Vienna was generally concluded by the end of 1911, the formation of the Weltkongress was almost continuous with the peace negotiations in the early months of 1912. The Charter of the Weltkongress was finally completed in March of 1920, with the first informal meeting of the signatory nations taking place in Vienna the next month. Due to the objections raised by the United States' delegation, the trade court idea was dropped and the International Court was separated from the Weltkongress itself, instead taking the form of the International Court of Arbitration in Brussels with panels of judges to hear the cases sent to it by the Weltkongress. The signatory nations to the Weltkongress Charter included the victorious Alliance members and most neutral nations in Europe, most Ibero-American nations, Persia, China, Corea, and Japan. The United States attended the first meeting of the Weltkongress, but as Congress had not yet ratified the Charter it was not yet officially a member state.
The first meetings of the Weltknogress were held in the Schönbrunn Palace in Vienna, and elected international lawyer Charles Albert Gobat of Switzerland as the organization's first Secretary General. The official languages of the Weltknogress at the time of the founding charter's passage were French, German, English, and Spanish. While Great Britain and Russia were notable exceptions during the founding of the Weltkongress, Russia became a member in 1915. The Weltkongress held scheduled meetings of the assembly twice a year, with special sessions for emergency events. Soon after the Weltknogress was founded, Gobat proposed the construction of a new building with the purpose of housing the Weltkongress. In 1922 in celebration of the tenth anniversary of the Weltkongress, Viennese architect Karl Ehn was commissioned to build a new site for the congress in the Donaustadt district of Vienna on the opposite side of the Danube from the city's historic center. This was intended to create an international diplomatic complex, and to extend the urban center of Vienna across the river. Ehn, an adherent of the Rotes Wien designed the complex not as a sprawling palace, but as an efficient and compact garden city for diplomats, their staff, and any curious members of the public. The Weltkongresshalle is a grand eight story building stretching along the bank of the Danube, lined with a terra cotta stucco facade[7]. Opposite the river from the hall lie a large park and courtyard, which is flanked by more conference halls and diplomatic apartments for the representatives and their families and staff to stay in during sessions.
[1] Le Moniteur Universel was privatized ITTL during Louis-Napoleon's presidency.
[2] OTL Carol I of Romania.
[3] The Joint Commission is an international body primarily made up of representatives from the United States and Costa Rica.
[4] Signed in the Palais Schwarzenberg in eastern Vienna.
[5] With hostilities between Britain and Germany, the Hanoverian line was deprived of its title of Duke of Cumberland and Teviotdale.
[6] Speculation abounded that Roosevelt wanted to keep Taft away from the early stages of the 1912 campaign, but there is little to substantiate these rumors.
[7] Something like the OTL Karl Marx Hof of the Jakob Reumann Hof.
Great job, wilcoxchar!
Looks like Independent California is gone. Manifest Destiny is still alive it seems...
It will be interesting to see what happens with California now that it has been annexed...
Looks like Independent California is gone. Manifest Destiny is still alive it seems...
It will be interesting to see what happens with California now that it has been annexed...
Woo! Manifest Destiny baby!
So - what exactly did the USA gain with the "minor" border changes in Canada?
So - what exactly did the USA gain with the "minor" border changes in Canada?
I hope the Californio Resistance victoriously pushes out the American occupiers from the heartland of the republic.
Viva California!
Viva California!
I'm very interested in seeing how this Jewish autonomous region will work out. I'm not to familiar with this region IOTL but is there a significant enough Jewish population to give it this status? Are they gonna have to relocate more Jews in, or possibly relocate non-Jews out? Without a holocaust there would have been, if not less demand, than at least less sympathy for the creation of a Jewish autonomous province.
I'll admit, I kind of also want to see continued tensions within American California in the future. It's such a massive annexation, there's got to be some serious problems accompanying it. Hell, I'm not sure Roosevelt didn't blunder in trying to go for it all at once rather than squeezing more concessions out of the British and then subjugating California piece by piece afterwards.
I'd guess it's the remaining British Pacific coast. Not sure that'd qualify as minor though.
Exactly! I thought that the other AH.commers convinced you to just take some northern and inland territories.
Free California! Stop American imperialistic oppression!
Exactly! I thought that the other AH.commers convinced you to just take some northern and inland territories.
Nonsense, California must stay together -- strong and free, or at least as a state that would make Texas weep with envy.
I am curious about Sonora and Hawaii though, especially with how hard Roosevelt worked to get the whole Republic annexed.