Total hindsight - Save Malaya 1941-42 with what you've got

I forgot about the Bristol Beauforts based at RAF Kallang. Added to the RAF forces, the Beaufort was one of the best torpedo strike aircraft of the time.
 
I know Dutch naval and air reinforcements got their pretty quickly OTL. Can they show up before things start?
 
If the IJA gets to within effective range of Singapore's batteries then the campaign is lost.

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We've got to kill 'em on the beaches or before.

True but if you are going to lose, do what you can to make it uglier and gum up their timeline...
 
Hindsight and submarines.

Ask for Dutch Subs and if possible some of Adm Harts subs from the Philippines in order to form a patrol line across the entrance of the Gulf of Thailand and if possible some off the main FIC Ports i.e Cam Rhan Bay

The Dutch subs may be available, but for the time being Admiral Hart will not allow any of his subs to get that far away at this time. Thomas Hart's orders were 2 fold, 1. Defend the Phillipines and 2. Preserve as a fleet in being the striking force of the Asiatic Fleet. (cruisers and destroyers). To perform number 1. Hart will need his subs( He doesn't know the cluster F*^#* that are the more modern Torpedoes).
 
Wreck all communications on the west side of the peninsula - it's not suitable for advancing troops anyway because most of the rain falls there, so the terrain is swampy and cut up by rivers.

Create a series of defensive lines on the eastern side, between the mountains and the sea. These consist of defensive boxes with sufficient food and ammunition to last for a couple of weeks. Have forces ready to counter-attack once the Japanese start to run out of supplies.

Toughen-up the troops so they don't leave their anti-tank guns in order to take shelter from the rain!

Don't build airfields willy-nilly where they can't be defended, stock them with petrol, and then leave them for the Japanese to capture.

The RAF shouldn't try to re-fight the Battle of Britain: they don't have the necessary infrastructure to stand on the defensive, so they should strike at the Japanese airfields as best they can, since they won't have early warning either. On one occasion during the fighting in Burma, Frank Carey led five Hurricanes against a Japanese-held airstrip and destroyed four or five enemy aircraft for the loss of one Hurricane. Had they managed to sustain this level of success the war in the air would have looked very different.

Don't use capital ships to search for the enemy: that's what aircraft are for. Only sortie the ships in the afternoon, so that by the time the Japanese spot them, raise the alarm, and get their bombers armed and en route, it will be near nightfall. This denies the Japanese much of a window of opportunity, and means that they'll have to return to base after dark, which will lead to lost aircraft.
 
And appreciate that the Japanese are not inferior little buck toothed yellow men who cannot see straight and cannot fly due to weak inner ears.

Appreciate that they are intelligence, well trained, and fierce fighters.

Also, believe the intelligence reports out of China that say Japanese fighter planes are very maneuverable and you should not engage them in low speed turning dog fights.

Everyone with hindsight would not underestimate the Japanese in Malaya. Trouble is that most with hindsight would OVERESTIMATE the japanese
 
Since Singapore is useless if the Japanese have controll of Indonesia use schorched earth tactics and blow up everything usefull in Malaya and Singapore once the Japanese invade and then evacuate every soldier, ship, airplane and if possible heavy weapons to Java.

Understand that the Japanese are in need of the oil and that there is no oil in Malaya, but plenty in Indonesia
 
Send a warship (preferable an old obsolete CL ?) to scout off the cost of FIC and report back every 1/2 hour, backed up by scouting with aircraft as OTL.

Yes its a suicide mission but it will give you the time to get ready as the IJN will end up starting hostilities early by sinking it as soon as it sights the invasion transports. This give you time for Matador and to get invasion beaches ready etc....
 
Since Singapore is useless if the Japanese have controll of Indonesia use schorched earth tactics and blow up everything usefull in Malaya and Singapore once the Japanese invade and then evacuate every soldier, ship, airplane and if possible heavy weapons to Java.

Understand that the Japanese are in need of the oil and that there is no oil in Malaya, but plenty in Indonesia

HMG will not look too kindly on the wanton destruction of colonial property.

