Triple Intervention of 1895 leads to a would war in 1895

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Russia, France, and Germany demand japan cede the Liaodong peninsula. Japan having signed a series of secret Treaty's, tells Russia, France, and Germany to but out. 12 November 1895 Russia, France, and Germany declared war on Japan. Japan calls on its secret alliances. 14 November 1895 The Spanish Empire, Ottoman Empire, and Great Britain, declared war on Russia, France, and Germany. 16 November 1895 The United State Of America declared war on Russia, France, and Germany. 22 November 1895 Austria-Hungary declared war on Japan The Spanish Empire, ottoman empire, and Great Britain and Untied States.
 

abc123

Banned
Russia, France, and Germany demand japan cede the Liaodong peninsula. Japan having signed a series of secret Treaty's, tells Russia, France, and Germany to but out. 12 November 1895 Russia, France, and Germany declared war on Japan. Japan calls on its secret alliances. 14 November 1895 The Spanish Empire, Ottoman Empire, and Great Britain, declared war on Russia, France, and Germany. 16 November 1895 The United State Of America declared war on Russia, France, and Germany. 22 November 1895 Austria-Hungary declared war on Japan The Spanish Empire, ottoman empire, and Great Britain and Untied States.

Did Japan really had all that secret alliances?
 
Did Japan really had all that secret alliances?

Not at all

Ottoman relations with Japan...hmmm, I remember reading the Sultan sent the emperor a ceremonial sword, but he sent it on the Ottoman's only real long-distance ship, a sailing training frigate which had an epic journey, got refused to be cleaned at Singapore (the Brits thought it would fall apart without its barnacles) and after a couple of years staggered journeys finally sank in a storm on the last part of the voyage, drowning all the cadets

Maybe if it had got through?

Best Regards
Grey Wolf
 
Not at all

Ottoman relations with Japan...hmmm, I remember reading the Sultan sent the emperor a ceremonial sword, but he sent it on the Ottoman's only real long-distance ship, a sailing training frigate which had an epic journey, got refused to be cleaned at Singapore (the Brits thought it would fall apart without its barnacles) and after a couple of years staggered journeys finally sank in a storm on the last part of the voyage, drowning all the cadets

Maybe if it had got through?

Best Regards
Grey Wolf

Interesting to say the least.
 
hmm.

How would Spain be drawn into this Alliance, though?

and then why would the USA throw in with the Anglo-Ottoman-Japanese alliance?
 
hmm.

How would Spain be drawn into this Alliance, though?

and then why would the USA throw in with the Anglo-Ottoman-Japanese alliance?

I can't see anything for the US to get out of it... There's no point it fighting Russia - over what? Or Germany - Samoa maybe, but that's a tiny consideration. And they have nothing to gain from the French - Martinique? Or if it is for philosophical reasons, maybe they see Japan as being victimised and pushed around, but not to the point where they would declare war in her favour

Best Regards
Grey Wolf
 
Why on earth would UK side with the Ottomans, Spanish and Japanese against the French, Germans and Russians in 1895? There's maintaining the balance of power and then there's getting involved in a losing war and the latter would be a losing war. Yeah, the UK side would probably win the sea battles but this war will primarily be a land war. A-H, Germany and Russia pwn the Ottomans, France pwns Spain and Japan and the UK are unable to effectively intervene as they both are primarily sea powers. Japan doesn't even control Korea at this point

Although thinking a bit further, UK may well play 'steal the colonies' whilst their enemies are engaged in Europe and Japan may act similarly. but beyond that there's going to be little success for the UK side. And that's ignoring the fact that France hates Germany at this point
 
For arguments sake say the OP happens who would win?
The Franco-Russo-Germans. There's literally no chance for an Anglo-Spanish-Japanese-Ottoman-US alliance to even contend with them in Europe. On the seas, sure. But really, it won't be decided there.

And as noted before, France is as likely to fight on Germany's side as a snowball is to survive in hell.
 
The Franco-Russo-Germans. There's literally no chance for an Anglo-Spanish-Japanese-Ottoman-US alliance to even contend with them in Europe. On the seas, sure. But really, it won't be decided there.

And as noted before, France is as likely to fight on Germany's side as a snowball is to survive in hell.

Maybe less. Hell could freeze over.

France is embracing England as an ally as a good thing to get back at Germany.
 
Actually, I thought of Something.

France is only doing this because they're bound to the Russians, while Germany's only doing this for themselves.

If France stays out, then what?
 
Actually, I thought of Something.

France is only doing this because they're bound to the Russians, while Germany's only doing this for themselves.

If France stays out, then what?

Anglo-Spanish-Japanese-Ottoman-US vs. Germany-Russia-Austria.

