This world post WWI?

[NomadicSky]

So I was editing a map and thinking about this world. This is June 2, 1921 there's a full blown civil war in North America based out of Winnapeg its still firmly in control of much of the industrial heartlands.

To the south Mexico has been rulled by American communist revolutionaries since 1919, the USSA has a firm grasp on this territory as well. There are pockets within the US under communist control.

The US is holding its own as well and has occupied parts of Latin America, Vennuslua for resources has been jointly occupied.

Ireland is furter divided, Southern Ireland has a pocket occupied by the UK, claimed by the Munster Socialist Republic.

Hungary is larger and has a communist government.

Poland is a large authoritarian dictatorship.

The Turkish goverment based out of Ankara controls far less territory.

Turkey has been divided by Greece, Armenia (USSR puppet), and the UK.

Greece controls Lebanon.

Now what could lead to this world?

 

[Beedok]

Go random desert holdouts in central Asia!

 

[MSZ]

The Second Internationale succeeding in forming a 'unified front' against the war and making communists a more important political force and combined with various other anti-war factionsand making it more appealing to people? It would propably be a start if a communism was to spread to such extent.

This could lead to the various post-war national independence movement taking a turn to the left and not uniting with the 'nationalsts' - would explain Ireland for example, as well as Hungary keeping it's territories through a union with the Slovak Soviet Republic. Fighting with communists could weaken any government in the world, like in Turkey or Japan (this would be extra-difficult though). Greece might get Lebanon in compensation for giving up more of Turkey. Poland has Pilsudski take full power and execute his OTL plans.

Overall, this is extremly unlikely to have happened, regardless of events.

 

[MattII]

Totally ASB, the Russian Civil War wasn't even concluded in 1921 (that only happened in 1923).

 

[Enigmajones]

This map is awesome but a lot of it doesn't seem to make sense. But I have some questions.

1. Are the Canadian Quebec Commies related to the Rustbelt Farmers-Worker Republic?

2.Are they separate entities?

3. Are they ideologically different?

4. How are the British and Canadians handling the Quebec Commies?

5. Whats going on in Quebec City?

6. Are they affiliated in any way?

7. Are the Bear Flag Southern California Commies related to any of the other Communist nation?

8. Are these revolutionaries Chicano in nature?

9. Is it called the Peoples Republic of Aztlan?

I think I have more, but I am genuinely interested in hearing the answers to these questions.

 

[CalBear]

...

Now what could lead to this world?

Three large anchovies pizzas and a sixer right before bedtime?

 

[Kate]

The POD could be a successful Russian Revolution of 1905. A temporary duel power situation then results, with Trotsky running the St Petersburg Soviet and a rival bourgeois liberal regime led by Miluikov (?) competing for control of the disintegrating Russian Empire. A three year long civil war results with Trotsky's Unified Inter-District Socialists dominating the Russian Socialist Union.

The Russian revolutions send shock waves though the world with mass demonstrations and sympathy strikes in many countries.

War between France and Germany nearly breaks out in 1907 over control of Morocco but the crisis is averted.After a few years of initial hostility Germany grows close t0 Soviet Russia and sends massive technical and economic aid.Russian covert aid to the breakaway German Communist Party (KPD) led by Rosa Luxemburg and Karl Liebnicht are overlooked.

A political crisis begins after Trotsky visits Berlin in 1912, makes a fierce anti-capitalist speech creating much embarrassment for the Imperial German government. After months of bickering relations between the two countries break down.

There ensues a complex diplomatic ballet between France and Britain on one hand and Germany on the other as Germany, not without justification, comes to feel its interests are threatened. War breaks out between Germany and France in 1914. Border clashes occur between Russia and Germany in Poland although an uneasy peace holds.

Britain, maintaining its "splendid neutrality" initially stays neutral but as German forces reach the outskirts of Paris Britain feels forced to intervene.

A nine month stalemate ensues as French and British expeditionary Force troops fight a bloody trench warfare against German forces.