  1. Martial law
  2. Turn/burn the spies
  3. Prep northern most airfields for demolition
  4. Get plans in place for airborne recce of landing beaches
  5. Get plans in place to size defendable territory in Thailand
  6. Whip the local units into shape.
  7. Get all troops used to working with and against armour
 
Couple of things can be done in addition to whats been said

If the initial landings are not defeated or subsequent IJA forces advance from Thailand and these force the Commonwealth forces to retreat then while they did OTL destroy all Bridges etc boats were not collected and sent south and in many cases were hoovered up and used by the Japanese to cross rivers and bypass areas of resistance.

Make sure this is done (ie boats taken away or Destroyed) and the owners compensated etc



There is also a bloody great big floating dock at Singers - possibly move it before 7th Dec? If so where?

If no time to move it away to a safe place then take it some where deep and scuttle it properly as and when the battle looks lost (ie the Japanese appear to have gained the advantage in Malaya).

And if the battle is lost then have a robust evacuation plan that involves degrading the military and logistical facilities before they leave (hey perhaps all those boats will come in handy for the evacuation?).
 

Driftless

Donor
Percival was a very capable staff officer, but not the guy for top command in a dynamic fight. That position did not play to his strength. Perhaps Alexander, or Auchinlek in place of Percival.
 
Percival was a very capable staff officer, but not the guy for top command in a dynamic fight. That position did not play to his strength. Perhaps Alexander, or Auchinlek in place of Percival.

Gen.Ironsides IIRC was not employed at this time - not sure how well he played with others but he is not the sort to have a break down!

And we have Lord Gort - say what you like about the man but he was not averse to making tough decisions etc.
 

Driftless

Donor
Percival was a very capable staff officer, but not the guy for top command in a dynamic fight. That position did not play to his strength. Perhaps Alexander, or Auchinlek in place of Percival.

Gen.Ironsides IIRC was not employed at this time - not sure how well he played with others but he is not the sort to have a break down!

And we have Lord Gort - say what you like about the man but he was not averse to making tough decisions etc.

I could see any of those guys telling both Heath, Bennett, & Brooke-Popham; along with the civilian authorities how things would be done - or else.
 
I could see any of those guys telling both Heath, Bennett, & Brooke-Popham; along with the civilian authorities how things would be done - or else.

And I can see them all getting sacked when it turns out that the "colonial stooges" are the reason they are there in the first place.


Any British commander who starts waving a gun about at the good old boy who is complaining about the military causing agro is the one in for a world of shit not the other way around.

If you are in Malaya in 1941-42 its because you arent judged good enough for the real war actually being fought, causing agro with the civillian authorities in a posting at peace means their friends in London will be yelling at your boss who likely thinks you have lost the plot and shit rolls down hill.
 

Driftless

Donor
And I can see them all getting sacked when it turns out that the "colonial stooges" are the reason they are there in the first place.


Any British commander who starts waving a gun about at the good old boy who is complaining about the military causing agro is the one in for a world of shit not the other way around.

If you are in Malaya in 1941-42 its because you arent judged good enough for the real war actually being fought, causing agro with the civillian authorities in a posting at peace means their friends in London will be yelling at your boss who likely thinks you have lost the plot and shit rolls down hill.

This is viewed in 20-20 hindsight... Your outline is the way it really was and that old boy view cost the Malayans, Indians, British, and Australians dearly.
 
This is viewed in 20-20 hindsight... Your outline is the way it really was and that old boy view cost the Malayans, Indians, British, and Australians dearly.


20-20 hindsight still should in my view just means you know what went wrong and can take measures that OTL were not taken but were not, it does not absolve you of the consequences of those measures because what would be the point of that?

It just makes everyone born before you look stupid without the ability to judge everything and ignore reality.


A British commander is not there to protect Indians and Malyasians. The wishes of the white colonials trump those to an extent its impossible to imagine today so including them in the cost fails as its not something the commander would be thinking about. If things were different it would be Indians and Malaysians he's killing on behalf of the colonial authorities.


The Colony such as it is exists to serve Britain through the provision of a naval base and wealth extraction mostly to the benefit of the local administration and their backers in London. Fucking over the administrators and settlers literally defeats the purpose of being sent there to protect them which is your one job besides protecting Singapore for its use in protecting other colonies and its failed at that because there is no fleet free to base from it.
 

Driftless

Donor
20-20 hindsight still should in my view just means you know what went wrong and can take measures that OTL were not taken but were not, it does not absolve you of the consequences of those measures because what would be the point of that?

