Interesting scenario. I've pictured TLs where Bobby survived his own assassination and became President, but never considered one where his presidency is because he survived someone else's assassination.

Question - unless I missed something, who was Bobby's running mate?
 

Deleted member 92121

Nixon could change his residency since he wasn't ba current officeholder. Cheney had to switch from TX to WY in 2000 (and it turned out to be important - he doesn't and we get Bush-Lieberman).
Yeah it makes sense to not have two guys from the same state. A Nixon Reagan ticket was not in the plans though. I think Reagan would never take it. By 1968, it wasneither the presidency or nothing.
 

Deleted member 92121

Interesting scenario. I've pictured TLs where Bobby survived his own assassination and became President, but never considered one where his presidency is because he survived someone else's assassination.

Question - unless I missed something, who was Bobby's running mate?
George Mcgovern from South Dakota. A man much like Bobby Kennedy. One of his biggest supporters.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
My Way

Deleted member 92121

My Way


"For too long has this nation been divided. We have let the color of our skin, and the money in our pockets separate us. Hatred and fear have broken this nation in two sides, each seeing the other as a moral evil and a enemy. We cannot afford to make enemies of our compatriots, for there's true enemies we must fight. I do not speak of a ideology, or a foreign power, I’m talking about a much more dangerous enemy. That enemy is inequality.

The poor are send of to die in mindless conflict, while many profit back home. A Black man is barred from a job, or from a shop, or from a restaurant, where he desires nothing more than work, or spend his money, or even just eat, because of his color. A veteran, who suffered for his country, finds little to no aid when he returns home. These are all problems we must overcome. And we must do it together.

Instead of giving in to fear and pain, we must seek to better our country with love and understanding. The poet Aeschylus once said that Happiness is a choice that requires effort at times, and this is one of those times, for the struggles, we go through will be overcome, and from the smallest seed will spring the mightiest trunk. That is what we Americans dream of, that in the end of our pursuit, we shall find happiness."

Excerpt from Robert F. Kennedy acceptance speech. January 20th, 1969.

...............

It was a cold winter. The room, even with the fireplace burning close to the desk, was still chilly. Of course, in Russia, one is accustomed to such things.

As he sat in his spacious office, he indulged himself some Vodka. It was a small deviation from duty, to drink at work, but not a terrible one. And understandable, considering the cold night. Besides, a man of his station could afford to indulge himself from time to time. As he went through rotine burocratic papers, he felt sleep pile on his eyes. The secretary was preocupied. The situation in Czechoslovakia was tense. Albania had abandoned the pact in protest, and there was little he could do short of an invasion, and that was out of the question. But what was he to do? Allow the deviation from socialist policy that Dubcek had been carrying out? Krushinev had believed in many facets of socialism, and he had fallen. A more centralized economical and political block was needed.

However, the turmoil in Czechoslovakia had left the secretary unsure. He could proceed with the papers he had been drafting. His doctrine. There would be only one socialism. Maybe that would be his legacy, the secretary liked the idea of a well stablished legacy very much.

And then he received a telephone from Washington. The White House. The General Secretary had only spoken to Kennedy very briefly to congratulate him on his victory in the election, days before. He wondered what it was about. Why these calls were always so late? He cursed a little and indulged himself another sip from the Vodka.

When morning arrived, Leonid Brezhnev had a new plan for a legacy, and a headache.


Tales from the Kremlin- Prologue, Georgy Zhulovich

..............


The first year of RFK stay in the White House was a very busy one. His first 100 days were notoriously active. The end to American involvement in the conflict was, of course, his priority. The cornerstone of the democratic campaign was the end to American presence in the conflict. The conflict, Kennedy knew, was going to continue. The government of South Vietnam would continue it's war, and receive monetary and military aid in the form of weapons and other supplies. Americans however, would no longer be dying in the jungles of Southeast Asia. That was his plan.

Of course, many didn't know how or if that plan would come to fruition. Many found it hard to believe that the US would simply pull out of the conflict. Others wondered if it would be a slow process. Some even considered that Kennedy would go back on his promise.

The Soviets had also been wondering.

Some say it was Kennedy himself that came up with the Prague Deal, Other's that it was Vice president McGovern. McNamara stated in his memoir that it was his idea. Regardless, it became one of the biggest victories for the Kennedy administration.

