Valdemar II
Banned
Something I posted on cf.com some time ago Marr965s "Steam! But in Greece?" inspired me to repost it here.
There has been several ideas to introduce new technologies to Rome, in the years we has discussed Alt-history, but yet I havent seen a timeline, where Rome discover .... paper in, let us say, 100 BC.
At first this seem a rather minor discovery, with less effect than the stream engine or the gunpowder, but I disagree. At the time Rome lacked access to a cheap and quantity media to write on, pergaments was expensive and papyros was rare. Paper would make the written information more common, which would result in a more people ready to invest the time and money to ensure that their children could read, what would slowly change the Roman education from tutoring of the rich, to schools, where several children could be taught at once. This would ensure that it would be easier for the poor to advance into the civil service of the Roman Empire and ensure a more meritocratic Roman adminstration, beside that it would result in a easier spread of “technology” and more efficient farming method, with people writing their experince down. All this will likely result in a more stable Roman adminstration, which doesn’t break down under the barbarian adminstration but continues to function under the rule of their new overlords.
Of course a early spread of paper will likely also result in a earlier discovery of the printing press, it seem one of those simple Engineering feats that the Romans seem to be master at discovering.
I think a Chinese style bureaucracy is quite likely, but the philosophy behind it will most likely be quite different, but I imagine that some kind pseudo-religeous philosophy will evolve (likely based on a mix between Emperor worship* and Stoicism), which will radicale effect the adoption of Christianity (let us imagine that it will not be butterflied away). Likely we see something like China where Buddhism, Taoism and Confusism exist together.
*or at least a worship of the state
Of course a early spread of paper will likely also result in a earlier discovery of the printing press, it seem one of those simple Engineering feats that the Romans seem to be master at discovering.
If that happens, some of the early Christian issues with Roman officials and Emperor worship might be averted. If the spread of Christianity happens quickly enough over a large enough segment of the politically relevant population, could you possibly see something like conscientious objection to state worship become accepted or at lest tolerated rather than ridiculed?
While I agree that the discovery of paper and of the printing press would have revolutionised the roman society, I'm a bit dubious about the equation literacy=burocracy and especially a meritocratic burocracy. The byzantine empire developed a burocracy even without paper and a pretty efficient one: in many texts the Final Judgement is described as a tax audit...At first this seem a rather minor discovery, with less effect than the stream engine or the gunpowder, but I disagree. At the time Rome lacked access to a cheap and quantity media to write on, pergaments was expensive and papyros was rare. Paper would make the written information more common, which would result in a more people ready to invest the time and money to ensure that their children could read, what would slowly change the Roman education from tutoring of the rich, to schools, where several children could be taught at once. This would ensure that it would be easier for the poor to advance into the civil service of the Roman Empire and ensure a more meritocratic Roman adminstration, beside that it would result in a easier spread of “technology” and more efficient farming method, with people writing their experince down. All this will likely result in a more stable Roman adminstration, which doesn’t break down under the barbarian adminstration but continues to function under the rule of their new overlords.
I would say that is just your impression, unless you can make some example...I was under the impression that what the Romans excelled at was stealing the technologies of defeated rivals. When the Romans were called upon to take the initiative, they rarely produced anything of true value.
I was under the impression that what the Romans excelled at was stealing the technologies of defeated rivals. When the Romans were called upon to take the initiative, they rarely produced anything of true value.
Given the wide spread of literacy and high regard for education we have in the Roman Empire, the invention of printing would spread rapidly and diversify into various grades targeting different markets, much like ceramic slipware and glass did IOTL. A possible effect would be a degradation of the concept of canon, as more literature spreads and the canonical works become less intensely studied as alternatives circulate. Education will eventually move away from using Homer as its primary text.
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What was literacy in the Empire anyway? Only around 10%, no?