TLIAPOD: Losing the peace or how Henry Morgenthau destroyed Germany

Discussion in 'Alternate History Discussion: After 1900' started by Kovalenko, Jul 12, 2016.

  1. Beata Beatrix Anarchist Mum

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2015
    So, they want to stop radicalization by literally building concentration camps. This TL gets worse and worse for the People of the Book. At least RFK saw the monstrosity of the things. What happened to Jack? Did he die early?
     
  2. Kovalenko Kova

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2012
    Location:
    Ferngill Republic
    1978 Midterm Elections

    FBI Director Mark Felt retires, Richard Nixon (R-CA) nominated as replacement by President Buckley.
    - Sacramento Bee

    "Listen Dick, we've got a quarter of the seats in Congress. That just doesn't cut it. I need leverage, and fast, or I'm gonna end up like Pepper."

    [...]

    "Yes this is a secure line."

    [...]

    "A list?"

    [...]

    No. In person. No copies.

    - Recorded phone conversation between President Buckley and FBI Director Richard Nixon.

    "Mr. President"

    "Cut the small talk Dick, what's in this folder anyway?"

    "Nineteen Senate seats"

    "... tell Don to cancel my appointments, I've got a meeting with Mr. Thurmond this afternoon."

    - Recorded conversation between President Buckley and FBI Director Richard Nixon.

    "Mr. President"

    "Good to see you Strom, have you looked over my plan?"

    "Yes, but these Urban Enterprise Zones... they give the Federal Government too much control over our southern cities an-"

    "Let me stop you there Strom, let's talk colleges."

    "Yes sir, entirely too much federal funding goes to Negro institutions an-"

    "No no, California State University. My state. I know the students well, and I think you do too. One in particular anyway."

    "..."

    "Do we understand each other Strom?"

    "I'll, uhh, get my people to vote for the UEZ bill an-"

    "No. They vote for all my bills. Understand?

    "Mecham will oppose me an-"

    "Then get rid of him. Passman and Jenrette too. Understand?"

    "Yes... Mr. President."

    "Good."

    [1]

    - Recorded conversation between President Buckley and States' Rights Floor Leader Strom Thurmond.

    "That's 44 seats, still not what we need Dick."

    "With Foss' men that's 58. We can kill any gun control law that comes to the table. With Conscience that's 56, we can block any peacenik from interfering with the war effort. With Covenant that's 52, stops any kike-favoring agenda from getting off the ground. There's als-"

    "With Grange. With Conscience. With Covenant. Kill. Block. Stop. Dick, when do we get to propose? Act? Govern? When will this country do anything again?"

    "Without at least half the chamber in our pocket any pissant can run roughshod over us. I'm sorry sir bu-"

    "Then get me half the chamber."

    "The next election cycle doesn't favor us that much sir, I-"

    "Doesn't it? Aren't you my FBI director? Do some investigating."

    "... I have this list, not everything is concrete bu-"

    "Good. The gloves come off now Dick. Get a team together."

    "Well sir, I have a few people I'd like to bring on board..."

    "Everyone's guilty of doing something in the dark Dick, put spotlight on em' and it all comes tumbling down..."

    - Recorded conversation between President Buckley and FBI Director Richard Nixon.

    "Roy!"

    "Yes sir?"

    "How many"

    "What?"

    "How many?"

    "... just one so far sir"

    "This cycle?"

    "Yes sir"

    "Get me two"

    "I'm on it"

    1978 Senate Races

    Note:
    All "crimes" committed by the Senators in question are OTL. Races marked with a (*) indicate that something untoward occurred during the campaigning process ITTL.
    Class 2 Senators
    Alabama:
    George Wallace (SR)
    Seat held.

    *Alaska: Ted Stevens (I)
    Indicted on corruption charges, seat won by Republican challenger.

    *Arkansas: Wilbur Mills (V)

    Gave drunken an interview to an unknown reporter in a burlesque house, seat won by States' Rights challenger.

    *Colorado: Richard Lamm (G)

    Jailed for possession of schedule 1 drug (marijuana), seat won Republican challenger.

    Delaware: Peace Incumbent

    Seat won Conscience challenger.

    Georgia: Jimmy Carter (V)

    Seat held.

    *Idaho: George V. Hansen (G)

    Jailed for corruption, seat won Republican challenger.