...still a win for the Eastern Eagles. Or at least a draw that doesn't see them lose.

Spain is almost irrelevant, the Ottomans are somewhere less burdensome(?) than Austria-Hungary. And Russia with an overland connection to its allies is going to be able to draw on help from them more easily.
 
Anglo-Spanish-Japanese-Ottoman-US vs. Germany-Russia-Austria.

...still a win for the Eastern Eagles. Or at least a draw that doesn't see them lose.

Spain is almost irrelevant, the Ottomans are somewhere less burdensome(?) than Austria-Hungary. And Russia with an overland connection to its allies is going to be able to draw on help from them more easily.

I do have to wonder how Spain of all nations got into an Alliance with Japan.
 

LordKalvert

Banned
Okay, lets see how wacko this idea is:

Spain wanted to join the Triple Intervention not fight it. As for the Ottoman's they were busy killing their Armenians to the horror of the English. The English were trying to dethrone the Sultan and the Sultan was protected by Russia, France and Germany. In any case, after the Ottoman fleet had rebelled for back pay, the Sultan had interned it and taken all the guns off of them and hid them in his palace.

Italy may have joined England in such a war but really, the English had little appetite to go to war to protect Japanese conquests.

Oh yeah, the Americans were planning a war against England over Venezuela, loved the Tsar for Russian help in the American Civil War.

Most likely, everyone jumps the English and splits their miserable little Empire between them- or fight it out on the continent over the spoils.
 
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Russia, France, and Germany demand japan cede the Liaodong peninsula. Japan having signed a series of secret Treaty's, tells Russia, France, and Germany to but out. 12 November 1895 Russia, France, and Germany declared war on Japan. Japan calls on its secret alliances. 14 November 1895 The Spanish Empire, Ottoman Empire, and Great Britain, declared war on Russia, France, and Germany. 16 November 1895 The United State Of America declared war on Russia, France, and Germany. 22 November 1895 Austria-Hungary declared war on Japan The Spanish Empire, ottoman empire, and Great Britain and Untied States.

There is no way all these conditions are met with an 1895 PoD.

First of all, France, Germany and Russia can win vs Japan against a possible military escalation. However, 38 allied navy ships in Asia vs 31 Japan navy ships will still make serious dent on that allied navy. Are the triple alliance willing enough to sacrifice manpower, resources for Liaodong Peninsula?

There are more important matters than going to war to Japan for Liaodong Peninsula at that scale like protecting your colonies or European affairs. It is one of the reasons why they went to diplomatic channels because any victory by the allies would be Pyrrhic and they also know the Japanese would back down. Diplomacy is winning without firing a shot.

The Japanese secret alliance would be non existent in a PoD 1895. So they chain would stop right there.
 

LordKalvert

Banned
There is no way all these conditions are met with an 1895 PoD.

First of all, France, Germany and Russia can win vs Japan against a possible military escalation. However, 38 allied navy ships in Asia vs 31 Japan navy ships will still make serious dent on that allied navy. Are the triple alliance willing enough to sacrifice manpower, resources for Liaodong Peninsula?

There are more important matters than going to war to Japan for Liaodong Peninsula at that scale like protecting your colonies or European affairs. It is one of the reasons why they went to diplomatic channels because any victory by the allies would be Pyrrhic and they also know the Japanese would back down. Diplomacy is winning without firing a shot.

The Japanese secret alliance would be non existent in a PoD 1895. So they chain would stop right there.


I think once they start shooting, they are going to take a lot more than Port Arthur like a lot.

The allied fleet is really the Russians with a little symbolic help but they had massive reinforcements available and the Japanese knew it. So there's not much Japan's going to do but cave once England turned them down

Even China still had a respectable fleet that could do some damage if properly armed and commanded.

The qualitative edge is very pro Russian at this stage as well. Surprised that the Russians didn't get more out there earlier unless they had been lured into complacency by England originally wanting to intervene.
 

LordKalvert

Banned
Actually, I thought of Something.

France is only doing this because they're bound to the Russians, while Germany's only doing this for themselves.

If France stays out, then what?

Then the intervention fails and some peaceful face saving is worked out.

But for the French to bow out, they lose the Russian alliance.

But seriously, the Triple Intervention happens because:

1) Everyone knew the English wouldn't fight

2) The Germans figured, the Russians and the French would win so why not join and get some goodies? Throwing the Russians east is a great plan for the Germans.


Never have figured out why Russia didn't press for more- like depriving Japan of everything here. The Kaiser was begging the Tsar for a port and Taiwan is an obvious prize (the Kaiser suggested it in his marginal notes)
 
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