Czechoslovakia had been under occupation by Warsaw pact forces (mostly soviet) since August. The occupation was extremely unpopular, however, both within Czechoslovakia, and in the Warsaw pact itself. In Prague, unrest was only prevented from turning into riot by the threat of Tanks. The Normalization of the country, as the Soviets called it, was not proving successful.

So why not make a trade?

In the night of November 9th, Kennedy called General Secretary Leonid Brezhnev with a offer: The United States would initiate a immediate organized removal from American troops from South Vietnam, and cease all hostilities with North Vietnam. All Americans would be coming home. The fire bombings would stop. The U.S government would also not sell Weapons to the south Vietnamese government (Of course, others supplies were still in the table, and only the government, would not sell weapons). In Exchange, The Warsaw pact would remove it's troops from Czechoslovakia and allow the government of Alexander Dubcek to return to power in the country. The pact would then pledge to respect the legitimacy of his government and of his economic policies.

It would mean a liberalization that Western Europe had no seen in years. A socialist nation, member of the Warsaw pact, would see itself free from military and economic pressure from the USSR. In return, there would be a speedy end to direct American involvement in Vietnam, which would mean a matter of time until the south collapsed to the Viet Cong and the North. A great victory for socialism in Asia.

It would take weeks of negotiation over the phone, but in the end, Brezhnev took the deal.

And so, by mid 1969, all American troops were out of Vietnam, and all soviet troops out of Czechoslovakia.

Around the same time, on July 20 a man named Neil Armstrong would have a very significant walk for mankind on the Moon. The event would mark the accomplishment of JFK's dream. This would not go unnoticed on Bobby Kennedy's speech to the nation shortly thereafter.

Kennedy would start his endeavor for a universal healthcare plan in the same year. All around, the president had not even completed one year on office, and to the American people he had already ended a war, liberated a country, and placed a man on the moon. Kennedy must have felt on top of the world.

And so, as 1968, a year of turmoil had closed, a year filled with hope had taken its place. The American mindset in 1969 was one of positivity.

History of the Democratic Party, from Jackson to Clinton, Michael A. Cormack

..............

rfk-speech.jpg__735x525_q85_crop_subsampling-2_upscale.jpg


image.jpg


Hope everyone enjoys. Next week: Pop culture.
 
So will the US sell/supply weapons to South Korea/Australia and others to give/sell to the South Vietnamese? Will they provide military intelligence to ARVN?
 
Admittedly, I don't know much about Brezhnev, but would he really have gone along with a plan that involved essentially trading away a member of the Warsaw Pact?
 

Deleted member 92121

So will the US sell/supply weapons to South Korea/Australia and others to give/sell to the South Vietnamese? Will they provide military intelligence to ARVN?
Precisely, they can still supply them by using middle men. And while there's no active military involvement, intelligence will certainly be shared with the South. The U.S. will certainly want to give the south everything it still can.

Admittedly, I don't know much about Brezhnev, but would he really have gone along with a plan that involved essentially trading away a member of the Warsaw Pact?
The Brezhnev Doctrine was something he came up in mid november determining that deviation from the economic policies of the USSR would not be tolerated. There could be only one type of socialism, everything else was capitalism. The occupation of Czechoslovakia, however, was very umpopular at this point, and with his policy not yet made known, and with a offer from Kennedy ITTL, he decided to go with another strategy. And Czechoslovakia is still a member of the pact, still allied with the USSR, still socialist. They only now have more political and economical freedom from the soviets. Of course, this is a dangerous precedent to be set.
 
Pop Culture Super Fun Time-I

Deleted member 92121

Pop Culture Super Fun Time-I

John Lennon and Jimi Hendrix announce new band

Almost a year after the beatles disbanded, Superstar John Lennon announced he's starting a new partnership with none other than famous guitarist Jimi Hendrix. Their new band, The Abbey and the Watchtower, is due to release its new album by august of this year. A massive event in the world of music, Lennon and Hendrix first became aquainted with each other after they both attended President Kennedy's Victory party. Both had been influential voices among young voters and certainly convinced more then a few to support the democratic candidate turned president.

Washington Herald, June 2nd, 1969

...............

Star Trek renewed for season 4

After much speculation it has been announced thet a new season of star trek will be premiering next year. Fans around the globe can relax, as the space adventures of Captain Kirk and the crew of the Enterprise will continue. The show had been under serious threat from cancelation, but, according to show creator and showrunner Gene Roddenberry, the incoming moon landing and the President's support for a continuous space program, changed the network's mind. We have a president that has show tremendous support for space exploration, and we will be getting a man on the moon soon, mark my words! It's no surprise people want to continue to see a show that could be showing us our future, and it could be earlier then you think!" A bold statement that certainly reflects the otimism that Roddenberry and the show as a hole have about the future.

