Uncle Adolf, or How Germany Joined the Allies against Soviet Invasion of Europe

What if Trotsky went into power in Soviet Union? Would that make any difference?

Considering Trotsky was of the "World Revolution" tendency, he might have appeared scarier then stalin in some ways to the western powers. With the later you assume he is trying to extent his contiguous borders, with the former, that he is trying to export communism in your backyard.
 
So how can we make USSR pre-emptively attack Germany post-Poland? If not, pre-Poland?
And how can we ensure the western democracies rally behind Hitler?
What if Trotsky went into power in Soviet Union? Would that make any difference?

You need a USSR with a military that more than outweighs the rest of Europe put together (meaning 1941 numbers with 1943 weaponry) and Hitler in power to be dumb enough to risk an unwinnable major war with the USSR, the democracies preferring the totalitarians ruin each other in a long war when it turns out that whoopsie, the Nazis weren't as strong as they thought they were and most of the Balkans has gone Red.....essentially Stalin's motivations for the M-R Pact but in reverse, with Germany playing the role of OTL Poland and France both. The democracies now confront a much more overall stronger USSR that they helped get there and have to risk the Anglo-French/Soviet War or simply accept a Warsaw Pact much earlier.
 
The Red Army was hardly capable of defeating a tiny and poorly equipped Finnish army in 1939 / 1940.

The post-purge Red Army under the leadership of the likes of Kulik invading an Arctic nation during the middle of winter did have trouble. Any army would have trouble invading Finland in winter against fixed defensive works.

However as soon as the weather improved & under better leadership, the Fins crumbled very quickly and were lucky the Soviets did overrun the entire country.
 
The post-purge Red Army under the leadership of the likes of Kulik invading an Arctic nation during the middle of winter did have trouble. Any army would have trouble invading Finland in winter against fixed defensive works.

However as soon as the weather improved & under better leadership, the Fins crumbled very quickly and were lucky the Soviets did overrun the entire country.

This, plus Stalin greatly feared the possibility of an Allied intervention on behalf of the Finns and realized that starting a war the Soviet Union was very likely to lose (If they had some issues with Finland... imagine fighting it with the REAL powers) was very much not in Soviet interests. That's probably why they didn't go "Hmm, we've got momentum now, let's just go for full-on conquest and annexation of Finland."
 
You need a USSR with a military that more than outweighs the rest of Europe put together (meaning 1941 numbers with 1943 weaponry) and Hitler in power to be dumb enough to risk an unwinnable major war with the USSR, the democracies preferring the totalitarians ruin each other in a long war when it turns out that whoopsie, the Nazis weren't as strong as they thought they were and most of the Balkans has gone Red.....essentially Stalin's motivations for the M-R Pact but in reverse, with Germany playing the role of OTL Poland and France both. The democracies now confront a much more overall stronger USSR that they helped get there and have to risk the Anglo-French/Soviet War or simply accept a Warsaw Pact much earlier.

I don't understand. I said how to make democratic Allies join Hitler, you said they dumped him.
I said USSR preemptively attacked Germany, you said Hitler risk an unwinnable war
Should it be the other way around?
 
I don't understand. I said how to make democratic Allies join Hitler, you said they dumped him.
I said USSR preemptively attacked Germany, you said Hitler risk an unwinnable war
Should it be the other way around?

I said that the people in this thread talking about a Nazi Germany not led by Hitler siding with the Allies miss the original requirements of the AHC, and that if Hitler is someone the democracies can see as a lesser evil he's leading a state that's weak enough he's going to fall apart when the USSR's armies march.
 

burmafrd

Banned
Off topic, has anyone done a timeline where Canaris or someone finds out about Sorge and they use him to feed bad info to Stalin?
 
Off topic, has anyone done a timeline where Canaris or someone finds out about Sorge and they use him to feed bad info to Stalin?

Stalin actually listening to Sorge was pretty hit or miss in history, it's unlikely that compromising Sorge would actually seriously affect all that much.
 
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