The Whale has Wings

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Hyperion

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Why not just get Mac KIA during his escape. Let his son and wife get out alive, but have him take a bullet or fall overboard during an air raid or something.

He goes out fighting, and his reputation doesn't take as much of a beating, and Roosevelt is free to hand the Pacific off to Nimitz, who can then manage the lower level generals and admirals. If another three or four star Army officer shows up, that person can still be placed under Nimitz.
 
Well that's just rude and unjustified.

I have to agree; Astrodragon has been more than happy to correct errors and ommissions and take on board ideas and information provided by other posters, to suggest that an error like mentioning the Yubari after hit had been sunk makes the thread ASB is frankly ridiculous.
 
Can a moderator please move this thread to the ASB section.

Hyperion...CHILL OUT!:mad:

There are very active threads out there that make this one look like a Ameri-wank/Britscrew.:rolleyes: If THEY haven't been moved to ASB, THIS one certainly won't be. YES, "Whale" is a Britwank.(1a) I don't think anyone can seriously argue that, other than those who simply refuse to accept the word "wank" in usage for any TL they like that isn't in the ASB Forum. But this TL is NOT an Ameriscrew.(1b)

1a) I love a good Britwank. The key word being "good". This is the best out there today IMVHO.

1b) There are Britwank/Ameriscrews on this site so virulent they have alienated everyone out there save for the most jingoistic Anglophiles/Ameriphobes.

YES, Astrodragon has engaged in some ribbing of the US, but he has NOT done so with a sense of deliberate cruelty and malevolence. If ever there was a time that the US could be given some ribbing, it was early in 1942.

Oh, and for someone else out there who likes poems (you know who you are):

We're the battling bastards of Bataan
No mama, no papa, no Uncle Sam
No aunts, no uncles, no cousins, no nieces
No pills, no planes, no artillery pieces
and nobody gives a goddamn!


Not all Americans that fought in WWII were overpaid, oversexed, over there, and having an easy time of it while their allies did all the fighting.

I first heard that poem from the lips of Sir Laurence Olivier (by far the 20th century's greatest actor).:cool:

Hyperion, I think you know of what I am writing of. Astrodragon has thus far not engaged in vilifying the United States. There's plenty of that around to be found in the Forum. This thread is NOT one of those places.:mad::cool:

EDIT: Ninja'd by perfectgeneral
EDIT2: Let's not let this become a mass bullying exercise against Hyperion, either, people. Those can get extremely ugly. Opinions are supposed to be tolerated, unless this is moved to the Author's Forum. Then it's shut up and read.:p
EDIT3: Ninja'd by Garrison, too!:eek:
 
This isn't the first time something like this has happened regarding this thread being ASB,a few people have left the thread or deleted their posts as well. AS a whole I can't see any part of this being ASB, the story right now is only what a few months into the American's joining the war?

Almost ever mistake make by the Americans at this juncture had happened in OTL and actualy has had a few reduced or removed completely. I don't see it as an Amer-screw just because a few things have changed for the better or worse?

Hyperion- the story has followed a war that began in 1939 as in OTL and the changes have been enough to allow at least some improvement in the British Empire's combat theatres. Right now the United States Military is gearing up and obviously will cause serious damage but not yet, have patience.
 
While poor transatlantic escorts they could work as coastal escorts.

That is exactly what they are being tasked for (its already in the next update!). Only a few so far, but getting even a few in operation out of reserve in 3 months is very good going. On the US Coastal area their short range and poor AA arent such a problem.
 

Hyperion

Banned
I have to agree; Astrodragon has been more than happy to correct errors and ommissions and take on board ideas and information provided by other posters, to suggest that an error like mentioning the Yubari after hit had been sunk makes the thread ASB is frankly ridiculous.

Very well, my apologies to everyone.

That being said, I still consider it a showing of poor research.

It looks bad on Astro, and while it doesn't really ruin the story overall, it's a showing of poor research.

I know the US isn't the military jugernaut in 1942 that it became by 1944 and 1945, either, and I don't really have a problem with that. But seeing stuff basically cut and pasted from wikipedia or hyperwar does somewhat cheapen the quality.
 
I'm afraid a certain amount of cut n paste of OTL stuff is pretty much a necessity. This is a part time thing for me, trying to research ALL of WW2 is simply impossible. So I spend the creative time on the new stuff (in particualr the RN stuff), and use the filler to flesh out the TL and show whats going on elsewhere.

I think perhaps you are being overoptimistic if you expect stories posted here to be perfect in detail. That is, after all, while published books have editors and proofreaders, and they still come with mistakes.
 
Re the 8th Division, they were not conscripts or Militia. They were Australian Imperial Force (AIF), volunteers fot overseas service. Under Australian law at the time, the only permanent forces the Commonwealth Govt could maintain were artillery, instructional and some support. Everyone else was Militia which could only serve within Aust, territory. (This went back to Federation in order to make sure that London could'nt simply order Aussie troops wherever.) Thus a new seperate force, the AIF, had to be raised for o/s service.
The Milita were a mix of conscripts and volunteers and most not that well trained at this point.
 
