PLEASE NO Giovanna, do you not remember what happened to Catherine of Valois? Or many of the queen dowagers throughout history who got...reattached during their widowhood??? They lost the regency(if there was one), royal children, and stepchildren as well...please treasure Catherine, Joanna, and Charles more that your new boyfriend...
There and Back Again: The English Journeys of Catherine of Aragon
- Thread starter Awkwardvulture
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English Dowager Queens were almost never regents and Henry is an adult so Giovanna do not risk to lose the children, unless Henry decided that and is unlikely who Henry would deprive her totally of contact with them
Oh she definitely will, and Giovanna won't be nearly as lonely.. Thank you so much!
Oh yes it is, though it is likely that they would've met several times before this (though under different circumstances of course) Things should work out for them but we'll see. Thank you very much!
Hahha, this won't be quite so bad. Firstly there's no risk of them having children, given Giovanna's been going through menopause. Secondly, she's a bit more discreet given that she wants to be out of all the drama that's going on. Still, we will find out just how this new relationship affects things in England one day. Thank you!
Don't worry too much, Giovanna is not so reckless. It's a valid concern though, and one that she herself has, which is why she's going to be discreet. Thank you so much for your insights!
This is true, and while Henry would no doubt be unhappy if he found out, we're not quite sure how he would react...
Cast Choices for Anthony and the Dowager Queen
Anthony and the Dowager Queen (c.1949)
Kirk Douglas as Anthony Wingfield
Titina De Fillipo as Giovanna of Naples
Catherine never had the regency, and her relationship with Owen probably started after Henry VI was no longer living with her.
This is likely correct, and as Giovanna is the stepmother of the King, rather than his mother, her seeking romantic companionship after being a widow for years isn't quite as much of a big deal, and as she's generally away from court, it'll be easier to keep the secret. Thank you for your input!
Menopause at 35? Seems quite early in my opinion. Hopefully she doesn't have an unexpected child if it's been misdiagnosed somehow.
It is early yes, but not implausible as earlier menopause has been known to occur, especially in women with high amounts of stress. Giovanna's eldest son John did die after all, and her second husband died not long after the birth of young Charles. Thank you very much for your insights!
Just hoping that it doesn't become some sort of plot armor really. How well were medical experts' understanding of the concept in the 16th century anyways?
At the very least it was known that women had to be menstruating in order to fall pregnant and that menstruation stopped at a certain age.
They generally seemed to know that if a woman is no longer menstruating without being pregnant that means there were either some problems or they were in menopause, in this case it's the latter.
Yeah, while medical knowledge wasn't as great back then they at least knew that.
Chapter 68, March 1514
Richmond Palace, Kingdom of England, March 1514
Johanne looked upon her with worry plain on her face,“Milady, you must rest!”
As she waddled towards the closed door, Eleanor snapped at her chief lady,”You would be wise not to use such a word towards your Queen.”
After trying to open the locked door in vain, she pounded it with her fist several times, and turned around, a sneer on her face,”Why is it locked?” Am I to be confined to my rooms like a common prisoner?!”
The older woman across from her took a breath,”No, because prisoners do not have people to attend upon them my Queen, and they seldom ever have children in their bellies to think about. Now please, calm yourself so that we may all have some peace.”
Eleanor laughed sardonically at this, and turned around, eyebrows knitted in a scowl,”Why? So that my husband can fuck that old whore Anne Stafford in peace?”
A smirk came across her face for a brief moment,”I tell you that he will not know peace while he shares a bed with her.”
She then pounded the door even harder, blood slowly trickling out of her knuckles, and shouted,”Do you hear me Henry you bastard?! You will not have any peace when you are with her!”
Eleanor felt a tug on her left sleeve, and she turned around, livid, to find Doortje easing her away from the door,”Eleanor please, have a care for the baby.”
Nobody cares for me, or how my heart breaks, I’ve had enough of this! Without any warning she slapped the girl hard on the cheek with her right hand, screaming,”Get your fucking hand off of me!”
Doortje yelped as she stumbled backward onto the floor, and even Eleanor herself was shocked by what she had just done. The reaction to this from Doortje's sisters, mother and the other ladies was also that of surprise, with Johanne closing her eyes for a moment to compose herself. Doortje for her part stayed on the floor, snuffling as a few tears fell down her face. Eleanor shook her head, guilty that she lashed out in such a way,”Doortje, I am so sorry. It was most unfair of me to strike you.”
The young woman nodded as she moved to get back on her feet, and the Queen of England began to feel some relief, that was at least until the moment she felt something hot and wet slide down her legs. Shaking, she gripped a table to keep herself from falling, and eyes wide in terror asked,”What is happening now?”
Johanne rushed forward, holding Eleanor in her arms to keep her on her feet,”I believe that you are beginning to have your child my Queen.”
She paused to look over her shoulder to the others,”Martijna, fetch the birthing stool, Caroljin go send word to the King that it has begun.”
Eleanor had never felt so scared in her entire life, and squeezed Johanne’s hand,”Do you think the baby and I will live?”
The older woman stroked her hair, gently hushing the girl,”You will be fine, I promise you that everything will be alright.”
…
Fortune would have it that Johanne’s assurances were correct. The birth was of course painful, and rather difficult, but Eleanor thought it all worth it as she held her little son in her arms. She gazed upon the baby’s soft, pink skin as he slept and whispered,”Henry, Duke of Cornwall, and one day, God willing, you will be Henry the Ninth.”
A soft knocking sound entered her ears, and despite her fatigue, she lifted her head up to see how would enter. Slowly peeking his head in, was her husband, who, until this moment she had loved and hated in equal measure. Eleanor could see him mouth something, as if to say Is it safe to enter? Johanne nodded her head, green gabble hat fixed perfectly in place despite recent events, and so he entered. He came across the room faster than she would’ve expected, lowered himself, and, to her surprise, kissed her on the head several times before looking at their son. Grinning, he praised her,”Oh Eleanor, you’ve done it. We have a son, a perfect little boy.”
Eleanor smiled a little at this, satisfied to hear him speak her praises. After pausing for but a moment, Henry grimaced a little,”I am sorry if I have distressed you as of late. I hope it will please you to know that Anne Stafford is no longer my mistress.”
Tears blurred her vision, and for once, they were tears of gratitude,”Oh Henry.”
Husband and wife would spend the rest of the evening bonding over the arrival of their newborn son, and, despite their pride, apologized to each other for all the mutual slights that had occurred over the last month.
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Not to be presumptuous, but could we maybe see giovanna visit eleanor to see the new baby and give her advice sometime soom?
Why thank you, I'm glad to see that you liked it 😀! Henry, as you can imagine is very happy with his young wife right now.
Oh no problem, I'm happy to take suggestions any time! I was just thinking of that actually, so we may see a visit soon...
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