New York Times, February 25th, 1969
...............



It was a beautiful day of spring, April had just started and with it the heat you could only feel in the south. He sat on his house, in front of his Television set, as comercials went on.

It had been seven years. Seven years since he had seen a stage. Seven years since the public had shouted his name in masses. He was married now, he had a daughter, things had changed. He had gotten bad news last month, his songs were on record lows. No one seemed to care about Love me Tender anymore. What was he doing now? Nothing, absolutely nothing.

He took a look outside, a nice day on Tenessee and he was wasting it. Priscilla was outside with Lisa Marie, just a couple of months old, and he, as usual, was doing nothing. He needed to do something, a comeback maybe. But come back to what? Music had changed, and he seemed like a joke now, a old Relic from the 1950's. It was 1968 now and people only cared about those damm brits!

He would be dammed if he was just forgotten, he wasn't even 35 yet for jesus sake! He went back to his Television set and started to flick the channels, Then he landed on some Breaking News. Bobby Kennedy was coming out of the hospital. It had been a terrible tragedy, the shooting at the Reverend's Funeral. and the killer, they said was from Memphis, his town. That made him very angry. But now it seemed thet Bobby Kennedy was about to make a annoucement.

-Priscilla, honey, get in here!!

His wife came in with Lisa Marie on her arms. He turned on the volume.......

God damm that Kennedy can talk. And look at that crowd, colored folk mostly, considering the circumstances it was to be expected, and there was nothing wrong with it. He knew Kennedy was a big supporter of colored movement, and so was he.

People were hypnotized, people adored him, and he could make a change....

The King though for a moment, the man was only a decade older then him and he was going to be president, probably!

- Honey, could you hand me the phone please? I need to talk to Tom.

She looked puzzeled

-What could you possibly want with the Colonel in a sunday Elvis?

-I just had a idea honey, maybe it's time for some change huh?


Hell, if even Reagan could do it, why not him?
.............
Next weekend: Kennedy's second and third years, a curious gubernatorial election, a heart attack and who knows?!?! Comments and thoughts aways apreciated.

1968-06-3.jpg
 
I can't see this deal. I could see an agreement for neutralization of Vietnam, with an end to Soviet supply of the North, and an end of US involvement with the South. I could see a negotiation for a coalition government as found in Laos. The Soviets were getting fidgety about simply ending the war too, Ho Chi Minh even came to the point of being willing to let South Vietnam exist but he had no actual power, and the Chinese are another issue. The US would think they would have to work against them, but the North Vietnamese loathed the Chinese, and the US was ignorant of the fact that the Chinese being overtly involved was to them like a nuclear war was to the US. It was a horrible thing to be avoided, and it is therefore not likely the Vietnamese would go all in with China for lack of Soviet support, thus leading to a very much war effort against the South, which therefore lends to negotiation. A fanatic, as the North Vietnamese were, can sacrifice his life but he cannot do much heroic fighting without bullets in his gun. I could even see withdrawal of ground forces from Vietnam while these negotiations were ongoing. I cannot see letting the South fall with a "yoink".
 

Deleted member 92121

@olavops, what's the composition of the United States Senate and House of Representatives at this time?

P.S. Thought that was Walter Mondale in the pic.
We have 243 democrats and 192 Republican in the House of Representatives.
In the Senate there are 57 democrats and 43 Republicans.
This is just as it was OTL, but will change with the 1970 midterm elections. Right now the democrats are in one of those rare posituons where they have a majority in house senate and even whiter house.
Ps: I see the similarity between the King and Mondale.

