Thank you very much
Oh, I suppose that bit was slightly ambiguous. It's the redhead firebrand in the header photo - Barbara Castle.
EDIT: Edited for clarity.
TLIAW: Walking Back To Happiness
- Thread starter Comisario
- Start date
Thank you very much
Oh, I suppose that bit was slightly ambiguous. It's the redhead firebrand in the header photo - Barbara Castle.
EDIT: Edited for clarity.
If anyone wanted to see it, here's the alternate cover -
I suppose the post-premiership story of Greenwood is a good one - a bit like Thatcher's, where divisiveness turns to lasting popularity.
Labour is in power in 1982, and I may do a few more TLIAWs/TLIADs/vignettes in this universe to flesh out what happens post-Greenwood.
I suppose the post-premiership story of Greenwood is a good one - a bit like Thatcher's, where divisiveness turns to lasting popularity.
Labour is in power in 1982, and I may do a few more TLIAWs/TLIADs/vignettes in this universe to flesh out what happens post-Greenwood.
This is very good. Neatly book-ended, and perfectly paced for a TLIAW. I don't think I've seen many attempts at a British politically alternate 60s, but this one definitely feels distinct. A "more successful" 1960s Labour government that still feels realistic.
Good use of medium-range butterflies with the alternate Tory and Liberal leaders, and with President Romney.
I didn't know of Anthony Greenwood before I read this TL - though I've used his father, "Speak for England Arthur!", myself. It seems odd that Anthony should go from being prominent enough to be a potential leadership contender in 1960, to not even being that big a name in the '64 Wilson government and very much obscure from a modern perspective. Then again, that's exactly what happens to Wilson in TTL. An excellent choice of figure for an original timeline.
I wonder what happens to the future of this world? Early withdrawal from Vietnam will dampen the inflation of the 1970s - with luck even the causes and timings of the oil shocks might be averted. It is implied that the next election is in 1973, and that the Powell-led opposition is in no state to contest it. A continued Castle premiership on a smaller majority? Does a Powell defeat discredit monetarism? Or has Powell been deposed for a Howard analogue? The optimist in me hopes that a lot of the problems that became near insurmountable in the late 1970s OTL, have been somewhat tackled earlier here. More of the Post-war consensus might survive to the present day.
Its implied that the Old Right is very much marginalised by TTL 1970. It seems likely that Callaghan will be retiring in '73 (as he considered in OTL), but what of younger figures? Healey and Jenkins, and those who would have been ministers under Callaghan? Do the Liberals end up as the only pro-EEC party?
Any interest in directly following this on with an account of the Castle years? "Waiting On The Shores Of Nowhere" - to keep with the Shapiro theme.
Well done again.
Good use of medium-range butterflies with the alternate Tory and Liberal leaders, and with President Romney.
I didn't know of Anthony Greenwood before I read this TL - though I've used his father, "Speak for England Arthur!", myself. It seems odd that Anthony should go from being prominent enough to be a potential leadership contender in 1960, to not even being that big a name in the '64 Wilson government and very much obscure from a modern perspective. Then again, that's exactly what happens to Wilson in TTL. An excellent choice of figure for an original timeline.
I wonder what happens to the future of this world? Early withdrawal from Vietnam will dampen the inflation of the 1970s - with luck even the causes and timings of the oil shocks might be averted. It is implied that the next election is in 1973, and that the Powell-led opposition is in no state to contest it. A continued Castle premiership on a smaller majority? Does a Powell defeat discredit monetarism? Or has Powell been deposed for a Howard analogue? The optimist in me hopes that a lot of the problems that became near insurmountable in the late 1970s OTL, have been somewhat tackled earlier here. More of the Post-war consensus might survive to the present day.
Its implied that the Old Right is very much marginalised by TTL 1970. It seems likely that Callaghan will be retiring in '73 (as he considered in OTL), but what of younger figures? Healey and Jenkins, and those who would have been ministers under Callaghan? Do the Liberals end up as the only pro-EEC party?
Any interest in directly following this on with an account of the Castle years? "Waiting On The Shores Of Nowhere" - to keep with the Shapiro theme.
Well done again.