    *Illinois: Dan Crane (G)

    Exposed as homosexual, jailed under U.S. anti-sodomy laws, seat won Republican challenger.

    *Iowa: Harold Hughes (G)

    Committed suicide, seat won Republican challenger.

    Kansas: Bob Dole (G)

    Seat held.

    Kentucky: Republican Incumbent

    Seat won by States' Rights challenger.

    *Louisiana: Otto Passman (SR)

    Convicted of bribery, committed suicide, seat retained for States' Rights by "Thurmondite" candidate.

    Maine: Peace Incumbent

    Seat won by Conscience challenger.

    *Massachusetts: Gerry Studds (D)

    Exposed as homosexual, jailed under U.S. anti-sodomy laws, seat won Republican challenger.

    Michigan: Peace Incumbent

    Seat won by Conscience challenger.

    Minnesota: Gene McCarthy (P)

    Seat won by Conscience challenger.

    Mississippi: SR Incumbent

    Seat won by challenger Elvis Presley (V).

    Montana: Republican Incumbent

    Seat held.

    Nebraska: Republican Incumbent

    Seat held.

    New Hampshire: Conscience Incumbent

    Seat held.

    *New Jersey: Barney Frank (C)

    Exposed as homosexual, jailed under US anti-sodomy laws, seat won by Republican challenger.

    New Mexico: Democratic Incumbent

    Seat won by States' Rights' challenger.

    North Carolina: Covenant Incumbent

    Seat held.

    Oklahoma: Republican Incumbent

    Seat held.

    *Oregon: Bob Packwood (C)*

    Convicted on several accounts of sexual assault, seat won by Republican challenger, party leader eliminated.

    Rhode Island: Conscience Incumbent

    Seat held.

    *South Carolina: John Jenrette (SR)

    Convicted of bribery, did not stand for re-election, seat retained for States' Rights by "Thurmondite" candidate.

    South Dakota: Joe Foss (G)

    Seat won by Republican challenger, party leader eliminated.

    *Tennessee: Abe Fortas (V)

    Found to have consorted with a convicted felon, seat won by States' Rights challenger.

    Texas: Charlie Nesbitt Wilson (G)

    Jailed for possession of schedule 1 drug (cocaine), seat won by challenger Marion Morrison (R).

    Virginia: Covenant Incumbent

    Seat held.

    West Virginia: Republican Incumbent

    Seat held.

    Wyoming: Grange Incumbent

    Seat held.

    Results

    Although details of their imprisonment would not come to light for a number of years, convicted felons in the Buckley Administration were subject to various forms of torture. Ex-Senators and other high ranking officials alike were subject to medical neglect and "diesel therapy" a form of punishment in which prisoners are painfully shackled and then transported for days or weeks without rest. [2]

    [​IMG]

    Senate 1978
    Creator: Perfidious Albion
    [​IMG]
    The election was a GOP landslide. The Statue of Liberty Attack and the subsequent Jewish Internment laws saw Buckley cut through Grange's support base with a "tough on terror [Jews]" stance. Further, the Buckley Administration successfully ended the Sagebrush Rebellion by opening up large swaths of federal land in the west for private ownership. This angered environmentalists but solidified GOP support in the Grange heartland. Further, the capture of Jerusalem by American-led forces cut through PDP support like a knife. Floor Leader Muskie, who had been arguing the war was futile, now looked the fool. The atrocities committed by America's Concordant allies had not yet come to light, and the war effort was popular among the general public at this time. These factors, combined with an end to the oil crisis, resulted in the GOP picking up an unusually high number of seats for an incumbent party.

    The Republicans, who had been labeled "the janitors" for their constant harping about the need to clean up corruption, were vindicated by the outbreak of several scandals surrounding the other parties. The Conscience Party was forced to replace Floor Leader Packwood after his implication in a sex scandal. George Aiken, who had help found the party decades earlier, was selected with the blessing of Senator Smith. Smith, who was re-elected to her seat in Maine, was 81 years old at the time and assumed a position of Elder Stateswoman.

    The Republicans selected Major Marion Mitchell Morrison, hero of the Black Ditch and Former Governor of Texas, to replace Nixon as their leader after the latter resigned to become Director of the FBI. The GOP picked up nine seats and joined States' Rights to form a majority government. The coalition, which held 56 seats between them, was well positioned to do some actual governing over the next two years...

