Torpedos @ Tushimia Strait 1904

Any experts able to judge what the largest practical torpedo attack the Japanese might have executed? That is against the approaching Russian fleet, previous to or instead of the fleet gunnery engagement?

I'm looking at the torpedoes & equipped boats or ships & am not yet clear on the actual capabilities, doctrines, or actual deployment. Clarification on all this can lead to the next question.
 
torpedoes were only successful after the battle during night. A daytime attack would never have gotten close enough to do any damage (range was about a thousand yards at the time).

During the battle, the Japanese fired 100 torpedoes and scored 7 hits. They all came late at night after the ships were heavily damaged, lost cohesion and basically sitting ducks. Even then all the hits were scored on ships using searchlights. The ones who defended without them avoided every round. Torpedoes in 1905 left a trail of bubbles so they would have been easily tracked during the daytime.
 

Driftless

Donor
What little research I've read confirms that torpedos of that time frame were very short range (1000+ yards) in general and directional stability was often wifty; so the attacks would need to be delivered from murderously short range to be effective. I also believe the Japanese were using Whitehead torpedos in that time frame and they learned much about design and use by live fire practice. Of course, Edwardian era ships have a reputation for poor underwater protection from mines and torpedos; so a swarming attack from out of a fog bank might result in surprising success. A similar attack on a clear day where the Russians can prepare may not go well for the Japanese.
 
... so a swarming attack from out of a fog bank might result in surprising success. ...

That sort of what the Russians thought when surprised by some North Sea fishing boats.

... During the battle, the Japanese fired 100 torpedoes and scored 7 hits. ...

7% hits. Not much different from WWII rates. Maybe point lower due to inexperience of other factors. That leads me to think that if a night attack prior to the OTL battle You would have to place 300 of these Whitehead torpedoes in the water to damage or sink 15-20 Russian warships.
 

trurle

Banned
torpedoes were only successful after the battle during night. A daytime attack would never have gotten close enough to do any damage (range was about a thousand yards at the time).

During the battle, the Japanese fired 100 torpedoes and scored 7 hits. They all came late at night after the ships were heavily damaged, lost cohesion and basically sitting ducks. Even then all the hits were scored on ships using searchlights. The ones who defended without them avoided every round. Torpedoes in 1905 left a trail of bubbles so they would have been easily tracked during the daytime.
That sort of what the Russians thought when surprised by some North Sea fishing boats.
7% hits. Not much different from WWII rates. Maybe point lower due to inexperience of other factors. That leads me to think that if a night attack prior to the OTL battle You would have to place 300 of these Whitehead torpedoes in the water to damage or sink 15-20 Russian warships.
To be exactly, Japanese got 1 lucky mine hit, then torpedoed disabled Russian battleship 4 times. Then two torpedo hits to still mobile cruiser and battleship. Without the lucky mine, the torpedo hit ratio would be 2%. To put 300 torpedoes in water, you need to put them at longer average distances, degrading hit ratio even more. Most plausible is 1% hit ratio, resulting in 1-5 damaged or destroyed Russian vessels, not 15-20 vessels.
 
That sort of what the Russians thought when surprised by some North Sea fishing boats.

In war, men panic a lot. The incident isn't really unusual.


7% hits. Not much different from WWII rates. Maybe point lower due to inexperience of other factors. That leads me to think that if a night attack prior to the OTL battle You would have to place 300 of these Whitehead torpedoes in the water to damage or sink 15-20 Russian warships.

Not really. The Japanese torpedo boats were firing at ships that were heavily damaged traveling at very slow speed. There was no defensive cohesion left. The older ships were still in formation and beat back every attempt. In no other battle did the Japanese torpedo boats succeed in scoring a single hit to ships in formation



If you fired an 1905 torpedo, it left a trail of bubbles. Anyone could spot it and avoid them. The torpedo boats are also going to have to penetrate a destroyer screen to get in range. It simply isn't happening

Torpedoes were effective:

1) if the ships were surprised as they were at Port Arthur. This was before the Russians knew they were at war and hadn't put up the nets. These ships were also dead in the water and the attack happened at night Pretty ideal

2) isolated, damaged ships like after Tsushima

3) merchant and auxillieries
 
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The torpedoes of the time, as people noted were short ranged and comparatively slow. The RN's tactic for the time was, if engaged to just turn away. Even at 18 knots flank speed a torp with a range of about 1000 yards would only be closing at 18 - 20 or so knots and it would probably run out of fuel before it got in range. Also the weather on the day wasn't exactly great, and daylight attacks were risky as all hell.

Battleships and cruisers of the period were festooned with quick firing guns from 76mm down to 1 - 2lb guns as well as machine guns of all sizes and they were there purely to engage torpedo boats. At 1000 yards a torpedo boat squadron would be under a LOT of fire in a day time attack so really the night time attack was the best they could do and this was a very poorly coordinated and confusing affair in itself.
 
5 ships hit on a undamaged fleet might still mean something, but 2-3 pct a lot less. If such a attack is to be a game changer more than a few changes are needed.

300 torpedo's in a sustained attack sounds like 50+ boats and ships. Which may be pushing the boundaries of practicality.
 
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