TL-191: Filling the Gaps

With the Canadian election being this past Monday, I have some ideas and questions on how different the state of Canadian politics would be pre-GW1 and post. First with the immediate prewar period: Robert Borden is mentioned as still being the PM during GW1; and in 1911, he came to power after a split in the Liberal Party under Wilfrid Laurier on the issue of freed trade, reducing tariffs, and cultural rapprochement with the United States. Of note, Champ Clark would never utter his wish to see the "American flag will fly over every square foot of British North America up to the North Pole" since since the CSA are state allies with the British Empire, which drove the issue against free trade in favor of the Conservative. But with OTL's relations and cultural animosity, the end results would be the same and the Liberal's may split further as a result.

Now with the US winning the FGW and annexing Canada as a whole, how long would it take for Canadians of various political backgrounds to ultimately accept the US and know the UK was never coming back after the Great Wars? That would mean among the Conservatives, Liberals, and small left wing parties that were the predecessors to the NDP. The Conservatives would react strongly against this the most and would make up the lot of the rebels; the Liberals would be a mixed bag as they had wanted to work with the US, but now their country is gone and the US are their new overlords; left-wingers would perhaps try to cooperate the most IMO through negotiations. Though when Custer becomes the Governor General, Canadians are universally opposed to his heavy-handed rule and have total hatred toward him. Long term once the US tries to make the former provinces into states, it won't be an easy process. A bit of speculation is that the US offers the chance for Canadians to serve in the Armed Forces to become citizens, but there'd still animosity. An idea from David in his After the End thread is that Canadians become the foremost constitutionalist activists in trying to have their rights recognized as US subject and citizens for those born after annexation that ends up working out for them in their favor. What are all your thoughts and opinions on this matter? What are your speculations for long-term rapprochement between the US and their former Canadian subjects when it comes to politics and society, apart from what was mentioned in the books?
They'll probably aim for statehood to be granted the rights in the US constitution. Although the US could always try and flood Canada with settlers or attracting immigrants. Most likely they'll accept the situation and vote for those who are willing to extend the rights to them.
 
More on Canada, how do Afro-Canadians view the situation their country's in during GW1? One the one hand, their country's state allies with a country their ancestors fled from decades prior from slavery. On the other hand, the USA, who tried to abolish slavery and failed to defeat the CSA, invades and ultimately wants to destroy Canada and kick out the British. They're basically in for a conundrum on this issue.
 
What of TTL version of Sultan Mehmed VI, the Three Pashas (Mehmed Talaat, Ismail Enver, and Ahmed Cemal), and Mustafa Kemal?

Also IOTL Ottoman Empire prior to WWI the Sultan was a figurehead and the political power in the Empire was run by the Young Turks lead by the Three Pashas. I assume it would be the same ITTL prior to the FGW. Yet by 1981 with the coronation of Sultan Abdul Hamid III, the political power of the Sultan within the Ottoman Empire is absolute. Was there a coup or something that ended the political power of the Young Turks? (Think of the second question as a crossover with TL-191: After the End.)
 
Where would Edward M. Almond be in the Confederate Army?

In OTL, he graduated VMI in 1915. If he survives the Great War, he'll probably throw his lot with the Freedom Party since his hometown was north of the Rappahannock.
 
Regards to Austria hungry I personally don't think that it should've annexed Serbia since it didn't even plan to OTL . they only plan to punish Serbia but not an annex it. humiliating peace for Serbia is more likely than the Austrian annexation of Serbia turtledove apparently thinks that was a option that Austria would've taken but it's unlikely altogether
 
Regards to Austria hungry I personally don't think that it should've annexed Serbia since it didn't even plan to OTL . they only plan to punish Serbia but not an annex it. humiliating peace for Serbia is more likely than the Austrian annexation of Serbia turtledove apparently thinks that was a option that Austria would've taken but it's unlikely altogether

True. A-H didn't want more land in OTL when it had already enough of doing with its other ethnic groups. They didn't want such headache. But I think that Turtledove didn't realise that when he wrote books. Good example how badly AH writers can do their homneork.

And IMo it is bit unlikely that USA would had been able to re-annex CSA. It had already enough of digesting problems with Canada. And CSA had already been independent 80 years so there would had been quiet strong nationalist feelings. More plausible would had been some level of "Morgenthau Plan<". Perhaps annexing Upper South and making South Carolina "Blakc Republi" for survivors of the genocide. Rest of CSA would had allowed remain independent but de-armed and de-industrialised being under long occupation.
 
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Regards to Austria hungry I personally don't think that it should've annexed Serbia since it didn't even plan to OTL . they only plan to punish Serbia but not an annex it. humiliating peace for Serbia is more likely than the Austrian annexation of Serbia turtledove apparently thinks that was a option that Austria would've taken but it's unlikely altogether
IMO, I think they would've put a member of the House of Obrenovich back onto the throne or put in another noble family friendly to them.
 