I can't see this deal. I could see an agreement for neutralization of Vietnam, with an end to Soviet supply of the North, and an end of US involvement with the South. I could see a negotiation for a coalition government as found in Laos. The Soviets were getting fidgety about simply ending the war too, Ho Chi Minh even came to the point of being willing to let South Vietnam exist but he had no actual power, and the Chinese are another issue. The US would think they would have to work against them, but the North Vietnamese loathed the Chinese, and the US was ignorant of the fact that the Chinese being overtly involved was to them like a nuclear war was to the US. It was a horrible thing to be avoided, and it is therefore not likely the Vietnamese would go all in with China for lack of Soviet support, thus leading to a very much war effort against the South, which therefore lends to negotiation. A fanatic, as the North Vietnamese were, can sacrifice his life but he cannot do much heroic fighting without bullets in his gun. I could even see withdrawal of ground forces from Vietnam while these negotiations were ongoing. I cannot see letting the South fall with a "yoink".
Well, the thing is, ending american troop involvment in Vietnam was ITTL the democrats major promise. This coupled with the opportunity to strike a major win for his administration within the first 100 days, plus the chance of weakening the Warsaw Pact in a unprecedented way by having the USSR back down on Czechoslovakia.....it was just too good.
Besides, they're not just abandoning South Vietnam. They will srill send a lot of supply, investment from both public and private sectors, military advisors, covert intel on the north, and have their allies supply the country with weapons. You bring very good points with the Chinese, but i believe that the situation by november 1968 was very different from, say, 1970. Brezhnev wasnt going to back down by then and end support for the North. And he wasnt going agree to pull troops from Czechoslovakia AND face anything but a PR victory in southeast asia.
 
Kennedy advocated for Universal Basic Income back then AFAIK Daniel Patrick Moynihan thought it was good to avoid the alienation of Black (and all races') fathers from their families due to incorrect implementation of welfare.

Whethet this happens ITTL is up to @olavops.
 

Deleted member 92121

Kennedy advocated for Universal Basic Income back then AFAIK Daniel Patrick Moynihan thought it was good to avoid the alienation of Black (and all races') fathers from their families due to incorrect implementation of welfare.

Whethet this happens ITTL is up to @olavops.
Do you mean Guaranteed Minimal Income? Because im aware that Moyniham was a big supporter of that and spoke to Nixon about it multiple times IOTL. I did think about it but don't know if its viable. Kennedy is arleady trying to pass a universal Healthcare bill. I will talk about it eventualy, thats for certain.
 
Do you mean Guaranteed Minimal Income? Because im aware that Moyniham was a big supporter of that and spoke to Nixon about it multiple times IOTL. I did think about it but don't know if its viable. Kennedy is arleady trying to pass a universal Healthcare bill. I will talk about it eventualy, thats for certain.

Oh yes, GMI. Moynihan wanted that. Amazing developments in your TL :)

E
 
Do you mean Guaranteed Minimal Income? Because im aware that Moyniham was a big supporter of that and spoke to Nixon about it multiple times IOTL. I did think about it but don't know if its viable. Kennedy is arleady trying to pass a universal Healthcare bill. I will talk about it eventualy, thats for certain.

Oh yes, GMI. Moynihan wanted that. Amazing developments in your TL :)
 
Let it be

Deleted member 92121

Let it be

By the beggining of 1970, the Kennedy administration seemed to have a bright future ahead. The victories of 1969 had been plentyful, and the president hoped to continue the course. In the minds of many, the new dacade would be one of great accomplishments, both for America and for the world. The war was over, man had landed on the moon, a young charismatic president was sitting in office, one that seemed to care for the people. What would the 1970's bring? A man on Mars? World Peace? Who knew?! But everyone wanted to find out.

When it comes to the future, they would, as aways, find out.

The Hopes and dream of the 1970's - Prologue, Will Clinton
..............

By 1970 the Universal Healthcare bill had been fully drafted. It had taken a while, as Kennedy made sure it pleased the party leadership. It would be landmark legislation. Another piece of democratic landmark legislation. One the late president Kennedy had wanted. Of course, the Republicans didn't like it.

Nixon's defeat had left the party broken and bitter. The 1968 RNC had been a historical mess between the progressives and the conservatives. Now, it seemed that a more progressive stance would be what it took for the party to gain power. Progressive legislature was the way for the Republicans to gain popularity in this changing times.

But it would be on their administration, and sure as hell not in Kennedy's.

And so, the Republican party stood like a stonewall against the Healthcare Bill. But what did that matter? Kennedy surely thought that as 1970 rolled in. The democrats had the White house, the senate, the House of Representatives. The democratic party had more then enough men to pass the Bill. And, when it passed, all would be well for them, as they secured their position in defense of civil rights and rolled on by midterms better then ever. That kind of thinking was a bit naive of course.

Regardless of how the popular opinion, or the administration mood, was faring, by 1970 all was not well within the democratic party.

