Twilight of the Red Tsar

Discussion in 'Alternate History Discussion: After 1900' started by Napoleon IV, Nov 1, 2015.

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  1. Johnrankins Well-Known Member

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    The Japanese are gone so a lot of its problems are gone. It wasn't like the Communists were free of corruption and they had their share of infighting. China is unlikely to be the most efficient country in the world, only in part due to the KMT, but it should muddle through.
     
  2. Johnrankins Well-Known Member

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    Exactly, no one would give a damn. Finland was never considered an Axis member in the same way as as a country like Romania , not talking Germany, was. Hell, a lot of Americans don't even know that Romania and Hungary were Axis members as all the focus is on the Big Three.
     
  3. Johnrankins Well-Known Member

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    They would be luck if they were merely shot instead of being slowly beaten to death by angry mobs.
     
  4. Slings_Arrows Probably Human

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    Christ dude, take it down a notch. For one thing this is fiction, for another responding to atrocity by committing atrocities, whether legally sanctioned or not, does nothing to heal the scars inflicted by said atrocities. There's a reason why most rank and file nazis were imprisoned instead of executed.
     
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  5. Johnrankins Well-Known Member

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    I didn't say that is what I would want to happen but what I thought is likely to happen. You have a lot of angry people out there and if they caught someone who was responsible for the deaths of their relatives and friends they are likely to want vengeance. Russia isn't exactly stable at this point in TTL. I would imagine there are a lot of angry mobs out there and if a war criminal goes in the wrong place at the wrong time being beaten to death by the relatives and friends of the victims is not that unlikely. There is a reason I used the phrase "angry mobs".
     
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  6. Johnrankins Well-Known Member

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    The loss of Jews isn't going to be the only brain drain. My guess is that people during this entire time period wanted to get the hell out and the brightest had the easiest time figuring out how to do so.
     
  7. Johnrankins Well-Known Member

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    A myth, Russia was industrialized before WW1 and it had better growth than under Stalin to boot.
     
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  8. MagicalPhantom345 Well-Known Member

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    Well Stalin's second Holocaust and purge left the eastern bloc in a third world state, so i am not surprised.
     
  9. naraht Well-Known Member

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    Industrialized, yes, but considered to have done so relatively inefficiently by the standards of Northwest Europe.
     
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  10. Johnrankins Well-Known Member

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    What's with all this Lenin worship? Stalin was a natural outgrowth of Lenin, who was a total dictator who ignored he first free election in Russian history and had an impressive body count of his own. Hundreds of thousands at least and quite possibly a million or more. Molotov once said "Compared to Lenin, Stalin was a mere lamb".
     
  11. Johnrankins Well-Known Member

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    Which continued under the Communists or was even the 1970's USSR a shining beacon of efficiency? Even at its height its efficiency was a joke compared to the US, West Germany, Japan and France among many others.
     
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  12. Historyman 14 Well-Known Member

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    Lenin himself realized he created a form of autocracy with the Bolsheviks and the USSR, which is why he tried in vain to stop Stalin from taking power.

    And Lenin worst pales when put up next to Stalin of this timeline.
     
  13. Joshua Ben Ari Well-Known Member

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    I wonder... what would have been the fate of Andrei Sakharov?
     
  14. Historyman 14 Well-Known Member

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    He became the leader of the Liberal Party before stepping down after clashing with the conservative and military wings of the Council of National Salvation.

    (See here and also here.)
     
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  15. Johnrankins Well-Known Member

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    No, he tried to stop Stalin because Stalin insulted his wife. Lenin might not be as bad as Stalin but he was bad enough not to worship. The best way for him to have stopped Stalin was to respect the election and let the SR's take over.
     
  16. Johnrankins Well-Known Member

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    Very unlikely, it has both central planning and is based on a revolutionary party. Both are far too associated with Nazism and Communism to pass muster.
     
    Last edited: Dec 3, 2019
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  17. Johnrankins Well-Known Member

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    Everyone, including FDR, considered the "business plot" a joke. No one was even prosecuted. It was little more than a bunch of rich guys complaining about the New Deal.
     
  18. Johnrankins Well-Known Member

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    That is extremely unlikely , it will take decades, if not a century or more for Russia to dig out of its hole. They might have higher growth than the Western Powers but they will be so far behind that they could in no way be the "Leading Economic Power" in less than 50 years.
     
  19. Bookmark1995 Bookmark95 Reborn!

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    It is undeniable that Lenin, by suppressing democracy and persecuting peasants, set a precedent for the horrors of Stalinism.
     
  20. Johnrankins Well-Known Member

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    Also a big part of it was WW1. Basically everyone owed the US money and had little means of paying it back. In TTL Europe probably doesn't owe the US a ton of money. When the depression hits the US dollar will go down. Europe will then start buying more American goods which will mitigate it.
     
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