True. A-H didn't want more land in OTL when it had already enough of doing with its other ethnic groups. They didn't want such headache. But I think that Turtledove didn't realise that when he wrote books. Good example how badly AH writers can do their homneork.

And IMo it is bit unlikely that USA would had been able to re-annex CSA. It had already enough of digesting problems with Canada. And CSA had already been independent 80 years so there would had been quiet strong nationalist feelings. More plausible would had been some level of "Morgenthau Plan<". Perhaps annexing Upper South and making South Carolina "Blakc Republi" for survivors of the genocide. Rest of CSA would had allowed remain independent but de-armed and de-industrialised being under long occupation.
There weren't enough black survivors for a black republic. I mean if we were to compare the killings in the Turtledove books with OTL, it's far easier to identify someone who is black by just looking at them compared to someone who is Jewish. Then consider the restrictions on black people even before Featherson came to office. The conclusion a number of characters seem to draw in the final book is that to some extent the CSA is rotten to the core with everyone either explicit or implicitly behind Featherson and all he stands for. Given the previous wars annexation might seem the only logical way to prevent another war of revenge.
 
There weren't enough black survivors for a black republic. I mean if we were to compare the killings in the Turtledove books with OTL, it's far easier to identify someone who is black by just looking at them compared to someone who is Jewish. Then consider the restrictions on black people even before Featherson came to office. The conclusion a number of characters seem to draw in the final book is that to some extent the CSA is rotten to the core with everyone either explicit or implicitly behind Featherson and all he stands for. Given the previous wars annexation might seem the only logical way to prevent another war of revenge.
In fairness, Nazi Germany IOTL had a lot more resources to spare to kill 6 million Jews, and an additional year, neither of which the CSA had. In fact 1944 was the year with the highest kill rates in the death camps due to sheer efficiency of the system. In 1944 in TL-191, the CSA would be in the same position that Germany was in OTL in 1945 if we’re being realistic. I’d wager there’s still a few million survivors from the Population Reduction so a Black Republic could be in one of three places: Chihuahua and Sonora (disconnected from the rest of the former CSA due to Texan independence), Louisiana and Arkansas (the only two states not to vote for Featherston in 1933 and undoubtedly suffered because of it) and Cuba (due to the high level of resistance against the Population Reduction).

As far as annexation into the USA goes, I don’t think it’s likely the US annexes all of the Confederacy when they also planned to annex the British and French Caribbean. I have no doubt the African-Caribbean majority population there would not want to be part of the same country as the former CSA. And then there’s holding down both the Confederacy and Canada through military force. The massive levels of resistance would cause costs of the American occupation to skyrocket. Hence I agree that annexing the upper South (Houston, Kentucky, and Seqouyah) plus Tennessee due to a likely high percentage of pro-Union anti-Freedomite people (and anti-Population Reduction by extension), particularly in the eastern half of the state. So annex those four states, grant Chihuahua/Sonora, Arkansas/Louisiana, and Cuba independence, and establish a Morgenthau Plan analogue for the rest of the CSA.
 
A lot sooner than Confederate resistance. I think the US will have a decision to make to annex either one or the other and not both.
I think it's more likely that the USA will at least take Virginia and Tennessee and then spin the rest of the CSA as a puppet republic while gorging itself on that sweet Canadian maple syrup.
 
I recall that Tennesse was explicitly being mentioned to being readmitted to the Union by Senator Taft in 43 prior to his assassination. I think ultra long term the US plans on readmitting all of the former Confederacy, much like eventually Utah was readmitted, but this will likely take decades.

I imagine the Canadian provinces are something the US is eager to formally annex , and admit eventually if for no other reason then formally cement their power, and eventually to crush the Canadian identity and bring them firmly into the American fold and to relieve the needs for occupation forces in the north that are desperately needed in the former Confederacy.

I think the most likely candidates for admission first are the Maritime Provinces. They are explicitly not mentioned as having joined either of the Uprising and being entirely cut off from the rest of Occupied Canada and thus being almost entirely dependent on the United States and Quebec for trade it would lead to eventually knuckling under.

My head Canon has the Republic of Quebec annexing northern New Brunswick and most of the Acadian Coast, with southern New Brunswick and Nova Scotia being annexed and eventually admitted to the Union as the first States (Saint John and Halifax are both critical Ports and Halifax specifically is likely the most northern base for the US Navy and Marine Corps.

Labrador is probably given to Quebec while Newfoundland is kept as an "overseas" territory similar to the Sandwich Islands and Bermuda.
 
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