It just makes everyone born before you look stupid without the ability to judge everything and ignore reality.


A British commander is not there to protect Indians and Malyasians. The wishes of the white colonials trump those to an extent its impossible to imagine today so including them in the cost fails as its not something the commander would be thinking about. If things were different it would be Indians and Malaysians he's killing on behalf of the colonial authorities.


The Colony such as it is exists to serve Britain through the provision of a naval base and wealth extraction mostly to the benefit of the local administration and their backers in London. Fucking over the administrators and settlers literally defeats the purpose of being sent there to protect them which is your one job besides protecting Singapore for its use in protecting other colonies and its failed at that because there is no fleet free to base from it.

In my opinion, the point of this excercise is to look at alternatives to what was done - which was a disaster for all. Everybody played "by the book" and it didn't work - at all...

Are you rejecting the OP's basic premise, or just my version of what the commander(s) should have done?
 
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In my opinion, the point of this excercise is to look at alternatives to what was done - which was a disaster for all. Everybody played "by the book" and it didn't work - at all...

Are you rejecting the OP's basic premise, or just my version of what the commander(s) should have done?

I like the OP, I think it is a good mental exercise to see what could be done with what was on hand.
 
Total hindsight eh, mmmmmm

Is this from 1st October 1941, and can we move assets from Hong Kong?

OK Just dealing with the army, major redeployments.

Australian 8th Div (2 Inf Bdes, 2 Arty Rgts and 3 Btys of AT) moved forward to Jitra, will enact a slim down Operation Matador. This will be an encounter confrontation, aimed to slow down Japanese advance, and destroy all bridges as they retreat. Set ready to move at 4 hours’ notice. Hoped they can make it to Hat Yai. The advance will be by road, all units are motorised. Composite Armoured Car coy made taking Marmon Herrington armoured car from the 3rd Indian Cavalry. To provide some AA defence, attached is the 16th Light AA Bty HKSRA and 1 MG Coy of Manchester Rgt. Oh and get of Brig Maxwell, promote Lt Col Galleghan in his place. Would lie to get rid of Gen Bennett, but not enough time.

12th Indian Bde, (3 Inf Bns and 1 Art Rgt) with 1 AT Bty and 1 Eng Coy attached. Moved to Kroh. Planned to take the Ledge and dynamite the road into the river. Set ready to move at 4 hours’ notice, command from Malaya Command. Given the importance of their role, I would keep BG Paris in command here

III Ind Corps now commands 11th Ind and 9th Ind Divisions only.

11th Indian Division - (6th and 15th Ind Bdes, Arty and Engs) moved to Gurun. Brig Simson engaged in planning and organising fixed defences. Public Works Dept building pillboxes, and locally impressed plantation workers used to dig earthworks. Troops engaged on learning defensive roles. (If I can have them, attached from Hong Kong, all 3 Medium 6 inch Btys of HKSRA (3,4 and 25), and 2 Coys of Middlesex MG Rgt. 2 Royal Scots, 5/7 Rajput, 2/114 Punjab as reserve bde) Again would like to get rid of Murry-Lyon, but no time
9th Indian Division split at Kota Bharu and Kuantan.

8th Ind Bde at Kota Bharu. Gives up 2/12 Frontier Force back to 22nd Bde. 3/16th Punjab Rgt and 5/14th Punjab Rgt Bn’s attached (was Krohcol), as is 2 MG Coys of Middlesex Rgt (Hong Kong). Provides a 5 Bn Bde, Brig Gen Key is very important to what success we have at Kota Bharu, and so must stay and not be promoted.

22nd Ind Bde at Kuantan. Regains 2/12 Frontier Force Bn, so back to 3 Bn’s, and has 1 MG Coy of Manchester Rgt attached.
28th Ind (Gurkha’s) Bde (3 Inf Bn’s) at Mersing. Attached are both Hong Kong Light Art Btys HKSRA (1 and 2) and 1 MG Coy of Manchester Rgt.

Further major defensive lines built at Kampar and Tanjong Malim, while lots of concreate tank obstacles built on road at good local defensive positions before them.

Recruitment and training of Chinese to operate behind enemy lines began.

Fatboy Coxy
 
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