Thank you very much for the high praise. I suppose part of the drive to write this was to give a Labour government of the 60s some meaning, as it were. Wilson's government was more managed decline than modern revolution, thus depriving the latter half of the decade of new ideology and political labels.
Here, innovation still exists in politics in ideology. Instead of modernism running counter to cultural progress, it runs parallel.
Once again, I'm so pleased I could make it as plausible and seemingly realistic as possible.
Cheers - Romney as President and Lubbock as Liberal leader are two 1960s AH loves of mine that I couldn't resist including them.
I'd been doing research into the Wilson government, looking for figures for a Communist Britain PMs list, when I came across Tony Greenwood. I'm slightly ashamed to say that it was his looks that grabbed me at first - his dark suits, slick hair and handsome features made him really stand out as a 1960s politician. The more I learned about him, the better I thought of him.
I'm glad you picked up on Wilson's fall. That and the fall of Heath are the two things that developed in my head as I wrote the timeline, as I realised that I'd set both of them on a downwards trajectory into the footnotes of political history.
I won't comment too much on what could happen in the future of this universe, but I'll say Powell will not be the man leading the Conservatives into the '73 election. It was very briefly hinted at in one of the last few updates, but it was an easy hint to miss.
Callaghan will certainly be on his way out, despite the loyalty he showed to Greenwood. For younger figures such as Healey and Jenkins, I won't say how they turn out. Be pro-EEC won't help them, at any rate.
The Liberals will remain steadfastly EEC as the other parties have further debates on the issue - there'll be no surprise Oliver Smedley-led Liberal Party!
I have plenty of interest in following this with an account of the Castle and [CENSORED] years. I've already started research, actually.
Thanks for the title suggestion, by the way. I was thinking of either that or "Sometime Yesterday". The Shapiroverse lives on!
Cheers, mate.
It certainly is! Hopefully, I'll have all my research done by Christmas and I'll be writing it by the New Year.
Of course, this is all just hopes and plans at the moment. Normally, I start with a title graphic and go from there - not exactly the most scholarly way to go about it, but it works to motivate me to write so I can see it in the original post of a thread.
Well, that's a TL all of its own. I'm sure somebody will do a oneshot of her as PM one day, but I'm way too busy doing research for the next instalment of the Shapiroverse.
Just wait until we see the figures in the next TLIAW's title graphic!
This news has really made my day, so thank you for that - you don't know how much this has made me smile.
This news has really made my day, so thank you for that - you don't know how much this has made me smile.
Ah, that's good to know! I feel like I'm going to have you in suspense for months now!
This is really bloody good. I've been reading this in snippets over the past couple of days, and it's been a real pleasure - I'd love to see where the Shapiroverse (great name, btw) goes next. Not least because I don't think I've ever seen a Castle premiership done properly before!
More is coming. Much, much more...
Cheers, mate.
I'm happy to know that it's been such a pleasure to read as it was to write.
Oh, a Castle premiership will be done. Whether she is able to weather the storms and be as successful as Greenwood is another matter entirely.
Just a little update...
I've been doing some more research and I've been making the title graphic, but I've hit a little obstacle. I need to decide on a title.
It'll have to be a Shapiro song (just so I can justify the use of her music and the use of the name "Shapiroverse")
The current shortlist I have consists of -
Waiting On The Shores Of Nowhere
Sometime Yesterday
Walking In My Dreams
I wanted to gauge people's opinions because I can't decide myself and feedback is always good!
I've been doing some more research and I've been making the title graphic, but I've hit a little obstacle. I need to decide on a title.
It'll have to be a Shapiro song (just so I can justify the use of her music and the use of the name "Shapiroverse")
The current shortlist I have consists of -
Waiting On The Shores Of Nowhere
Sometime Yesterday
Walking In My Dreams
I wanted to gauge people's opinions because I can't decide myself and feedback is always good!
I've used that title for the title graphic and it works pretty well.*
I'd say that, given everything that I've pointed to, Castle's early year(s) will be a "honeymoon period" of sorts. We also can't forget that dreams can become nightmares...
*The graphic is so Seventies that it's offensive to both my eyes and all good taste
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