I'm afraid a certain amount of cut n paste of OTL stuff is pretty much a necessity. This is a part time thing for me, trying to research ALL of WW2 is simply impossible. So I spend the creative time on the new stuff (in particualr the RN stuff), and use the filler to flesh out the TL and show whats going on elsewhere.

I think perhaps you are being overoptimistic if you expect stories posted here to be perfect in detail. That is, after all, while published books have editors and proofreaders, and they still come with mistakes.

One thing I have always found to be a make or break of a good timeline is whether or not the author is ready and willing to accept corrections from his/her readers. Something like this, with the huge scope of the story is always going to have continuity errors and other mistakes the author fails to catch. The key thing is, do you go back and correct it? So far it seems you are willing to do this, and take on board comments, criticisms and suggestions from others (even if they are as snarky as hell- yes Hyperion, I'm referring to you). I think this is one of the key reasons why this is probably my favourite timeline on the board so far- well written and with an engaging author. I wonder how long before you have to split this into a second thread- you're closing in on 7000 comments!
 
I'm afraid a certain amount of cut n paste of OTL stuff is pretty much a necessity. This is a part time thing for me, trying to research ALL of WW2 is simply impossible. So I spend the creative time on the new stuff (in particualr the RN stuff), and use the filler to flesh out the TL and show whats going on elsewhere.

I think perhaps you are being overoptimistic if you expect stories posted here to be perfect in detail. That is, after all, while published books have editors and proofreaders, and they still come with mistakes.


Forget about him.

He did exactly the same thing on my T/L too. He used similar insulting and abusive language.

Later he sent me a PM apologizing but I didn't think he was worth a reply.
 
One thing about Mac you might have some of his financial dealing with the P.I. government come to light when he tries to get out some of his money, gold type, and it comes to light when a crate breaks open in Australia. This could be due to one of his subordinates, not him specifically doing it but just could make FDR and the U.S. Army high command decide that he might be more useful in a state side billet like head of training.
 
This isn't the first time something like this has happened regarding this thread being ASB,a few people have left the thread or deleted their posts as well. AS a whole I can't see any part of this being ASB, the story right now is only what a few months into the American's joining the war?

Astrodragon is open to suggestions of improvement, and corrections to possible error. You don't get the impression here that the ending has already been written with no middle yet and come hell or high water how you get to that ending. That's why this TL has been such a thrill to read.

And yes, I consider the survival of the USS Langley, that old converted carrier/seaplane tender, to be a perfect example of where this TL is going. Even-handedness, Allied victory, but with an British accent.:) Astrodragon could easily have gone the OTL route, and bombed the poor old ship out of existence. And sadly, it appears there are those around here who would have cheered such a thing happening.:(

Almost ever mistake make by the Americans at this juncture had happened in OTL and actualy has had a few reduced or removed completely. I don't see it as an Amer-screw just because a few things have changed for the better or worse?

There are plenty of Ameriscrews out there. Trust me, it's not JUST that Astrodragon is denying it is. It is that HE practices what he preaches.:)

Astrodragon isn't denying the self-evident nature of this Britwank. A POD where Britain starts a much better more sensible naval air policy as far back as 1932 is not ASB and obviously is going to produce better results for the Empire.:cool: Especially in the opening days of the Pacific War, where such superior British naval air power can REALLY make itself felt to a strategic level not seen before ITTL.:cool:

What I find soothing in Astrodragon's brilliant work is that ITTL British victories give birth to other non-British Allied victories, and even aid eventually in Soviet (more L-L routes/early Second Front?) victories. As I've said before, IITL, the day Bradley liberates Paris, and Stalin's crossing the Belarus/Polish frontier, will NOT be the day Monty takes Berlin.:D

Hyperion- the story has followed a war that began in 1939 as in OTL and the changes have been enough to allow at least some improvement in the British Empire's combat theatres. Right now the United States Military is gearing up and obviously will cause serious damage but not yet, have patience.

Seconded.
 
One thing I have always found to be a make or break of a good timeline is whether or not the author is ready and willing to accept corrections from his/her readers. Something like this, with the huge scope of the story is always going to have continuity errors and other mistakes the author fails to catch. The key thing is, do you go back and correct it? So far it seems you are willing to do this, and take on board comments, criticisms and suggestions from others (even if they are as snarky as hell- yes Hyperion, I'm referring to you). I think this is one of the key reasons why this is probably my favourite timeline on the board so far- well written and with an engaging author. I wonder how long before you have to split this into a second thread- you're closing in on 7000 comments!

Seconded here too. BTW, the Yubari was nearly sunk at Wake, and two destroyers WERE lost. It was the only bright light for Americans in the war until the Doolittle Raid. Hence, that little cruiser's name is a lot more memorable to an American history buff than it would be to a British one. Sort of like an American trying to remember a history of a KM light cruiser like the Leipzig. A British history buff would know the details much better, most likely.

For British WWII War Against Japan history buffs, they would naturally tend to concentrate on SE Asia and India, with much less attention on China, little to none on the Pacific. The reverse being true for Americans, save for American involvement in the CBI regarding air power, L-L, Merrill's Marauders, etc.

If one light cruiser is the only mistake Astrodragon has made so far, he's doing about a grade of 99.9% I'd say.:)
 
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