    Footnotes
    [1] If it wasn't clear, President Buckley is blackmailing Thurmond.
    [2] IOTL at least one person on this list, George V. Hansen, was subject to these forms of torture while imprisoned. The practice is more widespread ITTL.
    [3] A leader with a grey portrait indicates that his party has been destroyed politically. Ted Stevens was the only member of his "party" and thus it died with his defeat for re-election.
     
    Last edited: Aug 25, 2016
  3. Kovalenko Kova

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    He lost his Senate race ITTL. He eventually ended up in the private sector. RFK took his place on the political scene after McCarthy died, and won election to the Senate seat Jack had contested and lost. Ted won the special election to replace Bobby when the later was appointed Secretary of Labor.
     
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  4. Historyman 14 Well-Known Member

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    In the Land of the Ancients.
    Tricky Dick as head of the FBI?

    [​IMG]
     
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  5. Jürgen Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2016
    A few thoughts I had today about eugenics. I think the eugenics movement will still be going strong, the irony is that it's not USSR, USA or the West Europeans who running the show on that movement. It's likely the Nordics, historical the Nordic countries continued practising (non-racial) eugenics into the seventies, through the increase social liberalism of the post-War periode slowly made it lose support. But here the Nordic are much more cultural isolated, the Americans are horrible, the French are fascist and USSR are communists. So the Nordics are much more inward looking and much more focused on uprise the masses. So we will likely see them practising and researching eugenic on small scale. Free medical ultrasound will likely have resulted in down syndrome almost being unknown in NEZ (even with the disappearance of the eugenic movement, this is still happening, I just think it will happen here decades earlier). Alcoholics, habitual criminals (including prostitutes) and the mental ill are likely forced sterilised on large scale. Homosexuals and other sexual "deviants" are likely offered (and only offered not forced) lobotomy or medical or physical castration, or volunteer to medical research in getting rid of their "condition". So the nicest democratic and most prosperous countries are likely sending report after report about eugenic methods out into the world, including reports about how much money they saves by pushing these policies.
     
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  6. Aaaaasima Well-Known Member

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    Shit is going to hell FAST
     
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  7. Mumby im that bob

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    wandering
    I feel you're pointing this out because we're going to need to get used to it.

    Are things going to start solidifying into a more stable multiparty, or even possibly two party system?
     
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  8. Kovalenko Kova

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    What? Hints? No... *whistles casually*
     
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  9. Gonzo Grumpy Poujadist Norn Person

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    I am enjoying this TL greatly. Though I have one concern - I do hope this doesn't turn into a 'conservatives are evil' TL. It has been really enjoyable up to this point and I hope the TL doesn't go down that path.
     
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  10. Aaaaasima Well-Known Member

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    Jun 1, 2016
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    They had Morgenthau, a Liberal, commit genocide against Germans.

    Besides, are they actually TLs in which the entire premise is "ev0l reagan (small r) eats por ppl!!!11"?
     
  11. Israel Well-Known Member

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    Mar 12, 2016
    Yes, I agree
     
  12. Turquoise Blue Blossoming Tibby!

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    Morgenthau, as said before, committed genocide. There's plenty of evil people on the left and right here.
     
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  13. Kovalenko Kova

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    It's more of a "extremes are horrifying" TL I think. Morganthau arguably came from a "good" place, stopping another holocaust, but murdered millions in the process. Buckley arguably comes from a "sensible place", we need to bring order to this chaos, but you see what he's doing to create "order".
     
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  14. Gonzo Grumpy Poujadist Norn Person

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    True, though he didn't appear to be sowing the seeds of a dictatorship as Dandy Jim is seemingly doing.
     
  15. Kovalenko Kova

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    Dan D. isn't a nice guy. But not because he's a conservative (in the American sense of the word). The "worst" people in this TL identify the problem best, but make an even worse problem by using a terrible method to solve that problem.
     
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  16. Jürgen Well-Known Member

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    Jul 16, 2016
    No he just murdered millions.
     
  17. Gonzo Grumpy Poujadist Norn Person

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    So it's sort of like a doctor who is brilliant at diagnosis; but then gives horrible treatment?
     
  18. Kovalenko Kova

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    I see you have cancer... I'll get the chainsaw then.
     
  19. Indicus Stuff

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    Taft, for one, wasn't so much evil as he was naive and a literal isolationist.
     
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  20. Kovalenko Kova

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    Oddly enough, I think Taft is the closest president we had ITTL to a true "conservative".