Trent Affair help needed

frlmerrin

Banned
It has been some time since I last posted on an Anglo-American war during the American Civil War thread. This absence has largely been due to:-

1) With the odd exception, usually a snippet on ships or arms posted by robcrufurd no one has posted any new information for years.
2) No one has come up with any new ideas on the matter for an even longer period.
3) Almost all threads on the matter these days quickly degenerate in to an endless round of snittitude with posters holding that just because they don’t want a thing to be possible it isn’t possible. Sometimes this even degenerates to the nananana level.

However Anaxagoras recently published a poll and thread on the likelihood of Confederate independence and I got all excited but before I got excited enough to post on it we were back to the usual rounds of snititude. I was very disappointed. However, in that brief time of enthusiasm I did find a number of bits of new relevant information on the period and the Trent Affair in particular. Unfortunately I did not find most of the things I wanted. So I thought I would ask some of the questions I want answered here. I did not want to post in the Help and Feedback section as it is clear nobody who might know the answers to any of my questions will read them there. So in order to meet the requirements of the Pre-1900 section and not have a helpful Mod moving my thread I have added a more appropriate question below my inappropriate questions. The rule is you have to at least read the serious questions before addressing the final one.

Witness statements

I am aware of and have read the reports of Wikes, Fairfax, the other officers of San Jacinto, along with the depositions of Moir and report of Williams and the letters of the Commissioners all reported in the OR.

I have also read the memoir of one of the seamen on San Jacinto, the later and much more revealing article Fairfax reported in later life, a summary of the Trent Purser’s report and a summary of the speech Williams made to the Yacht club after landing.

I know that the eldest daughter of the Slidell family (Marguerite Mathilde Slidell, later the Baroness d’Erlange) produced an article on the Affair later in life but I do not have a copy.

So can anyone provide me with any of the following or at least where to find them?

1) Full version of the Trent Purser’s report
2) Full version of Williams speech to the Yacht club
3) Full or indeed any version of Wilkes speech on the affair made in Boston
4) Article by Marguerite Mathilde Slidell/Baroness d’Erlange
5) Notes of the interview of Captain Moir at the Admiralty (does it exist?)
6) Notes of the interview of Commander Williams at the Admiralty (does it exist?)
7) Logs of the Trent for 7/8th Nov 1861 (they have never been referenced by any author on the subject of the Trent Affair – do they still exist?)
8) Logs of San Jacinto 13th Oct to 24th Nov (these do exist and have been reference in Warren)
9) Did Mrs Slidell or indeed Mrs Eustis ever make a statement on the Affair to the British press at anytime subsequent to landing from the La Plata? Did Mrs Slidell correspond with her father on the matter?
10) Did Colonel Le Mat ever write about the Affair? Did he write a memoir?
11) Did any other member of the crew of the Trent write a witness statement of any kind?
12) Did any other member of the San Jacinto crew write a witness statement of any kind?

Slidell family and party

1) What was the name of the third Slidell girl i.e. not Marguerite Mathilde or Marie Rosine.
2) What were the birth dates of the Slidell girls and the son Alfred?
3) Servants accompanied the Slidell family. Were these really servants or were they ‘servants’ i.e. black slaves. How many were there and what were their names.
4) Apart from Colonel Le Mat who else accompanied the Commissioners’ party on Gordon/Theodora?

San Jacinto

1) Can anyone confirm what the battery of the USS San Jacinto was at the time of the Affair. I believe it to be 6 x 8” smooth bores. The reports of the Trent Affair mentioned a forward pivot, this would suggest that the battery was two pivots and two guns either side.
2) Does anyone have a crew (and passenger) list for San Jacinto at this time?
3) Was Kidder Breese an officer on the crew an officer passenger? What is the evidence?
4) Which officers were arrested and confined for possible Confederate sympathies immediately prior to the stopping of Trent?
5) Who did Lt Fairfax replace as commander of San Jacinto and when?
6) How did Wilkes get to Fernando Po to take Command of San Jacinto i.e. on which ship?
7) Why was the commander of the San Jacinto’s marines involved in the boarding of Trent? Who was he? Was he one of the officers suspected of Confederate sympathies and arrested?
8) On Nov 2nd San Jacinto hit the French brig Jules et Marie in daylight badly damaging her after the brig had fired a gun and raise a flag to notify the warship of her position. Does anyone know the justification for this or if Wilkes faced any reprimand or complaint about it?
9) What were the names of the two French warships at the Havana who’s captains wished discuss the matter with Wilkes.

Trent

1) Does anyone have a crew list for the Trent at the time of the Affair?
2) Can anyone confirm Trent’s registration number? I believe it may be 25126
3) What date did Trent leave Vera Cruz immediately prior to the Affair?
4) When did she arrive at the Havana?
5) When did the La Plata leave St Thomas with the Trent Affair passengers?
6) Anyone have any plans for the Trent? How thick was her hull?
7) What was her trial speed.

Spanish Havana

1) What was the size of the garrison of El Morro, what was her battery and what was the principal long arm of the Spanish army at this time.
2) What was the name of the Spanish warship that greeted the Gordon/Theodora of Cienfuegos?
3) Was a Spanish warship(s) usually based at the Havana? What was it?
4) Which British warships were working out of Havana at the start of the Affair?

And lastly to give a proper basis to this thread:-

In the event of an Anglo-American war over Trent during the American Civil War there is no credible way that the Union can defeat the might of the British Empire other than by a war of attrition that would hurt the Union far more than the Empire even should they make peace with the Confederacy, discuss.
 