Conditions in Paris are dire.Wealthy people have been able to flee the city while the working class arondisments are facing starvation.A crisis ensues as Marshall Foch agrees to a truce while allowing the Germans to continue their blockade of Paris. The Second Paris Commune is proclaimed in May 1915. Solidarity strikes break out all over France.

Fighting between German and Soviet forces break out in Poland. Germany declares the "crushing of Red Terror and the salvation of Christian civilzation" to be among their war aims.

How's this for a start?

 

[MattII]

The Russian revolutions send shock waves though the world with mass demonstrations and sympathy strikes in many countries.

I don't see how this happens, especially in the US, unless it was the blacks doing it, and then the rebellion would be mostly in the southern states, not as much in the northern ones.

War between France and Germany nearly breaks out in 1907 over control of Morocco but the crisis is averted.

Uh, no, the nearest German Colony is Togo, and they don't have any colonies whatsoever in North Africa.

After a few years of initial hostility Germany grows close t0 Soviet Russia and sends massive technical and economic aid.

Why would German give aid to the Soviets?

There ensues a complex diplomatic ballet between France and Britain on one hand and Germany on the other as Germany, not without justification, comes to feel its interests are threatened. War breaks out between Germany and France in 1914. Border clashes occur between Russia and Germany in Poland although an uneasy peace holds.

German went to war with France (Actually, France went to war with Germany) in 1914 due to various treaties, economic issue only came in later.

 

[Jim Smitty]

I think this should go in ASB.

 

[Kate]

I don't see how this happens, especially in the US, unless it was the blacks doing it, and then the rebellion would be mostly in the southern states, not as much in the northern ones.

Uh, no, the nearest German Colony is Togo, and they don't have any colonies whatsoever in North Africa.

Why would German give aid to the Soviets?

German went to war with France (Actually, France went to war with Germany) in 1914 due to various treaties, economic issue only came in later.

Admittedly I wrote this fast without a lot of thought. I got the idea for a Franco-German conflict from the OTL 1906 Morocco crisis when there was the possibility of war between France and Germany. A war might have started with a naval conflict off North Africa which would in turn trigger a European land war.Both countries had allies who in turn had conflicts-Spain, Italy, etc.Europe was a tinderbox waiting to go off.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Moroccan_Crisis

As far as Germany giving aid to the Soviets? Geopolitics and economics. Ideological revulsion aside, it could have been seen as in the best interest of Germany. In OTL there were major elements of the German militarists and the right who sought an alliance w/the SU.The Comintern sent Karl Radek, who after leading (and royally screwing up) an attempt at a German revolution, hob nobbed with the German far right looking for a political alliance.

After the Rapallo Treaty the Reichswehr trained in Russia and there was the Molotov-Ribbentrop alliance. Hitler ended this of course but this wasn't inevitable.Even while Nazi Germany was collapsing elements of the Doenitz short lived regime seriously contemplated a future pro-Soviet direction.

Perhaps in TTL with Kaiser Bill on the throne an alliance with a people who had recently overthrown his cousin would not be super likely, but suppose Nicholas had not been executed but merely sent off to exile in London.Kaiser Bill had something of a competitive/inferiority streak in relation to his royal cousins and economic connections with Russia could have served his ego. Also the German monarch had very briefly toyed with the idea of a "social monarchy" and at times had posed as the defender of native peoples against British imperialism. Bismark had created the first national healthcare system and a social welfare system in reaction to the growing threat of socialism, perhaps Wilhelm would think that a close relation w/a Soviet Russia could have helped buy off the SDP.

In OTL there was massive class conflict and labor unrest in Europe and the US in the period right before WWI. Strike waves in Russia and Germany. The British were faced with a war in Ireland and there was incipient mass unrest in India.

Also its not generally known that there was a wordwide feeling of sympathy with the Russian revolution in OTL. A general strike shut down Seattle. In OTL post WWI period there was a revolutionary wave w/revolutions or near revolutions in Germany, Italy, Hungary and elsewhere.

So I don't think my admittedly not well researched scenario is all that ASB.