"A foolish Bostonian child who has been undermining everything this party has stood for. A enemy of the southern man, and a enemy of the southern way of life. Such a man cannot be called a democrat!"

This bold words from a democratic congressman from South Carolina expressed quite well the general views of many southerners when it came to RFK. These so called Dixiecrats weren't any news. They had opposed Kennedy since his early campaign. In the DNC, where Kennedy was pitted against Eugene McCarthy, many had refused to show up. Neither candidate suited their ideology. And when the party nominated Kennedy, and shifted strongly towards a civil rights stance, the outrage and frustration was palpable.

The awnser of the south to this frustration came in the form of George Wallace. A former democrat, and a stauch segregationist his whole life, Wallace would abandon the party in 1968 and join the new American Independent Party. Running on a promisse of defending Segregation, Wallace would carry no less then 6 states, stablishing the AIP as a force to be reckoned with in the former democratic stronghold that was the south.

And so, and 1969 rolled on, and then 1970, many Dixiecrats would slowly but surely begin to abandon the democratic party.

It was a midterm year, a year where senators, congressmen, and many governors would either remain in their seats or take the boot. And well, standing by a president not many(including themselves) seemed to like in their districts was not a very attractive option.

It would be a exageration, to say that most southern democrats left the party. Most stayed. And most did everything they could to make Bobby Kennedy's administration suffer. Teaming up with republicans on their opposition to the bill, they would stand resolute on their decision.

And so, after months of filibustering, backdoor deals, favor calling, rousing and agressive speeches, and every other sort of dramatic gesture a politician's mind could come up with, the bill failed. The unholy alliance of disgruntled democrats and republicans ensured that it would fail. It was a great blow to Kennedy, as the president devoted much of his time to fighting for the bill. House Majority leader Carl Albert, one of the biggest supporter's of the bill proclaimed it the greatest failure of his carrer.

A busy year for the Democrats, 1970 would see a unique figure join the party ranks in Tennessee. The figure would be, of course, Elvis Presley.

History of the Democratic Party, from Jackson to Clinton, Michael A. Cormack
.............

Elvis is running for Governor!

Elvis Presley, has announced this wednesday that he will be seeking the governor's chair in the 1970's election. You read it right ladies and gentlemen, the King want to become a politician. According to him, the idea of entering politics has been floating on his mind for a couple of years, "I desire to make a change, i was once a musician, now i want to make people's life better in another way, and so, i announce with great pride, that i will be seeking the position of Governor of Tennessee come this November."

And the King has wasted no time, as he arleady registered as a democrat. This is certainly a historical day, as one of the most famous singers on the planet, decides he will sing no more.

Los Angeles Times, March 3rd, 1970
...........

The room was very large. It had been a very warm day followed by a very cold night. A typical summer day in Beijing.

At the center of the Room rested his bed, a spacious and confortable squared thing, it had given him many pleasant nights. He lay in it with a small smile on his face and his hands crossed over his chest. It looked like he was having a good dream, perhaps imagining a perfect future for all of China.

He was also dead.

At a corner of the Room sat a thin man on military regalia. He smoked a cigarete and stared at the dead man in the bed.

There was a knock on the door

A woman came in, she had large glasses on her face, and a face that could freeze a vulcano.

-Madam Mao, it is a sad day for all of China, he spoke.

- It truly is Marshal Lin.

She looked at her husband lying in the bed, then down to the ground.

- I took the liberty of moving him to a more...serene position, i thought that was like you would want to see him.

- I thank you for your kindness Marshal Lin. may i have a few moments alone with my husband now? She spoke with a voice that matched her face.

- Of course Madam. I'l leave you with him, take as long as you need, but please consider that we have much to discuss, this is a historical ocasion.

She looked at him with her stone face for a second, then smiled a pleasant smile

-Of couse Vice-Chairman, she paused, Chaiman Lin, China will need us both at this moment of sorrow.

As Lin Biao left the room, he signaled at the guard to let no one in and no one out of the building whithout his consent. He finished his cigarete.

It will need us both, he agreed, thinking to himself in the dark corridor. For now.
.............
Surprise ninja update attack! So, drink a shot everytime you read the word democrat! You will not end up standing.
I decided to leave 1971 and midterm election results for the next update, as i had a lot to cover on this one. Also, im really enjoying this personal views at characters. What do you guys think of them?
Anyway, Hope averyone is enjoying it.
 
Top