TL-191 WI: Union wins 2ACW

What would happen if the Union had won the second Civil War in the TL-191 series? Would they have attempted to reannex the rebellious countries? How would this affect the future of America?
 
What do you mean by 2nd Civil War; do you mean the Second Mexican War (that's what the war was called in How Few Remain)?
 
What would happen if the Union had won the second Civil War in the TL-191 series? Would they have attempted to reannex the rebellious countries? How would this affect the future of America?

The Remembrance ideology wouldn't have taken hold in the US. They would have demanded a few states back as payment for the war. Mexico would still be in one piece. The CS would be weakened and perhaps adopt the remembrace ideology themselves. They would also do everything in their power to avoid another war at all costs, at least up until WW1 if the US isn't satisfied with their victory. US probably tries to reabsorb the CS after WW1.
 
Been a long time since I read the book, but wasn't that war the UK, France, and CSA all teamed up against just the US? That's not really a winnable war for the Union...
 
Been a long time since I read the book, but wasn't that war the UK, France, and CSA all teamed up against just the US? That's not really a winnable war for the Union...

Well, it's possible for them to win, so long as they actually have a plan when they start the war. ICTL, they started the war with the aim of "fighting the Rebs again." There was no overriding strategy, no grand plan such as taking Richmond or Kentucky. And they rejected volunteer troops, thus sacrificing their edge in manpower.

So, basically you need to have the entire Union leadership grow a brain.
 
The Remembrance ideology wouldn't have taken hold in the US. They would have demanded a few states back as payment for the war. Mexico would still be in one piece. The CS would be weakened and perhaps adopt the remembrace ideology themselves. They would also do everything in their power to avoid another war at all costs, at least up until WW1 if the US isn't satisfied with their victory. US probably tries to reabsorb the CS after WW1.
Could you tell me why exactly they would only demand a few states back and not the whole thing? If they still wanted to absorb it in the 1940s (as evidenced by reannexation after WWII), surely they'd want it merely 20 years after the initial secession. Unless I'm missing something?
Been a long time since I read the book, but wasn't that war the UK, France, and CSA all teamed up against just the US? That's not really a winnable war for the Union...
That's easy enough, considering there's not much reason for the UK and France to ally with the CSA, if various threads around here are to be believed. And, with the bad blood between the UK and France around this era, it surprises me that so many put them on the same side so often.
Well, it's possible for them to win, so long as they actually have a plan when they start the war. ICTL, they started the war with the aim of "fighting the Rebs again." There was no overriding strategy, no grand plan such as taking Richmond or Kentucky. And they rejected volunteer troops, thus sacrificing their edge in manpower.

So, basically you need to have the entire Union leadership grow a brain.
Growing a brain is a fairly simply POD. What sort of plans do you think they'd use to defeat the Confederacy in Round Two?
 
Could you tell me why exactly they would only demand a few states back and not the whole thing? If they still wanted to absorb it in the 1940s (as evidenced by reannexation after WWII), surely they'd want it merely 20 years after the initial secession. Unless I'm missing something?

The USA wasn't really hoping to annex the whole CSA at any point. The reason they declared war during the Second Mexican War was to avoid the CSA reaching the Pacific. And it might have been after Kentucky and the Indian territory but nothing more.

If the US won it Kentucky (at least chunks of it) would have been annexed as would the Indian Territory. And it might have supported a Texas independence movement. The CSA would have been pissed but I doubt they would develop a remembrance style philosophy. The would simply move closer to Britain.
The US would likely also support some Mexican Republicans (Diaz maybe?) in deposing Maximilian. And instal a pro-US Mexican government. So the CSA would be surrounded by an American sphere.
I don't know if the CSA already had Cuba by then. If it didn't then it might not have the resources to obtain it.


The re-annexation at the end of WWII was basically punishment for the whole thing (like Germany being split iOTL). The CSA started the Second Great War by attacking the US without a formal declaration of war, and killed a US President during one of these early air raids. There was also the matter of the black holocaust. The US did not trust the CSA could be behave if it stayed independent. And "abolished" it under the pretense of the amount of
 
A Union victory was possible, but they had poor war planning. It still would not have been easy because they had no allies. They certainly weren't going to take control of the entire Confederacy, but they could have given the Confederacy and their allies a black eye.

Scenario 1: Total Union Victory
This scenario is highly unlikely. Even with Germany and Austria-Hungary as allies in the Great War, the Union exhausted itself with having to take Canada and have war with the Confederacy. However, a better war plan might have gotten them close to their goal if they had some success in Canada. However, what is the state of the US Navy? Could the US Navy at the time deal with the navies of Britain, France and the Confederacy at the same time? This is what makes a total Union victory scenario problematic for the Second Mexican War.

Scenario 2: Partial Union Victory
If you go by success in Canada, Britain may want to find a way out of the war and instead push for status quo ante bellum. This would anger the Confederacy because they would be forced to meet Union demands and thus nullifies the purchase of Chihuahua and Sonora. There's also no telling what else would happen, but the Confederacy might still get off light without any territorial concessions to the Union. This scenario kills Remembrance ideology for the Union in the crib and it also effectively severs the alliance between Britain and the Confederacy.

All this said, the Union got off practically light in the Second Mexican War. Apart from some territorial adjustments in Maine, they simply had a case of national humiliation and a bloody nose. The Confederacy very well could have seized New Mexico Territory because they were in a position to do so. However, in Longstreet's view, it would have made the Confederacy appear to be aggressors in the war.

For the British, at least there was some strategic reason for revising the Webster-Ashburton Treaty following the Second Mexican War. It made their lines more secure by adding more territory to New Brunswick. New Mexico Territory in Confederate hands would have added a nice buffer between West Texas and their newly acquired Mexican territories, but there's also the problem created by the fact that the extra territorial acquisition might not have been backed by Britain or France.
 
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