CalBear

Moderator
Donor
Monthly Donor
It has been some time since I last posted on an Anglo-American war during the American Civil War thread. This absence has largely been due to:-

1) With the odd exception, usually a snippet on ships or arms posted by robcrufurd no one has posted any new information for years.
2) No one has come up with any new ideas on the matter for an even longer period.
3) Almost all threads on the matter these days quickly degenerate in to an endless round of snittitude with posters holding that just because they don’t want a thing to be possible it isn’t possible. Sometimes this even degenerates to the nananana level.

However Anaxagoras recently published a poll and thread on the likelihood of Confederate independence and I got all excited but before I got excited enough to post on it we were back to the usual rounds of snititude. I was very disappointed. However, in that brief time of enthusiasm I did find a number of bits of new relevant information on the period and the Trent Affair in particular. Unfortunately I did not find most of the things I wanted. So I thought I would ask some of the questions I want answered here. I did not want to post in the Help and Feedback section as it is clear nobody who might know the answers to any of my questions will read them there. So in order to meet the requirements of the Pre-1900 section and not have a helpful Mod moving my thread I have added a more appropriate question below my inappropriate questions. The rule is you have to at least read the serious questions before addressing the final one.

Witness statements

I am aware of and have read the reports of Wikes, Fairfax, the other officers of San Jacinto, along with the depositions of Moir and report of Williams and the letters of the Commissioners all reported in the OR.

I have also read the memoir of one of the seamen on San Jacinto, the later and much more revealing article Fairfax reported in later life, a summary of the Trent Purser’s report and a summary of the speech Williams made to the Yacht club after landing.

I know that the eldest daughter of the Slidell family (Marguerite Mathilde Slidell, later the Baroness d’Erlange) produced an article on the Affair later in life but I do not have a copy.

So can anyone provide me with any of the following or at least where to find them?

1) Full version of the Trent Purser’s report
2) Full version of Williams speech to the Yacht club
3) Full or indeed any version of Wilkes speech on the affair made in Boston
4) Article by Marguerite Mathilde Slidell/Baroness d’Erlange
5) Notes of the interview of Captain Moir at the Admiralty (does it exist?)
6) Notes of the interview of Commander Williams at the Admiralty (does it exist?)
7) Logs of the Trent for 7/8th Nov 1861 (they have never been referenced by any author on the subject of the Trent Affair – do they still exist?)
8) Logs of San Jacinto 13th Oct to 24th Nov (these do exist and have been reference in Warren)
9) Did Mrs Slidell or indeed Mrs Eustis ever make a statement on the Affair to the British press at anytime subsequent to landing from the La Plata? Did Mrs Slidell correspond with her father on the matter?
10) Did Colonel Le Mat ever write about the Affair? Did he write a memoir?
11) Did any other member of the crew of the Trent write a witness statement of any kind?
12) Did any other member of the San Jacinto crew write a witness statement of any kind?

Slidell family and party

1) What was the name of the third Slidell girl i.e. not Marguerite Mathilde or Marie Rosine.
2) What were the birth dates of the Slidell girls and the son Alfred?
3) Servants accompanied the Slidell family. Were these really servants or were they ‘servants’ i.e. black slaves. How many were there and what were their names.
4) Apart from Colonel Le Mat who else accompanied the Commissioners’ party on Gordon/Theodora?

San Jacinto

1) Can anyone confirm what the battery of the USS San Jacinto was at the time of the Affair. I believe it to be 6 x 8” smooth bores. The reports of the Trent Affair mentioned a forward pivot, this would suggest that the battery was two pivots and two guns either side.
2) Does anyone have a crew (and passenger) list for San Jacinto at this time?
3) Was Kidder Breese an officer on the crew an officer passenger? What is the evidence?
4) Which officers were arrested and confined for possible Confederate sympathies immediately prior to the stopping of Trent?
5) Who did Lt Fairfax replace as commander of San Jacinto and when?
6) How did Wilkes get to Fernando Po to take Command of San Jacinto i.e. on which ship?
7) Why was the commander of the San Jacinto’s marines involved in the boarding of Trent? Who was he? Was he one of the officers suspected of Confederate sympathies and arrested?
8) On Nov 2nd San Jacinto hit the French brig Jules et Marie in daylight badly damaging her after the brig had fired a gun and raise a flag to notify the warship of her position. Does anyone know the justification for this or if Wilkes faced any reprimand or complaint about it?
9) What were the names of the two French warships at the Havana who’s captains wished discuss the matter with Wilkes.

Trent

1) Does anyone have a crew list for the Trent at the time of the Affair?
2) Can anyone confirm Trent’s registration number? I believe it may be 25126
3) What date did Trent leave Vera Cruz immediately prior to the Affair?
4) When did she arrive at the Havana?
5) When did the La Plata leave St Thomas with the Trent Affair passengers?
6) Anyone have any plans for the Trent? How thick was her hull?
7) What was her trial speed.

Spanish Havana

1) What was the size of the garrison of El Morro, what was her battery and what was the principal long arm of the Spanish army at this time.
2) What was the name of the Spanish warship that greeted the Gordon/Theodora of Cienfuegos?
3) Was a Spanish warship(s) usually based at the Havana? What was it?
4) Which British warships were working out of Havana at the start of the Affair?

And lastly to give a proper basis to this thread:-

In the event of an Anglo-American war over Trent during the American Civil War there is no credible way that the Union can defeat the might of the British Empire other than by a war of attrition that would hurt the Union far more than the Empire even should they make peace with the Confederacy, discuss.

Might snippy yourself there at the end, dontcha think?
 
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